Does Dark = Good?

Recommended Videos

endtherapture

New member
Nov 14, 2011
3,127
0
0
Recently I've been noticing a trend of things to becoming dark.

You can see this in a lot of recent media - the last of the Star Wars prequels, the later Harry Potter films, and of course the ending of Mass Effect 3. You can often converse with someone and ask about how good something is, and they'll be like "Well it was the darkest of the films." Is Dark equated with good though?

The later Harry Potter films were darker, but I definitely preferred the older ones with their childlike charm. Give me A New Hope over Revenge of the Sith anyday!

You can see this in videogames too - Dragon Age: Origins was a fairly standard save-the-world fantasy game which was great (and not particularly dark, had difficult decisions though), and then Dragon Age 2 went all dark with torture and slavery and necrophilia and stuff, but it was definitely not the better game. Same with Mass Effect, the first two games were standard space opera, but then the third shoves out an out-of-place "dark" ending down our throats.

Lord of the Rings wasn't dark but its a timeless classic and the films are great - I doubt it would have improved by an ending where Sauron wins and murders everyone, and the last film consisted of rape of Elven women by Orcs and a brooding suicidal Legolas.

Not saying "dark" isn't bad, The Witcher 2 was a great game but it was handled in a mature fashion, as opposed to just shoving in blood and darkness and sex and stuff - it was mature which meant it could handle the "dark" subject matter easily. This runs parallel to 40k which is so grimdark that it's pretty much a self parody of itself, the lack of seriousness in 40k makes the grimdark better.

So yeah, do you think there's a tendency in media to equate dark with good, and therefore make everything dark? Do you even think dark is good?Do you enjoy dark stories or less dark ones?
 

DrWilhelm

New member
May 5, 2009
151
0
0
There's a definite perception going around that happy endings and the like are cliche, so everything needs to be dark and edgy. Rubbish of course, because all that means is that dark and edgy will become the new cliche, assuming happy endings ever were cliche in the first place. Personally I don't really give a damn either way as long as the tone fits the story, and that the story is well told.
 

Dandark

New member
Sep 2, 2011
1,706
0
0
I can enjoy dark stories and I usaully do appreciate story that is mature in how it handles things which means there may be dark moments at times. However lots of series now are just trying to be "Dark" and failing. It's actully gotten really annoying recently, ME3 is a great example of writers trying to throw in "Dark" elements because it's so much better than all those crappy cliche happy endings that all the babies and sheeple want.

It isn't "dark" stories that I like, it's mature ones which may or may not have "dark" elements. Not every story needs them. Having it shoehorned in can actully make it worse.
 

Zhukov

The Laughing Arsehole
Dec 29, 2009
13,769
5
43
You seem to be lumping grim, bleak, mature and serious under the term "dark".

They're not all the same.
 

Tazzy da Devil

New member
Sep 9, 2011
286
0
0
Dark can be good, but it's being overdone lately. Personally, I prefer things with a lighter tone with the occasional dark element. If everything's all, it gets boring and loses impact. Know what does it right? The Lion King. Everything's all happy and optimistic and then BAM! Mufasa dies.

captcha: heart break. How appropriate :)
 

endtherapture

New member
Nov 14, 2011
3,127
0
0
Tazzy da Devil said:
Dark can be good, but it's being overdone lately. Personally, I prefer things with a lighter tone with the occasional dark element. If everything's all, it gets boring and loses impact. Know what does it right? The Lion King. Everything's all happy and optimistic and then BAM! Mufasa dies.

captcha: heart break. How appropriate :)
That's a bloody good example.

Original Star Wars is pretty good too - I mean Luke's family gets massacred, two planets get blown up, Obi-wan dies and the entire Rebel attack force apart from like Wedge and Luke, dies, but there's still a happy outlook and ending and it's a light hearted space adventure film.
 

Goofguy

New member
Nov 25, 2010
3,864
0
0
When it comes to various series, it almost necessitates being 'dark'.

Look at Mass Effect, the first two games were about the threat of an attack by some mystical race. The last game had you deal with this enemy head on. It can't just be your standard 'blow it up kid and let's go home' fare when the fate of the galaxy is on the line.

Harry Potter had to get darker as the series progressed. The first few books/movies were about the innocence of youth and really, the kind of blissful ignorance that comes with it. As Harry and his friends got older, the stakes got higher. He learned the true nature of his origins and his past and he slowly began to realize what was required of him. I would have been insulted if The Deathly Hallows was just a fun romp through an other year at Hogwarts... again.

Sure, some series may over-do but it's not like it's a bad thing.
 

Popadoo

New member
May 17, 2010
1,025
0
0
It seems to me it's a way to seem more mature and deep without actually putting more thought into the writing and story.
''Hey guys, I want to make it meaningful and... I just don't know ho-''
''KILL OFF SOME CHARACTERS!''
''I don't think th-''
''ADD A MISTY FOREST SCENE.''
''Now you're not making any sens-''
''MORE AANNGGSSTT!!''
 

Cranky

New member
Mar 12, 2012
321
0
0
Nah, unless it's pulled off well or done in a way that makes sense, Dark is bullshit.
 

Kahunaburger

New member
May 6, 2011
4,141
0
0
Like any tone, it can be good or bad. I do agree that tonal shifts in the middle of a series frequently don't work very well.
 

fnlrpa

New member
Dec 14, 2010
213
0
0
Warhammer 40k is a good example of ways 'dark' can go. Dan Abnett can write a dark story well while some other authors just aren't good writers and just make it "dark"
 

endtherapture

New member
Nov 14, 2011
3,127
0
0
fnlrpa said:
Warhammer 40k is a good example of ways 'dark' can go. Dan Abnett can write a dark story well while some other authors just aren't good writers and just make it "dark"
Dan Abnett actually writes compelling characters in the 40k universe as opposed to just power armoured action porn
 

fnlrpa

New member
Dec 14, 2010
213
0
0
endtherapture said:
fnlrpa said:
Warhammer 40k is a good example of ways 'dark' can go. Dan Abnett can write a dark story well while some other authors just aren't good writers and just make it "dark"
Dan Abnett actually writes compelling characters in the 40k universe as opposed to just power armoured action porn
I completely agree. I also think that Graham McNeil is good. He made the ultramarines into compelling characters
 

Malty Milk Whistle

New member
Oct 29, 2011
617
0
0
fnlrpa said:
endtherapture said:
fnlrpa said:
Warhammer 40k is a good example of ways 'dark' can go. Dan Abnett can write a dark story well while some other authors just aren't good writers and just make it "dark"
Dan Abnett actually writes compelling characters in the 40k universe as opposed to just power armoured action porn
I completely agree. I also think that Graham McNeil is good. He made the ultramarines into compelling characters
Pfffffffft, what about Ciphias Cain HERO OF THE IMPERIUM?
I actually really enjoyed those books.
 

fnlrpa

New member
Dec 14, 2010
213
0
0
Malty Milk Whistle said:
fnlrpa said:
endtherapture said:
fnlrpa said:
Warhammer 40k is a good example of ways 'dark' can go. Dan Abnett can write a dark story well while some other authors just aren't good writers and just make it "dark"
Dan Abnett actually writes compelling characters in the 40k universe as opposed to just power armoured action porn
I completely agree. I also think that Graham McNeil is good. He made the ultramarines into compelling characters
Pfffffffft, what about Ciphias Cain HERO OF THE IMPERIUM?
I actually really enjoyed those books.
I enjoyed those as well. I especially enjoy amberly's footnotes
 

F'Angus

New member
Nov 18, 2009
1,102
0
0
Not always...it really depends on your preferences.

For example I much preferred the last Harry Potter film because it actually stuck to the book and I like the dark... but then I also prefer to watch Spiderman 1 + 2 over 3, and I'd prefer to to watch them over Nolan's Batman..and I'm sure people would disagree with me because of their particular preference.