Best/worst Morality systems in games

[vrmlguy]

I thought about putting this in Gaming Discussions, but wtf. Zero Punctuation slams morality systems in games this week, so has anyone seen one that worked? If not, then what games are really bad?

To get the ball rolling, I liked the system in Sacrifice (released in 2000). Instead of simple GvE, you choose missions offered by five different gods who all had opposing goals. There were (I think) ten endings depending on which god you were most aligned with at the end, and how strongly you were aligned. You can read a review at http://www.gamesfirst.com/reviews/rick/Sacrifice/sacrifice.htm or go check out the Wikipedia article, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacrifice_(computer_game)

 

[Hazy]

KOTOR had a nice one, and I liked inFAMOUS' I don't care what anyone says.

 

[Vrex360]

Mass Effect had a very good moral choice system as choices actually made some kind of IMPACT. I thought it was great even if the choices you made in the first game are going to cause anxiety prior the release of the second.

Also it seems that all Yahtzee needs to do these days is say:
"This is a bad thing in games."
and almost like we responded to him snapping his fingers there is immediatley threads about it. He is just a gamer like us and his opinions are no more valid than anyone elses.

 

[Curtmiester]

Fable 2 was terrible because all it did was change your look. That was it! Nothing else was really effected.

 

[Zeramo]

KOTOR had a nice one, and I liked inFAMOUS' I don't care what anyone says.

I haven't played inFamous yet but i definetly have to agree with Kotor

 

[Captainguy42]

Fallout 3 it made me feel bad-ass to turn on the Radio and listen to 3 talk about how much of a dick I was. Actually gave me a feeling that I was effecting something with my actions.

Bioshock's while it may have been extreme, did effect the way I thought about the game. The first time I just killed all the little sisters and later I felt bad whenever I saw a Big Daddy banging on a vent with no results. Then when I played it again by saving them all I felt awesome whenever I saw the same thing even though I knew it made almost no difference.

 

[Noone From Nowhere]

So far, the best would go to Mass Effect which avoids the simple Good vs. Evil, dealing instead with tactless versus tactful, patience versus impatience, passivity versus hostility. Best of all, there are no true rewards for playing extremes (outside of a one-time achievement)while the middle-ground often turns up the best results.
The True Crimes series also has an interesting morality system in the form of Good Cop-Bad Cop which effects the course of the storyline and endings.
As for the worst, either Fable or Fable 2. That whole 'Goodness Equals Beauty' ideal is flawed enough but to be deemed impure for acts such as eating meat (it's all free range from what one can see of the in game animals!)and having pre-marital sex is a bit too obnoxious. If it only affected how Liberals, Moderates or Conservatives viewed the character, that would be fine, but to treat 'purity' as some intrinsic element of nature is absurd.
I also don't care for the attraction-repulsion factor that being good or evil has. Either one can not navigate narrow street ways because throngs of fans are crowding the hero out or everyone runs away at the sight of the hero, forcing the hero to give chase for the most basic interactions. Worst of all, it has absolutely no bearing upon the storyline itself. There isn't any option to join with Lucien or to use the Spire to conquer the world if one is evil enough or to rule as a benevolent dictator. At least Fall Out 3 gives the player special options based upon Karma levels as well as followers fixed to a given alignment of Good, Evil or Neutral.

 

[Reillk]

Silent Hill 2. Most subtle I have ever seen, where your morality choices were all determined by how you actually played the game, and not just answering some questions.

 

[Sparrow]

Alot of people bashing on Fable's morality choices here, but it was the one that really brought the original Fallout's system back into use. It made it game mechanic again.

However, my favourite would go to Fallout 3. To a certain extent, it doesn't change much in the game itself, but when your a prick, your really a prick. And when your a good guy, your freaking Jesus.

 

[NeutralDrow]

Planescape Torment had a wonderful D&D-style alignment system.

For some reason, I always wound up as Neutral Good. Probably because I could never bring myself to not help people, and because I could never decide whether I wanted to help them immediately or make fun of them first (yes, I'm the one who asks the skeletons why they wear smocks).

 

[Talonhand]

Zero Punctuation slams morality systems in games this week, so has anyone seen one that worked?

He had a point. A lot of morality systems I've seen you either have to be totally good or totally evil to get the good stuff. And even then it's normally evil >.>
Many of these systems are more incentives than anything. Most people either want the cool items or they just need to kill stuff.

 

[Nargleblarg]

I actually didn't like the Fallout one the only reason though is because there was no bar to show me how far I was from good or evil so that made neutral really hard.

 

[vampyricvoid]

Possibly because it follows the original design for a morality system, I'd dare say that Neverwinter Nights 2 gets my vote. Throughout the game, you get certain choices in dialogue. If you decide to help a family by finding their children and then accepting no payment, you'll move some points towards 'good'. If you decide to kill a merchant in need because you'll get the huge amount of money in the beginning of the game for it, you'll move points towards 'evil'. Starting unnecessary fights will give you 'chaotic' points, and being a diplomat to solve conflicts or helping keep order will give you 'lawful' points. Sure you choose an alignment at the beginning of the game, but if you get too many points towards another alignment, you'll shift that way. In order to stay neutral, you'd have to choose equal amounts of good and bad choices. Sometimes this might not affect your character, but if you're a paladin, you must stay lawful good or lose most of your abilities.

 

[RyQ_TMC]

For the worst, I'd say "Baldur's Gate". It was one of the first games to actually include a working morality system, but it basically showered you with perks if you were good and made your life hell if you were evil. The only incentive for actually being evil was that characters with evil alignment could actually leave your team if your reputation was too high (some neutral characters too). But then there were so many NPCs to choose from that losing some options didn't actually affect your prospects of building a Badass Adventurer Corporation.

For the best... Difficult to say, but I think I'll say "Planescape: Torment", since you could actually feel how your actions affected your alignment... Difficult to say how actually, but I could see the connection between my deeds and what reputation/alignment I ended up with.

 

[Lomeneck]

The best morality systems are less obvious choices and more subtlety. Actually HAVING a middle ground is very nice. Like, being able to be not just evil or good, but intelligent.

Therefore, Fallout 3 is my choice for best. You didn't have to be a bastard, per se, but you could steal food and other essentials from under people's noses, but only because you had to for survival's sake. You could still assist these people, and not have to go full-blown evil just for grabbing a few things.

Worst would have to be Fable. You're constantly faced with blunt questions of being a dick or a saint. For there to be middleground, you had to be back-and-forth with your opinion on what was right and what was wrong.

 

[demmalition1]

Black and White/2 had good systems (if flawed games) where not only did the general theme change, but things in the game changed as well (good=giant polar bear, but only if you put the effort into it; evil=they're dead). In 2 your gameplay was also tied into it (city build or conquer).

 

[Nurb]

What I'm wating for is a system where it's extremely difficult to be very good or very bad, like in reality. It's nearly impossible to be a saint because there's so much grey area and you can't be too evil because so many people will be against you.

Fallout wasn't close, but it was in the ballpark, where you'd have good or bad people out looking for you depending on your stance.