Conflict between Palestine and Israel escalates

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Hades

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Trump fans have always insisted Trump was a uniquely peaceful president. This required ignoring unwelcome information such as Trump killing an Iranian general because he needed a distraction from his impeachment, or ignoring how he emboldens Putin's aggression. Another method was to deny Biden's achievement to highlight how supposedly unique Trump is. Biden might not have started any new war, and unlike Trump he actually ended one, but they argue that Putin invading Ukraine during his term was essentially the same as Biden personally starting that war(for some reason.

Okay. Fair enough. So now Bibi is starting a war under Trump's term those same people will hold Trump directly responsible for this right?....right?!
 

Gergar12

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Come again?
Iran is the only large and powerful country in the Middle East that still wants to fight Israel, or at least force it to give concessions to them, and the Palestinians, and is more of a geopolitical enemy than an ideological one. Everyone has either given up. But there is this idea that they are Islamic, so they hate Israel, Shia, so they hate Israel, or just authoritarian, so they hate Israel. This is false. Democracy has nothing to do with it. A democratic government in Iran may be more willing to fight Israel.
 

Agema

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Trump fans have always insisted Trump was a uniquely peaceful president.
He's definitely not, but I could accept that in contrast to his attitude of bombastic militarism, Trump has been relatively shy when it comes to military action itself. I am not entirely sure why. It could be that he sees it as an area where, should things go wrong, he'll take lot of damage.

More unkindly, I wonder whether it's because... well, he's a pussy. Like maybe the military are his idea of a "real man" - but deep down he knows he is most definitely not one. And so whilst on the one hand he lionises the military, acts tough and wants to be thought to be like them, in truth the real deal makes him feel insecure and weak.

Okay. Fair enough. So now Bibi is starting a war under Trump's term those same people will hold Trump directly responsible for this right?....right?!
<sigh> Of course not.

Almost no-one anywhere on the political spectrum is honest about violence. Violence is basically made okay by it being
a) By one's friends
b) With aims one supports
c) Successful.

Americans were all for Iraq and Afghanistan... whilst it was a roflstomp. When it dragged into an endless occupation with no end in sight and no obvious win, that's when they turned against it. Now there is a vein of the right which is genuinely hostile to military action outside strictly defensive purposes. But a load of them who are sort of anti-intervention after the Iraq/Afghanistan downer will be right back screaming "WOO-HA U! S! A!" the minute a Republican president offered them a suitable roflstomp to get behind.
 

Thaluikhain

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Presumably the genocide in Palestine is getting old and stale, they need someone else to bomb. Attacking someone that can fight back might not be the best move, though.
 

XsjadoBlaydette

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Exclusive: US quietly sent hundreds of Hellfire missiles to Israel before Iran attack
Hellfire missiles would have been used for precision strikes by Israel during Iran attack, US officials say
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A building damaged in an Israeli strike on Tehran, on 13 June 2025 (Atta Kenner/AFP)

The US quietly delivered hundreds of Hellfire missiles to Israel before its unprecedented attack on Iran on Friday, Middle East Eye can reveal.

The US sent around 300 Hellfire missiles to Israel on Tuesday in a large-scale stock-up of supplies before its attack, and as the Trump administration was saying it was ready to continue engaging Iran in nuclear talks.

The transfer of such a large quantity of Hellfires suggests that the Trump administration was well-informed of Israel’s plans to attack the Islamic Republic of Iran, two US officials told MEE on the condition of anonymity.

The US’s delivery of Hellfires or other large quantities of weapons in the lead up to Friday’s attack has not been previously reported.

The US military helped shoot down Iranian missiles that were headed towards Israel, two US officials told Reuters on Friday.

Hellfires are laser-guided air-to-ground missiles. They would not be useful for Israel to bomb Iran’s nuclear facilities, but for precision strikes.

Israel’s military used more than 100 aircraft in its attack on Friday, which used precision tracking to target senior military officials, nuclear scientists, and command centres.

“There is a time and place for Hellfires. They were useful to Israel,” one senior US defence official told MEE.
Israel killed scores of senior Iranian officials and nuclear scientists on Friday.


Whether with a green light or grudging acceptance, Trump enters war with Iran.

The dead include: the head of the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps (IRGC), Major General Hossein Salami; Major General Mohammad Bagheri, the chief of staff of Iran’s armed forces; and Ali Shamkhani, a close aide to Iran’s Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei.

The Trump administration knew about Israel’s attack plans for months.

MEE revealed earlier this month that the CIA was briefed in April and May on Israeli plans to unilaterally attack Iran’s nuclear sites. Israel’s Target Systems Analysis and battle plan for cyberattacks combined with precision strikes without any direct US involvement “impressed” the administration.

But Trump’s behaviour in recent months gave observers, and potentially the Iranians, the impression that he would continue to resist Netanyahu’s very public lobbying to go along with strikes.

Axios reported on Friday, citing two Israeli officials, that the Trump administration was only “pretending” to resist Israel’s attack plans, but privately did not resist them.

Trump has since framed his approach as saying that he gave Iran a 60-day window to agree to a new nuclear agreement with his administration before launching strikes. Israeli media reported the 60-day deadline in March 2025.

The Trump administration began talks with Iran on 12 April 2025, and the Israeli attack took place exactly 61 days later.

The talks in recent weeks hit a wall over the US’s insistence that Iran agree not to enrich any uranium, while Tehran said that preserving its right to a low level of enrichment was a red line.

Throughout the negotiations, the Trump administration continued a steady supply of arms and weapons to Israel in recent months, two US officials told MEE.

The US did not have to provide public notification of the transfer because it was already approved as part of a $7.4bn arms deal that included bombs, missiles, and related equipment that Congress was notified of in February 2025.
Iran has been America's (and the general western colonisers) white whale in the middle east for as long as they've been colonising,, with Israel as their "favourite unsinkable aircraft carrier" (John Bolton's words) tip of the spear - have tried sharing before but will just say if in doubt look up the history of CIA activities in Iran, it's got its own whole separate Wikipedia page and geopolitical historians would (and have been) saying the same

 
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tippy2k2

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I don't really want anything to happen to The US but if Iran does make good on their threat to hit Israel AND The US, I'm not going to be able to say we sure as shit don't deserve it.

Israel wouldn't be able to do...well...about everything they've been doing these past few years with the lil genocide and bombing about every neighbor they have. Be hard to say Iran wouldn't be 100% justified if they decided to take a shot at us as Israel seems hellbent on "forcing" us to go to war.
 

Seanchaidh

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I don't really want anything to happen to The US but if Iran does make good on their threat to hit Israel AND The US, I'm not going to be able to say we sure as shit don't deserve it.

Israel wouldn't be able to do...well...about everything they've been doing these past few years with the lil genocide and bombing about every neighbor they have. Be hard to say Iran wouldn't be 100% justified if they decided to take a shot at us as Israel seems hellbent on "forcing" us to go to war.
I think Iran would probably be smart to limit their targets to the Zionist colony and potentially its forces in Syria (at least for now) because US public opinion may have some kind of effect on the situation. But they do have ample justification to target US assets, no doubt about it. I imagine Iran's domestic politics will favor much shedding of blood, again with ample justification.
 

Silvanus

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Netanyahu continues to intentionally increase the risk to Israel, to manufacture a siege mentality conducive to keeping Likud in power.

I'm sure there will be much public and international acknowledgement of Iran's right to self defence. Anything less would be wildly hypocritical.
 

Gergar12

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I think Iran would probably be smart to limit their targets to the Zionist colony and potentially its forces in Syria (at least for now) because US public opinion may have some kind of effect on the situation. But they do have ample justification to target US assets, no doubt about it. I imagine Iran's domestic politics will favor much shedding of blood, again with ample justification.
If the US gets attacked, much of the US public which does not know about 1953, or even 1979 only knows that they were attacked by an Islamic extremist state in the Middle East would want blood. There would be many more mass shooter-like attacks on Iranians in the US like Iranian-Americans, GC-holders, and VISA tourists and students. It would make the landlord guy who killed that Palestinian child(Wadee Alfayoumi) look pale in comparison in terms of size, and scope.

The US would then send B-2s, and maybe B-52s to attack places like Fordow which the Israeli bunker busters can't get to as of right now. And if Trump gets bloodthirsty enough possibly attacks on dams, and other civilian targets a la World War 2.

By the way, don't give Trump any credit if Obama could stop Iran from getting attacked so could Trump. If he was serious about warning Iran, he could have warned them through other channels.
 

Gergar12

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Presumably the genocide in Palestine is getting old and stale, they need someone else to bomb. Attacking someone that can fight back might not be the best move, though.
The IRGC is highly incompetent when it comes to A2AD, their ballistic missile stock will decrease as time goes on, and Israel was able to refuel in Iranian airspace. No country can fight back against US hegemony. Eventually, Iran will get into a civil war, or worse another failed state. People were saying Russia could have sold them Su-35s, no they could have sold them Su-57s and they wouldn't have worked. J-20s sold by China armed with PL-15 missiles, HQ-19Bs, and AWACs could have worked, but China isn't willing since the BRICS countries don't trust each other.

This is Israel a country that was in the Six Days War, 1947-48, and Yom Kippur Wars, and despite being outnumbered, and oftentimes outgunned won. I have seen documentaries, and the Golden Meir movie, and have read many books on how they fight. They are nuts and have beat Soviet Union pilots who stumped the US during the Cold War.
 

Seanchaidh

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i guess i'll underline it since some of you need your hands held: remains to be confirmed

 

Thaluikhain

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The IRGC is highly incompetent when it comes to A2AD, their ballistic missile stock will decrease as time goes on, and Israel was able to refuel in Iranian airspace. No country can fight back against US hegemony. Eventually, Iran will get into a civil war, or worse another failed state. People were saying Russia could have sold them Su-35s, no they could have sold them Su-57s and they wouldn't have worked. J-20s sold by China armed with PL-15 missiles, HQ-19Bs, and AWACs could have worked, but China isn't willing since the BRICS countries don't trust each other.

This is Israel a country that was in the Six Days War, 1947-48, and Yom Kippur Wars, and despite being outnumbered, and oftentimes outgunned won. I have seen documentaries, and the Golden Meir movie, and have read many books on how they fight. They are nuts and have beat Soviet Union pilots who stumped the US during the Cold War.
Oh, I agree (though I wouldn't say that the conflicts of generations ago are necessarily reflective of the situation now). Just that there's a big difference between bombing civilians and attacking a country with any sort of a military. That Israel has the better hardwave won't necessarily mean they won't be taking a few hits back.
 

Hades

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What I find interesting is that the west has objectively declined. Europe has atrophied militarily and demographically, while the US hasn't won a war in decades and is crippled by political polarization. Despite this the enemies of the west seem incapable of filling this vacuum. Russia is floundering humiliatingly in Ukraine, Assad collapsed instantly, and Israel seems to have dismantled what they deem the ''axis of evil'' with ease, while Iran now coming across as pretty helpless.
 

Seanchaidh

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What I find interesting is that the west has objectively declined. Europe has atrophied militarily and demographically, while the US hasn't won a war in decades and is crippled by political polarization. Despite this the enemies of the west seem incapable of filling this vacuum. Russia is floundering humiliatingly in Ukraine, Assad collapsed instantly, and Israel seems to have dismantled what they deem the ''axis of evil'' with ease, while Iran now coming across as pretty helpless.
is that the impression you're getting from mainstream media coverage?
 

XsjadoBlayde

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I’ve been to Darfur, I’ve been to Kupiansk on the Ukraine frontlines. I’ve driven up through Syria just after the fall of the Assad regime. I’ve just been in Kandahar, Kabul, Kunduz in Afghanistan. I was in Mandalay just after the earthquake. Nothing was as bad as going to Gaza.”

UN Humanitarian Chief Tom Fletcher joins Mehdi Hasan on this episode of ‘Mehdi Unfiltered’ where they discuss the Israeli siege, accusations of antisemitism at the UN, and the genocide in Sudan. He also debunks the Israeli claim that Hamas is stealing civilian aid.

CHAPTERS
00:00 Intro
01:38 Tom Fletcher’s visit to Gaza
05:12 Manmade famine in Gaza
06:22 Israel’s aid blockage
11:06 Is Hamas stealing civilian aid?
17:51 Antisemitism accusations
20:30 Europe on Palestine
22:26 Does Trump want peace in Gaza?
23:51 Sudan genocide
25:54 USAID cuts
27:34 UAE and Sudan
29:21 Has the UN failed Gaza and Sudan?
I feel like it's important a significant member of the UN (U.N. Sustainable Development Solutions Network President Jeffrey Sachs) is speaking publicly and emotionally about this cos every time I try explaining in my own shitty dumb words i get really anxious about sounding like a fucking conspiracy theorist and there's only so many ways of trying to avoid that being the resulting perception of everyone tuning it out. so plz for the unaware if I'm too annoying don't let important context pass you by and give Jeffery a chance instead

15 minute version for people with lives to live;


3 hour version for ppl with...out?
 
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