Do Game Snobs Dream in Two Dimensions?

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tjspeirs

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Aug 7, 2010
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Probably the most confusing, astonishing, and enraging commercial I've ever seen was one by Samsung, promoting their fantastic new television that could supposedly reproduce 3D imagery. A typical white television family gazed, mouths agape, at the aquarium they were walking through, staring like the goats they were at the myriad kois, clownfish, flying fish, starfish, fishsticks, catfish, birdfish, redfish, bluefish, Suess-fish, etc. The family then revealed themselves as demons sent to purge this earth of what made it unique, as demonstrated by the father-in-disguise reaching his hands into the aquarium. Not over the top of it, through the water. Through the glass. He pulled out a cube of the aquarium, caging the hapless fish that happened to swim through his malicious grasp, and they happily drove to their domicile of darkness, cleverly disguised as a suburban human home, and shoved this cube through their dimension to hell, cleverly disguised as a typical flatscreen high definition television. Then a disconnected, ethereal voice that I can only assume was their higher-up spoke:

"Ever wondered how amazing it would be to experience life in another dimension? We did. Introducing a new dimension in television. Samsung 3D TV."

I pray to god that this was some kind of underworldly code indecipherable to the human ear, and not actually the English language as it appeared to be, because if it was the latter, it could easily be the stupidest collection of words I've ever heard. If there's a secretary or receptionist working for Samsung that has stumbled across this, I hope you're sitting down, because the next sentence may make you dizzy.

We live in four dimensions. That's one more than your dinky TV poorly reproduces.

I know. I know. Get some water.

This entire stereoscopic display fad is already getting old. I take that back: it's actually just plain old. It's been on-and-off since the 50's, continually fading from relevance from being really annoying and relying on incapable technology. Of course, the most recent iteration of the fad was started by James Cameron's Avatar, and let me state now, relatively early in this spiel, that I have not seen that movie. I have heard reviews and synopses of it, so I do get it. I apologize for choosing whether to view a movie by looking at the entirety of a movie's merits, or lack thereof.

The idea that we're still trying in vain to reproduce three dimensions on a two-dimensional medium is what baffles me. No matter how sleek the glasses, how quick the refresh rate, how many cameras were filming the scene, television is a two-dimensional method of delivering information. On top of being truly flat, the television is a finite device, so any image that reaches it's edges would suddenly be truncated, shattering the illusion, if it was successfully set up. The third dimension will always be fabricated through these pixels, always be limited. Creating an entire new dimension is something that will require creating an entire new display that would somehow combat the limited area. Perhaps something related to projection that used some applicable surface that was much closer to the eyes (in the form of glasses, or maybe projecting straight onto the eye) would be capable of realistic and thorough stereoscopic depth, much more so than the television, at least.

What is unique about this time around is the serious incorporation of this technology into the video game industry. Please note I said "serious", which would negate that horrendous thing Nintendo dumped on us in the 90s. Instead, they are dumping a less horrendous console on us, the 3DS, which, being a plebeian, I have had no contact with, but apparently it works well without causing physical pain. Even Sony is jumping on the bandwagon, releasing a firmware update allowing the PS3 to play any PS3 game in stereoscope.

Whatever.

Who cares. As a game snob, I just can't care about stereoscopic vision for my games. They don't do anything to improve the essential elements . These games aren't any more elegant in gameplay, deep in story, or -- yes that's right -- complex in aesthetics then they were before they were shoved into an optical illusion. Is it a bad thing? Well, if it causes people physical pain, then yes, it's bad. If the console gives the player the option to turn the entire schtick off, then it's irrelevant, and that is bad. But if it can provide a new way of looking at a game without any real downsides, then no, it isn't bad. It still isn't any use.

Even so, this entire charade covers a new piece of tech, a hot new thing, a completely pointless inclusion. I don't want to get too worked up, here. I know that stereoscope is a basically harmless trinket, and that the amount of effort being made integrating this tech into future products isn't that large. Please try to understand that I have a strange immunity to the Avatar effect, so when I see a handheld being marketed with the same game library as a home console from 15 years ago except these games are in "threeeee-deeeee", I simply shrug. It means nothing. I can't have any interest in that platform, regardless of how many "dees" it contains. This is what new technology means nowadays. I'd prefer better games, or at least new games.

What are your feelings on the whole stereoscopic deal? Please leave a comment! :D Thanks for reading.
 

oplinger

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Sep 2, 2010
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Is this a term paper? That's much bigger than a wall of text, and it seems more like you hate the commercial than anything..
 

DonMartin

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Well, sadly i think this might be one of the TLDNR threads...

Although i got to say, i could not care less for 3D movies or games.. Might be a fun thing at first, like seeing Avatar for the first time, but after a while, the novelty's worn off.
 

tjspeirs

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Aug 7, 2010
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There are clear paragraphs, SIR!

Yeah that commercial pissed me off. It was just a perfect stupid memorial to just how big the fad is right now.
 

Kwaren

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I just bought a perfectly functional 2d tv. Why would I want to buy a 3d tv for $500 more and be forced to wear uncomfortable glasses over my own glasses? Oh right... I wouldn't.
 

tjspeirs

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DonMartin said:
Well, sadly i think this might be one of the TLDNR threads...

Although i got to say, i could not care less for 3D movies or games.. Might be a fun thing at first, like seeing Avatar for the first time, but after a while, the novelty's worn off.
If it was a video, would it be easier to take in? I've considered making videos, I just don't have the opportunity...
 

DonMartin

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tjspeirs said:
DonMartin said:
Well, sadly i think this might be one of the TLDNR threads...

Although i got to say, i could not care less for 3D movies or games.. Might be a fun thing at first, like seeing Avatar for the first time, but after a while, the novelty's worn off.
If it was a video, would it be easier to take in? I've considered making videos, I just don't have the opportunity...
Maybe.. The problem is just that among the 200 comments you might get, 195 are going to be trolls, or just pricks.

Just remember to edit it to fit a movie, so the narrator doesnt sound like he's just reading an essay.

your call, laddie.
 

Tilted_Logic

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snowplow said:
My opinion closely matches your own. 3D is pretty useless as it is now, and even general consumers aren't really buying into the fad. However it doesn't have to be completely worthless:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jd3-eiid-Uw
That is awesome.

On topic though, I agree 3D is being over done. The problem I have with most 3D commercials is their 'belief' that consumers will go for anything presented well. The commercial in question was appealing, very beautiful even. But the problem is 3D doesn't look like that.

Images cut when they reach the edge of a screen, which makes the 'experience' far less immersive. You're suppose to believe you're in some other dimension or actually 'in' the movie, but you zoom in an inch and all of a sudden half the bubbles floating around you are cut in half?

Avatar did it spectacularly well, but nothing else has held a torch to it. It appals me how much companies can get away with running on 'gimmick'.
 

DrPoopenstein

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Sep 10, 2010
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tjspeirs said:
We live in four dimensions.
lolwut? Yep, can't take anything else you're going to say seriously until you recognize that Doctor Who is science FICTION and we live in 3d.
 

DrPoopenstein

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SirBryghtside said:
there aren't any 3D channels that'll show what you want. It's like the trainwreck that is HD.
Again:lolwut? Do you HAVE an HD screen/content provider? Tons of people watch and enjoy HD programming, thankyouverymuch, if it were a "trainwreck" they wouldn't be putting shows like The Daily Show on in high definition. You not being able to afford it doesn't mean that people with jobs don't want it. ;)
 

DeadFOAM

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I've never liked 3D movies, primarily because I physically can't see them. I only see 5 feet out of one eye, so it messes up my depth perception. The original red/blue style 3D didn't do anything for me except hide the movie behind a mash of distracting color. The new 3D, I don't know what to call it, just gives me a headache. I'm just waiting for the fad to die.
 

krimson_dropz

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i agree 3d is just a gimmek, unfortunatly it is a gimmik i fear will stagnate the medium of video gaming as its (probably i honestly not too educated on the subject) very expensive to produce. this will lead to money taking away from the nessicary elements such as oh i dont know good story (as if that art werent almost dead) or new gameplay, etc. so in short, as a pessimist i believe that 3d will exsaserbate the already prolifent problems plauging the art. lets hope i'm wrong. please god, (or lack thereof) let me be wrong. please let there be a new gaming reniscance as it were and please let there be less idiots in the future mistaking clever gimmiks for good gaming elements (Wii). (yeah right fat chance)
 

DrPoopenstein

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SirBryghtside said:
I meant trainwreck as in it started with about 2 channels.

What I'm saying is that they should make ALL the channels 3D before turning it into a part of regular TV. Eventually, the HD channels will disappear, leaving all of the normal channels to be in HD too. Bypassing that step would mean that more people would buy 3D TVs sooner, and they would become as standard. HD still hasn't crossed that border.
So....gas stations should have existed across the country before the car was built?

The internet should have been built before the PC?

OF COURSE IT STARTED WITH 2 CHANNELS. Something starting small and growing into a large success is not a "trainwreck".

So explain something to me:what sense does it make to spend money to create content that no one COULD watch if they wanted? Smellovision doesn't exist yet, would you spend a few million extra to develop content for it in the hopes that someday everyone will buy one at once and THEN it would be useful? Why in the hell would studios shoot everything in HD 3d if it WEREN'T available to consumers?
 

Okuu_Fusion

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I really don't like anything in 3D that requires glasses to see... Since I already wear glasses, I'd have two wear to pairs, which is annoying...

The 3DS sounds interesting I guess... but haven't really been into anything Nintendo related since the SNES...

3D films, like Avatar... Well... The 3D part looked very 80's arcadey... Like it had a mild strobe effect... not sure if anyone saw this too... Also the whole sweet spot thing is annoying... I'm afraid I may go cross eyed...
 

Pegghead

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I entirely agree, if 3D were to become commonplace in videogames then I'd have to play them less due to the physical eyestrain that pointless, gimmicky extra dimension brings.
 

Wolfram23

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OP: You don't seem to understand how depth perception works. Let me give you a quick refresher. Your eyes are a certain distance apart. When you see through both eyes, they're actually picking up 2 images that are slightly different. You can notice this by alternating which eye you look through (winking each eye). Your brain takes the horizontal separation of any given object, and turns that into depth perception. If you attempt to look through 1 eye only, you'll find that it's difficult to judge depth (shadows tend to make this less apparent so hopefully when you go trying to poke stuff you won't see your finger's shadow. Then you'll find that you think you should be touching the object long before you actually do).

So, how does 3D television work? The ones with shutter glasses work by flashing the "two" images (one per eye) and at the same time each lense on the glasses flickers. This allows each eye to see a different image, and once again your brain can put together that horizontal difference and turn it into depth perception. It works and looks as real as life.

The other method is that used in theaters. There are actually 2 projectors with polarized lenses. Each eye piece in the special glasses you wear are polarized as well. This way, each eye picks up the image from only 1 projector and the same horizontal translation takes place in your brain. This method is more passive and more comfortable.

There's actually another method I don't quite understand, being used in the Nintendo 3DS.

Old tech for simulating 3D was shit. That's why it didn't catch on. It didn't even look 3D. The new tech is good and looks great, but there is a small percentage of people who either experience discomfort or can't see the 3D effect.

I will say one thing tho, that Samsung add sounds like it sucks balls and I agree with how stupid it is.

EDIT: Just a quick comment on video games in 3D. It's extremely easy and wouldn't put much of a dent into production time and/or game quality. In movies it's different because they need to have 2 separate cameras synced up, but in games it's just virtual cameras. Simply set the virtual cameras apart to simulate where eyes might be and it's done. The hardest part is that the video card needs to be able to pump out a very high framerate for it to look it's best (120hz, for 60hz per eye).
 

DrPoopenstein

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SirBryghtside said:
I guess the point I'm trying to make is that it was, undeniably, far too slow. HD is supposed to take over the industry... but I'm seeing no sign of that. The channels simply haven't shown enough commitment to go with it. Ultimately, I guess what I'm saying is that there should be some commitment for them to end up with 3D channels before going ahead. Otherwise, it ends up much too slow to be able to change a thing for years.
HD content has grown at a faster rate than HD ownership and every major channel/network is in high def. Not sure what more "commitment to go with it" you could want other than a free HDTV.

Are you old enough to remember Betamax?
 

tjspeirs

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Wolfram01 said:
OP: You don't seem to understand how depth perception works. (etc)
I understand depth perception perfectly well. As I said, if stereoscope can be done without causing pain or otherwise being obstructive in some way, then sure, go ahead. But it's no use to games. That very point, about the video cards having to be that step above, is a detriment.