Abuse vs Equality

[Pennyy9]

This post is not intended to be hateful, ignorant, or purposely offensive. I am not a victim of abuse, nor an abuser of victims. Please refer to this statement if you are planning to post a hate filled dismissal of the following text.


Abuse has never been a contested area. Specifically domestic abuse. People who exercise greater physical strength or take advantage of mental weakness to abuse their spouses or significant others are cowardly scum, and go to jail. But let's talk about equality in terms of genders. What makes it okay for men to fight men, and women to fight women, but not interchangeably so?

For the purpose of this argument, parties are equal physically, and emotionally; neither having an advantage. On the playground we see people tussle all the time. Little girls and little boys fight over different things, and not just physically. Name calling, bullying, we all know about it.

When I was in grade school, out on the playground during recess, there were always rules against fighting. Usually we just had to sit out of recess for the rest of the day if neither of the people fighting had to go to the office. The punishment never changed until one day, for one reason or another, a little girl punched a little boy. The little boy and the little girl had teasing each other on and off for the past week, and finally the girl punched the little boy and knocked him over. The boy got back up, and promptly punched her right back. Both of them had bloody noses.


Sitting in the nurses office, the little girl was taken home by her parents because she didn't want to go back to class with a bloody nose. The boy however, was suspended from school for three days. His dad talked to him about how it wasn't okay to hit girls, and the boy didn't understand. They both were hurt, and she had punched him too; didn't that make it okay? His father said no, because girls aren't made the same as boys. The little boy was me, at age 10.


Fast forward to today. I'm much older now, watching a video of a girl (Snooki) being punched in a bar by a man she had just insulted. MTV, the channel that aired the show on which the incident takes place refers to it as "Extremely disturbing.". I am not taking this out of context, but was a provoked attack disturbing? If someone is harassing another human being, who are we to judge what reactions are inappropriate? Putting that into a concise statement: Does physical limitation grant immunity to physical reactions?

Many people believe, including me, that mental abuse and assault can be far far worse than physical. Is Snooki being brought up on harassment charges? None present. If you have not seen the video, the woman in question is seen verbally berating the man who punched her. The point I'm trying to get to is this: "Why are human rights different when one person is stronger than the other?"

Do not misunderstand this statement, I'm not a misogynist. I believe that while what the man did was wrong, it was not as one-sided as it seems. It wasn't mindless rage, but it wasn't self defense either. It wasn't a comeuppance, but it wasn't entirely unprovoked either.





TL;DR: Why are human rights different when one person is stronger than the other?

 

[Pennyy9]

no "TL;DR option?" And what is the question?

TL;DR =P

TL;DR: Why are human rights different when one person is stronger than the other?

 

[Amethyst Wind]

I can't say what I'd do in a situation like that, not for any ideological reasons, it'd have to be decided at the time.

Unfortunately this equality argument is being taken a little too far by naturally violent men who claim equality as an excuse to visit unnecessary violence on women that they would not usually have done because of fear of discrimination. These men are usually not great physical specimens and so cannot perform violence against the men who provoke them (usually bigger and stronger) and so use equality as an excuse to vent physically on women.

Flipped of course, since this particular discussion is still up in the air, there are many women who will take advantage of it in much the same way except will argue from the other side that men still should not hit women, making for one-sided and completely unfair exchanges.

 

[angry_flashlight]

I can't say what I'd do in a situation like that, not for any ideological reasons, it'd have to be decided at the time.

Unfortunately this equality argument is being taken a little too far by naturally violent men who claim equality as an excuse to visit unnecessary violence on women that they would not usually have done because of fear of discrimination. These men are usually not great physical specimens and so cannot perform violence against the men who provoke them (usually bigger and stronger) and so use equality as an excuse to vent physically on women.

Flipped of course, since this particular discussion is still up in the air, there are many women who will take advantage of it in much the same way except will argue from the other side that men still should not hit women, making for one-sided and completely unfair exchanges.

What he said. This is much better phrased than what I was thinking of.

 

[JoJo]

I've been brought up to see an attack on a female as more wrong than on a male. Despite the fact it technically makes no sense, it's so ingrained into my mind that like many I just see an attack on a female as a more despiable act (although starting any fight even if the other has been insulting you is very wrong). However your school was being illogical and old-fashioned when they blamed you for that when she attacked first. I suspect it may partly had been pressure from the little girl's parents that got the blame put squarely on you.

 

[Blind Sight]

TL;DR version of my opinion: violence isn't cool. Only time you have a right to attack someone physically is if they're attacking you physically. Then, feel free to team'em a lesson. This applies to both men and women. Don't get into a fight that you can't win, it's just common sense.

 

[sarge1942]

TL;DR: Why are human rights different when one person is stronger than the other?
because in alot of cases it is necessary, and in other cases it is taken advantage of, it just happens to be taken advantage of too well. i myself could be being stabbed to death by a girl i don't think i'd be able to hit her, the world isn't perfect and that's all i've got.

 

[Lord Mountbatten Reborn]

I don't care who hit me; they fucking hit me.

I dislike being hit.

Do not hit me.

These are simple rules that I would like people to adhere to. I am not fond of violent girls/boys, but I shall tolerate being hit if I was being a twat, or if it's friendly, playful tomfoolery (strangers especially cannot hit me; I do not know the context of such hitting, and I am like to assume a context of the utmost negative intention). I don't hit people unless they hit me first, or if they killed my family in front of me or stole my Subway sandwich (both equally heinous acts) or something.

Of course, abuse is the problem here. We can't properly get rid of "boys shouldn't hit girls" whilst domestic violence continues.

Possibly though, domestic violence against both sexes is evenly split. Men are supposed to report this kind of thing less than women do. It damages pride.

 

[Lord Mountbatten Reborn]

Possibly though, domestic violence against both sexes is evenly split. Men are supposed to report this kind of thing less than women do. It damages pride.

It also causes people around them to view them as inferior.
Yay, society!

We're not very good at dispelling the idea of the patriarchal society I have to say.

 

[Keava]

Actually, the real feminists are strongly against any form of protectionism towards females, including things like opening the door for a female, etc. Protectionism is viewed as a form of dominance, you yourself by such actions want to mark your territory and show who 'rules' here and how 'merciful' you are by being nice.
It's you as male part of society that created such environment, so don't be surprised that there is plenty of women that will abuse it. You provided the tools.

As for the examples the OP based his opinion on. They are a little different issue. Violence is never seen as good way to resolve conflicts, and seriously, getting all muscle because some chick called him names in a reality show just proves the guys was an idiot to start with. Without the context of the whole incident, or the exact words used i can't really say, but i guess the term of mental abuse is also a little over the top. If you can't take some harsh words maybe you shouldn't get in front of cameras in the first place.

 

[Kuckles]

It is an age old reaction to use your physical dominance over someone, but we now live in a society where doing so wil get you arrested, and why? because here, it is mostly so that the weakest persons, are the smartest and most powerfull persons.
Not physicaly powerfull, but social more powerfull. Their only protection, is that of the legal system, and other people.

Anyway the point I'm making, it is acceptable that women are excused for violence more easily, because we considerd them for so long to be "physically lesser" and therefore need protection more than those that are not, especially against those that are not.

It has become common courtesy to protect a lady when she is being harrassed, while when it is a man, leaving him to sort it out himself.

My opionion is, that you indeed have a good point, why should we still protect something more than something else, just because we consider it courtesy to do so. Does a man not have the right to be protected from the same things as a woman, and vise versa?

And to your example, I find you are right, both you as well as the girl should be told, to not attack someone at all, unless in selfdefence, not just you not to attack girls.
It's a ridiculous thing.

 

[infinity_turtles]

I've been in similar situations as the one you talked about. Honestly, I have a hard time coming up with any reason that isn't selfishness, ignorance, being stuck in their ways, or some combination of the three. One of my best friends since I was five is a girl who routinely kicks my ass(She's into mixed martial arts and I enjoy taunting her enough that I don't mind being her punching bag), so it seems especially asinine to me.

 

[Thwarted]

what's a Snooki?

 

[Gudrests]

because "Equality" dosent mean "ok were all equal from now on" nooo it means "OK i get more because i HAD less until i see it fit that were all "equal" "

 

[hurfdurp]

Let's just stop hitting each other, then we don't have to decide if it was justified or not.