With the numerous game critics on the net, including ones on this site, I sometimes feel stupid and embarrassed for liking plenty of games or games at all. For example, if Yahtzee can verbally rip apart my favorite game whatever it is, am I dumb for choosing to still like or love it? Does a deep critical analysis of a game that reveals serious tonal issues invalidate the opinions of those who loved the game?
Does Snarkiness Trump Liking A Game?
- Thread starter Joey Bolzenius
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You're allowed to disagree with a popular critic y'know.
I enjoy Yahtzee's stuff, but God knows I don't agree with everything the man says. Doesn't make it any less fun to enjoy a chuckle at his issues with a game I like. For example, I loved Mirror's Edge while he called it a "six hour waterslide of piss" or something. One of his main problems was not being able to platform in first person, something I never had trouble with.
You're also allowed to be of the opinion that the game's good points are enough to make up for the stuff that the critic is annoyed with. For example... can't think of one off the top of my head, but you get the idea.
I enjoy Yahtzee's stuff, but God knows I don't agree with everything the man says. Doesn't make it any less fun to enjoy a chuckle at his issues with a game I like. For example, I loved Mirror's Edge while he called it a "six hour waterslide of piss" or something. One of his main problems was not being able to platform in first person, something I never had trouble with.
You're also allowed to be of the opinion that the game's good points are enough to make up for the stuff that the critic is annoyed with. For example... can't think of one off the top of my head, but you get the idea.
Not really. If you have fun with a game, nobody should take that away from you. And it would be rude to seriously try.
However, that said, enjoying a game should not prevent you from critically analysing it, nor from understanding or appreciating the grievances/analyses of others.
For example, Skyrim has probably been my favourite game of the previous generation. But I understand that it was a buggy mess at launch, and still has problems after numerous patches, pieces of DLC, and unofficial patches. The game also suffers on consoles, especially PS3 because of RAM issues and lack of mods. And it's significantly improved by mods. So that sucks for console players.
But even if I understand all of that, screw it. Nobody can take away the 500+ hours I've spent having fun in that game.
However, that said, enjoying a game should not prevent you from critically analysing it, nor from understanding or appreciating the grievances/analyses of others.
For example, Skyrim has probably been my favourite game of the previous generation. But I understand that it was a buggy mess at launch, and still has problems after numerous patches, pieces of DLC, and unofficial patches. The game also suffers on consoles, especially PS3 because of RAM issues and lack of mods. And it's significantly improved by mods. So that sucks for console players.
But even if I understand all of that, screw it. Nobody can take away the 500+ hours I've spent having fun in that game.
No...no you are not dumb for liking it.
I suppose if you blindly love something while shouting down any criticism would make you kind of dumb but there are so many things that I like that The Escapist (or everyone pending what it is) seems to absolutely hate. Would you like a list for I have no shame at all in the crap I like?
I suppose if you blindly love something while shouting down any criticism would make you kind of dumb but there are so many things that I like that The Escapist (or everyone pending what it is) seems to absolutely hate. Would you like a list for I have no shame at all in the crap I like?
No, being snarky about a game is just more popular than saying you like a game.
There's always going to be a larger focus on what doesn't work as opposed to what does, because we're always looking for ways to better ourselves, even our videogames. There's plenty of stuff I like that I could rip to shreds with a critical analysis, that doesn't mean I don't still love it. The fact that I am so critical of it is because I love it.
It can suck when somebody else rips into your favourite media, especially when they only focus on the bad or they're way off. But you need to remind yourself that theirs is just another opinion in the end.
Yahtzee is just a dude playing games, just like you, me, and everybody else (who play videogames).
There's always going to be a larger focus on what doesn't work as opposed to what does, because we're always looking for ways to better ourselves, even our videogames. There's plenty of stuff I like that I could rip to shreds with a critical analysis, that doesn't mean I don't still love it. The fact that I am so critical of it is because I love it.
It can suck when somebody else rips into your favourite media, especially when they only focus on the bad or they're way off. But you need to remind yourself that theirs is just another opinion in the end.
Yahtzee is just a dude playing games, just like you, me, and everybody else (who play videogames).
Funnily enough Yahtzee actually put it the best way:
If you truly love a particular game, then negative criticism from some critic you'll probably never meet shouldn't bother you or detract from your experience of the game, unless there's a thought in the back of your mind that's telling you that your beloved game isn't as great as you tell yourself it is.
Ripping into a game can possibly help remove any illusions I've placed on a game, and help to ultimately show me how bad or bland a game really is. However, just because someone on the internet posts a snarky comment about a game you like doesn't mean you should follow suit. Fuck, even if everyone on the internet likes and agrees with said snarky comment, you shouldn't follow suit. What you like is what you like, and no one can take that from you. It's always possible you're liking something for the wrong reasons, or you're liking something because of some superficial reason, but if you honestly like something and recognize it as a sincere joy for the product, then snarky comments shouldn't change how you ultimately feel.
If you truly love a particular game, then negative criticism from some critic you'll probably never meet shouldn't bother you or detract from your experience of the game, unless there's a thought in the back of your mind that's telling you that your beloved game isn't as great as you tell yourself it is.
Ripping into a game can possibly help remove any illusions I've placed on a game, and help to ultimately show me how bad or bland a game really is. However, just because someone on the internet posts a snarky comment about a game you like doesn't mean you should follow suit. Fuck, even if everyone on the internet likes and agrees with said snarky comment, you shouldn't follow suit. What you like is what you like, and no one can take that from you. It's always possible you're liking something for the wrong reasons, or you're liking something because of some superficial reason, but if you honestly like something and recognize it as a sincere joy for the product, then snarky comments shouldn't change how you ultimately feel.
No. While I deeply admire Mr. Croshaw and would be mortified if anyone thinks what I'm about to say is intended to belittle him, he is not only a critic, he is also a comedic performer with a specific style and set of skills who has learned that negativity gets more laughs and therefore more money than positivity does. This doesn't invalidate his opinions, but I believe the man himself has said at least once he will overstate a problem for the sake of comedy, so you should probably adjust his hate down a notch to get at his opinion of a game...if you're particularly desperate to make your opinion align with his, anyway.Joey Bolzenius said:
Opinions cannot be invalidated: they are matters of personal taste, and are therefore automatically valid. All it reveals is that you either do not notice the problems described or else prioritize them low enough under other factors that you still enjoy the game.Joey Bolzenius said:
A successful critic is just someone who is able to argue their opinion in a very analytic, organized fashion and in such a way that people find it entertaining.
That's a great skill, but the operative phrase there is still 'argue their opinion'. Every critic has their biases, even ones like Yahtzee who have an even handed approach like talking a required amount of shit about any game they play. He hates multiplayer, first person shooters, etc, and despite his 'ripping the shit' approach, you can still tell when he likes a game. Besides, you can like something in spite of flaws it has. Never feel stupid for enjoying something. Hell, I like the second and third Pirates of the Caribbean movies, the Star Wars Prequels and the Matrix sequels, even though I'm quite aware of their flaws (although I think the flaws in the Pirates sequels (except stranger tides) are waaaaay exaggerated.
That's a great skill, but the operative phrase there is still 'argue their opinion'. Every critic has their biases, even ones like Yahtzee who have an even handed approach like talking a required amount of shit about any game they play. He hates multiplayer, first person shooters, etc, and despite his 'ripping the shit' approach, you can still tell when he likes a game. Besides, you can like something in spite of flaws it has. Never feel stupid for enjoying something. Hell, I like the second and third Pirates of the Caribbean movies, the Star Wars Prequels and the Matrix sequels, even though I'm quite aware of their flaws (although I think the flaws in the Pirates sequels (except stranger tides) are waaaaay exaggerated.
Yahtzee's reviews are comedy first and foremost. I watch them for the entertainment value, but they very rarely have any influence at all on my interest in a game. And honestly, even the very 'serious' critics shouldn't have that much influence on your decisions. Think for yourself, investigate the games, movies, t.v shows that sound interesting to you and make up your own mind. And don't let anyone tell you that you're wrong for enjoying what you enjoy, that's not up to them to decide.
...I'd like to see that list.tippy2k2 said:No...no you are not dumb for liking it.
I suppose if you blindly love something while shouting down any criticism would make you kind of dumb but there are so many things that I like that The Escapist (or everyone pending what it is) seems to absolutely hate. Would you like a list for I have no shame at all in the crap I like?
OT: Dude don't worry if you like something and someone else doesn't. I for one absolutely adore BioShock Infinite. I also enjoy watching TotalBiscuit - someone who has significant criticisms of the game. I value the man's opinion but I don't always agree with it. The fact that he didn't like it as much as me has no effect on my enjoyment of the game.
Also:
This. Yahtzee over exaggerates his criticism on purpose for our entertainment. Even if he really enjoyed a game he will still poke holes in it because that's what his audience wants to see.AldUK said:
Yah! I haven't done one of these in a while.Drummodino said:...I'd like to see that list.tippy2k2 said:No...no you are not dumb for liking it.
I suppose if you blindly love something while shouting down any criticism would make you kind of dumb but there are so many things that I like that The Escapist (or everyone pending what it is) seems to absolutely hate. Would you like a list for I have no shame at all in the crap I like?
OP, if you feel like an idiot for liking things other people rip, prepare to be happy again (some of these are hated here on Ze Escapist and others are just kind of hated:
Dragon Age 2
Military Shooter Single Player (Call of Duty and Battlefield specifically)
The Mass Effect 3 ending (the original one) was the perfect ending to that series
The Matrix Trilogy (yes, all three of them)
Nickelback
Linkin Park (do people hate LP? I'm never sure...)
The FIFA series (and soccer in general if you're 'Merican)
The Madden series (and football in general if you're...'pean? Does that work like 'Merica?)
Fight Night (boxing video game series)
Prometheus
White House Down (incredibly under-rated. It's a Die Hard movie more or less)
Boondock Saints 2 (fans of 1 LOVE this or HATE this so I'm writing it in)
I thought Fire Emblem Awakening was not very good
Hitman: Absolution
Saints Row 3
Ke$ha (or however I'm supposed to spell her name)
Also note: I'll just keep adding stuff to this list as I get bored
Military Shooter Single Player (Call of Duty and Battlefield specifically)
The Mass Effect 3 ending (the original one) was the perfect ending to that series
The Matrix Trilogy (yes, all three of them)
Nickelback
Linkin Park (do people hate LP? I'm never sure...)
The FIFA series (and soccer in general if you're 'Merican)
The Madden series (and football in general if you're...'pean? Does that work like 'Merica?)
Fight Night (boxing video game series)
Prometheus
White House Down (incredibly under-rated. It's a Die Hard movie more or less)
Boondock Saints 2 (fans of 1 LOVE this or HATE this so I'm writing it in)
I thought Fire Emblem Awakening was not very good
Hitman: Absolution
Saints Row 3
Ke$ha (or however I'm supposed to spell her name)
Also note: I'll just keep adding stuff to this list as I get bored
Don't forget that snarkiness translates to being a dick, it just doesn't sound as bad so the dicks feel better. Don't let dicks tell you what to think.Joey Bolzenius said:
Yay you indulged me! That is quite a lot of hate material there, although I don't think you can say FIFA and Madden are hated. They are adored by their target audience.tippy2k2 said:Yah! I haven't done one of these in a while.
OP, if you feel like an idiot for liking things other people rip, prepare to be happy again (some of these are hated here on Ze Escapist and others are just kind of hated:
There's probably a lot more but if I haven't hit something you absolutely hated yet, you may be a robot like meDragon Age 2
Military Shooter Single Player (Call of Duty and Battlefield specifically)
The Mass Effect 3 ending (the original one) was the perfect ending to that series
Nickelback
Linkin Park (do people hate LP? I'm never sure...)
The FIFA series (and soccer in general if you're 'Merican)
The Madden series (and football in general if you're...'pean? Does that work like 'Merica?)
Prometheus
White House Down (incredibly under-rated. It's a Die Hard movie more or less)
Boondock Saints 2 (fans of 1 LOVE this or HATE this so I'm writing it in)
I thought Fire Emblem Awakening was not very good
Saints Row 3
Ke$ha (or however I'm supposed to spell her name)
Guilty confession: Linkin Park are one of my favorite bands (excluding that god awful dubstep remix album they just released). I was one of the few who liked A Thousand Suns and Living Things.
Not in the least. I insist that Serious Sam 2 is one of the funnest shooters of all time, & no one will convince me otherwise. & I also do not get the hate for Fable: The Lost chapters.
Is this a serious post? I really can't tell. If it is, you REALLY, REALLY need to work on your self-esteem and be less swayed by other people.Joey Bolzenius said:
You like what you like. If you like something, it should be virtually impossible to retrospectively ruin it for you (unless you learn it's causing actual harm to someone [as in, ACTUAL harm]). Ever heard of "guilty pleasures"? They're things that you thoroughly enjoy while being fully aware that they're bad, or even atrocious.
not really.
critics are there to help consumers make informed purchases and game designers to catch out the flaws with their products and improve their performance. Their opinion, however, is just that. an opinion. Whether you like a game or not is entirely up to you and there's nothing wrong with liking a game that a critic doesn't. There's more than one critic out there, you know, and each one of them enjoys different things about their games.
For example, I tend to disagree with Totalbiscuit a lot. I like a lot of the games that he doesn't and vice versa and I can't relate to his opinions on the industry but but that doesn't make any of said opinions any less valid and it doesn't make me respect the guy any less.
Critics are just people. People have opinions (god am I getting sick of that word). Just like you do. And that is perfectly ok. Well... at least as long as those opinions are well thought-out and supported with valid arguments.
critics are there to help consumers make informed purchases and game designers to catch out the flaws with their products and improve their performance. Their opinion, however, is just that. an opinion. Whether you like a game or not is entirely up to you and there's nothing wrong with liking a game that a critic doesn't. There's more than one critic out there, you know, and each one of them enjoys different things about their games.
For example, I tend to disagree with Totalbiscuit a lot. I like a lot of the games that he doesn't and vice versa and I can't relate to his opinions on the industry but but that doesn't make any of said opinions any less valid and it doesn't make me respect the guy any less.
Critics are just people. People have opinions (god am I getting sick of that word). Just like you do. And that is perfectly ok. Well... at least as long as those opinions are well thought-out and supported with valid arguments.