Diablo 3. Fun but disappointing.

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zinho73

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Diablo 3 is another triple A title that was somewhat disappointing to me. It looks like the drive to make money at all costs is hurting at least a little bit companies that had a very good track record before, like Bioware and Blizzard.

Dragon Age 2 had the repeated features, the lack of customization for your party, the lackluster final act, amongst other things. Yeah the game is not terrible, but it sure felt like a rushed product.
I even regret to have bought it on launch because I felt it was not worth full price.

Starcraft 2 had only the humans in the campaign. The campaign was still lengthy enough (if unimaginative), but the variety was gone. The game was good enough, though.

Mass Effect 3 had the almost impossibly bad ending and the unnecessary multiplayer that was needed to get the ?best? ending in single player (although it turned out better than expected and kind of saved the game replayability somewhat). And, of course, all the misleading statements from Bioware.

And now Diablo 3.

What I don?t like:

1. Online always. The decision that was single handedly responsible for the huge amount of frustration on the launch day. It also feels like the game is a service and not a product.

2. Auction House. I don?t see anything wrong with it itself, but it is probably one of the big reasons why D3 is online only. They are putting their pockets first and consumer satisfaction on a distant second. I understand ?second?, but I don?t like ?distant?.

3. Game-breaking bugs.
4. The ?magic? classes feel somewhat off to me, with every skill based on the weapon they are wearing, with the weapons themselves disappearing in the animation. Weird. Why not make exclusive weapons and tie the abilities to them (like they did on the Demon Hunter). It feels unpolished.

5. The auto skill tree makes the progression of the characters feel like a game of DOTA, League of Legends, etc. With the market full with this kind of games, it feels repetitive and way too simple for an RPG (even an action one). Granted, things open up a little bit in the later levels with more options to choose, but the initial stages are boring, hurting replayability. Diablo 2 was also very easy on the beginning, but the skill tree gave the players something to think about.

I liked to start a new character in D2. In D3 not so much.

6. Unimpressive. The art direction of the game is great, the animations are fantastic and the physics are fun. But Sacred 2 impressed me more with its seamless and gigantic world and well implemented, creative characters, Torchlight impressed me more with its innovations (like pets, fish, side missions, fun artstyle, fame, etc.) and Titan Quest impressed me more with its graphics (for the time) and its physics. D3 manages to be a better game than Sacred and Titan Quest specifically because of the pacing (Blizzard really nailed it) and overall polish. But what I see is quality with zero creativity, which is not bad, but, again, somewhat disappointing. Blizzard is working on this thing for god knows how long with an incredible amount of resources at their hands. C?mon.

And, if compared to Torchlight, Diablo might only have the art style and a little bit more of variety to brag about.

In the end, Diablo 3 is a great game and Blizzard has the resources to correct mistakes and make the product better on the long run, but I just can?t shake off the feeling that if Blizzard and EA still had the pro-consumer drive that CD Projekt and Valve have, the games I cited here could have been some of the most fantastic digital experiences ever.

Instead they are reasonable to good, some even great at moments, but disappointing in what would seem an easily avoidable way. Well, CD Projekt makes it look easy anyway.
 

hazabaza1

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If any game takes more than 5 years to develop it will be disappointing for the majority of people.
 

BloatedGuppy

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I haven't run into any bugs yet, but I've heard elsewhere there are some nasty ones.

This is mostly fair. I had a good time playing last night and was sad to stop, but this is not an innovative game in any way. Blizzard are very stubborn about sticking tight to proven formulas. And I sometimes feel like the rise of the MMO has in many ways rendered the ARPG lootwhoring Diablo experience somewhat redundant. I found Torchlight almost nauseatingly boring, for instance.

I wouldn't say I find it disappointing, but my expectations for it were fairly moderate to begin with. It would've had to really stink for me to find it disappointing. And it doesn't stink.
 

Verzin

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I agree with all of your points.

the wizard feels unpolished
I'd think that the wizard feels very...lackluster. She probably becomes stronger at later levels, but her early gameplay just isn't much fun at all compared to the witch doctor or barbarian.
 

zinho73

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hazabaza1 said:
If any game takes more than 5 years to develop it will be disappointing for the majority of people.
I understand that. Also, if the game has a huge following people will complain about changes and things like that.

But I think that we should not dismiss the weight of the recent money grabbing "features" most triple A games are coming with in the disappointing factor.
 

zinho73

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BloatedGuppy said:
I haven't run into any bugs yet, but I've heard elsewhere there are some nasty ones.
WHATEVER YOU DO, DO NOT GIVE A SHIELD TO THE PALADIN IF YOU ARE ROLLING A DEMON HUNTER! :)
 

Nerexor

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Verzin said:
I agree with all of your points.

the wizard feels unpolished
I'd think that the wizard feels very...lackluster. She probably becomes stronger at later levels, but her early gameplay just isn't much fun at all compared to the witch doctor or barbarian.
I found that true for single player, but when I started playing with friends I found the Wizard a lot more fun. Frost nova in a party of witch doctors becomes offense rather than defense (freeze the enemy so the WD's pets and spiders can attack with impunity) and then since you're in there anyways, start using the dumbed down charged bolt on everything around you.

Wizards always start a little slower than the other classes (remember D2 where you had just Fire Bolt, Frost Bolt, and Charged Bolt, all of which were quite lackluster until you levelled the crap out of them).

In response to the review in general, it's nice to see someone being objective on this topic in this forum. Kudos to you.

Regarding the comment about always online, what most people are not taking into account is the smooth integration of single and multiplayer that this brings. Yes, the servers thing was (and possibly still is?) a giant headache, but it is unlikely to continue to be one. So this way you can be playing on your own, see a friend come on, invite them in and BAM, they're in your game helping you out. No segregation between your online/offline characters, no need to join a seperate game and all that nonsense. This to me is just so much more convenient than I had expected (I had it all planned out that I would need a different character for online and that I wouldn't be able to share drops, etc...)

There's a few other things I think are kind of cool as well that they did in game that are worth mentioning:

Shared crafting expertise between characters: This makes the crafting training less of a drain and merges very well with the shared stash between characters. I was thrilled when I realized I didn't have to retrain my wizard after my demon hunter had spent a ton on crafting lessons.

Lore: They are going hardcore in codifying and expounding the lore of the older games in this one. The diaries that are scattered around have been very interesting and the callbacks all the way back to Diablo 1 show that they're trying to wrap it all up into one whole. Still on act 1, so no idea if they WILL manage it, but so far so good.

As I said, minor stuff and unlikely to change anyone's mind about some of the very real bugs I've heard about.
 

zinho73

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Torchlight: A bright under-aged kid. Sure you will hang out with her a little and it will be fun, but there will be no long term relashionship here.

Titan Quest: A beautiful woman a bit past of its prime, but shallow. You will date her occasionally, the sex will be good but you won't have much to talk about.

Sacred2: A cute, bright crazy nymphomaniac that doesn't really know what she wants from life. Careful because you can fall in love and you won't even know why.

Divine Divinity: An ugly woman with great, deep personality. At first, you won't feel attracted to her, but you might even ending up marrying her.

Diablo 3: A beautiful, fun, but also not very bright woman with a big nose. She is otherwise a perfect date, but... The nose!

Well, we all hope that Blizzard turns out to be a good plastic surgeon.

Diablo 2: Not perfect, but fun - sometimes in unexpected ways. Married her a long time ago.
 

BloatedGuppy

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zinho73 said:
Diablo 3: A beautiful, fun, but also not very bright woman with a big nose. She is otherwise a perfect date, but... The nose!
Easy fix. Just have Kramer come over. He'll tell her she needs a nose job.

zinho73 said:
WHATEVER YOU DO, DO NOT GIVE A SHIELD TO THE PALADIN IF YOU ARE ROLLING A DEMON HUNTER! :)
Woof. Thanks for that. I checked it out on google...ugly, ugly bug. I don't use followers, but I could see my girlfriend running headfirst into that one.
 

unbreakable212

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Sad to hear that so many people found D3 to be "good, but disappointing overall"

Haven't really looked into any of the game-breaking bugs but i'll have to take a peak, although I agree that the auto-skill tree is rather pants, I love D2 because even though all characters looked the same, you didn't know where they'd put their skill points until you got into combat with them or saw them in combat. Also preferred the variety and the odd and amusing builds that would pop up from time to time.
 

BloatedGuppy

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unbreakable212 said:
Haven't really looked into any of the game-breaking bugs but i'll have to take a peak, although I agree that the auto-skill tree is rather pants, I love D2 because even though all characters looked the same, you didn't know where they'd put their skill points until you got into combat with them or saw them in combat. Also preferred the variety and the odd and amusing builds that would pop up from time to time.
There is definitely room for differential.

You've got 6 skills overall, with what looks like 4 variations of each skill, and then a choice of rune for said skills which varies it even more.

So one guy might be throwing bolos and laying down caltrops, and another guy might be vanishing in a smoke screen and throwing grenades.

The main way in which it differs from D2 is that in D2 every time you leveled you got new skill points to assign. In D3 you're waiting for things to unlock at set intervals. So while you can differentiate yourself eventually, early on classes are going to play the same. You can't rapidly take them in new directions.
 

Lunar Templar

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zinho73 said:
BloatedGuppy said:
I haven't run into any bugs yet, but I've heard elsewhere there are some nasty ones.
WHATEVER YOU DO, DO NOT GIVE A SHIELD TO THE PALADIN IF YOU ARE ROLLING A DEMON HUNTER! :)
oh? i did this, since, i'm using him as my tank >.> bug is what now?
 

BloatedGuppy

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SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
This so much. I mean, no skill tree? No skill tree at all? ...Is this a hack and slay RPG or a MOBA game?

I actually mapped all my abilities to Q,W,E and R with potions on F because the whole game feels so much like DOTA where abilities and leveling are concerned.

Anyway, in general, its good, but not 12 years good. I don't know what took them so long. If you told me Diablo 3 took 3 years to develop without me knowing the truth, I would be surprised they didn't get it done faster. They must have scrapped EVERYTHING at least 4 times, otherwise, what in the actual fuck were they doing in all that time?

And even with all that considered, PvP isn't in the vanilla game. Wut. How the hell do you spend so much time on a game, then ship it without one of the core modes. I seriously do not get it.

But whatever, I'm having fun, so its all good.
There's a bit of a skill tree. In fairness to D3, the one in D2 was kind of hilariously unbalanced.

As for the development time...this is classic Blizzard. Their turnaround time on everything is just achingly slow, and they always deliver something reasonably polished that looks 2 generations old.
 

Erttheking

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Yeesh, it does't seem like it's a very good time for 3s in the gaming industry.
 

BloatedGuppy

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SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
So clearly, the answer to this problem was just to remove the tree almost entirely. I mean, its not like they had 12 years to make and properly balance 5 of them, RIGHT???? RIGHT?!?!?!?

Oh yeah, thats another thing, "Normal" is way to fucking easy. I mean, seriously. I have died ONCE. And this is with 2 other friends, which is supposed to make the game harder. The boss fights are an absolute piss take. Wheres my 10-30 minute bosses from Titan Quest? Wheres the one hits? This isn't normal, this is super easy casual mode or something.
It doesn't matter how complex you make your skill trees. If there's one "right" way to spec, and everything else is gimp, you've created one option. Balancing complex systems is hard. If the more streamlined Diablo 3 trees are BALANCED, they actually WILL be an improvement. But I can't say if they are or aren't yet.

You're 100% right about the difficulty so far though. It's a breeze. I wish there was some way to jack it up without going all the way through normal first.
 

Silvianoshei

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SmashLovesTitanQuest said:
So clearly, the answer to this problem was just to remove the tree almost entirely. I mean, its not like they had 12 years to make and properly balance 5 of them, RIGHT???? RIGHT?!?!?!?

Its just something that smacks of laziness, which is weird, because I cant imagine a Blizzard employee or studio being lazy without getting kicked the fuck out.

But you know, at the end of the day, I wasn't hyped for Diablo 3. I wasn't even going to buy it, but then a friend and bro-op happened and I got it after all. Points being, I don't really give a fuck about the 12 year development span, the game is fun and all is good, IF they support it properly and patch in additional content with meaty expansion packs thrown in from time to time. (The story and pacing is good, but I think its all going to lose its charm once the second playthrough rolls along, which I will do since thats where the real challenge begins.)

Oh yeah, thats another thing, "Normal" is way to fucking easy. I mean, seriously. I have died ONCE. And this is with 2 other friends, which is supposed to make the game harder. The boss fights are an absolute piss take. Wheres my 10-30 minute bosses from Titan Quest? Wheres the one hits? This isn't normal, this is super easy casual mode or something.
Don't worry, bud. Hell kicks up the difficulty a hell of a lot, and Inferno is likely to be an ass whooping and a half. I can't wait to start rolling HC, it's gonna be awesome since there isn't any ALT+F4ing like you could in D2.
 

Shockolate

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Lunar Templar said:
zinho73 said:
BloatedGuppy said:
I haven't run into any bugs yet, but I've heard elsewhere there are some nasty ones.
WHATEVER YOU DO, DO NOT GIVE A SHIELD TO THE PALADIN IF YOU ARE ROLLING A DEMON HUNTER! :)
oh? i did this, since, i'm using him as my tank >.> bug is what now?
After a quick look on the Diablo forums, it said if you swapped shields with one you have equipped.

Might be a factor someone forgot.

Same as you, I'm using him as my tank and things are fine. Wa worried for a moment.