EA Screws Over PS3 Gamers

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Debatra

Kaedanis Pyran
Sep 6, 2008
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http://forums.n4g.com/Cross-game-chat-and-why-it39s-currently-MIA-m700070.aspx

The following post by an inside source was made about twelve hours ago:

I promised you all an update on Cross-Game chat, so here it is.

And you're not going to like it.


As I told you before, Cross-game voice chat has been in the works for a while now. I mentioned last time that it was on target for 3.0 providing that we didn't hit any snags. Well guess what, we hit a snag! An all too familiar snag.

Time for a history lesson.

How many of you remember what it was like before FW 2.4? That's right - no in-game XMB. No custom soundtracks. In-game XMB was the most heavily requested feature at the time and we worked tirelessly in order to get it in (By "we", I mean Sony Japan - as I said before, FW isn't my department). It very nearly didn't happen, you have no idea how difficult it is to backport a feature like that onto a system (the game) that doesn't even know its there, but somehow we managed it. Well, for most titles. There are still the odd few titles out there that don't support in-game XMB ("black" titles).
Custom soundtracks was another one we had working in nearly every title. Obviously it was never going to work in black titles, but about 95% of the titles that worked well with the in-game XMB, had custom sountracks working as well.

So what happened? Why is it that titles HAVE to be developed specifically with custom soundtrack support when it was working more or less just fine?

Is it because Microsoft owns the patent on custom soundtracks in games?

This is something that makes me laugh every time I see one of the less educated ones spouting it off. That's an absolute fabrication. Patents don't matter, Sony as a while infringes upon thousands of patents through the whole company, both hardware and software. If you infringe a patent, you pay royalties to the owner or find a different way of doing the same thing that doesn't infringe. That's it. Microsoft infringes upon all kinds of patents we own but that's up to legal to sort out.

No, the reason we had to drop Custom soundtrack support like that has nothing to do with Microsoft. It does, however, involve a different company. A rather large company.
You see, one of their games happened to fall into the 5% that didn't support in-game custom soundtracks. And they did not like this.
When they found out that a new firmware update was going to suddenly make one of their games look inferior to just about every other game released, they protested. A lot.
They threatened everything, from legal action to dropping support for the PS3 all together.

What could we do? There was almost no way of getting it to work correctly due to the way their game was made (i.e. Poorly) and we certainly couldn't leave a broken implementation in there. That's when the hard decision was made to remove all support for older titles and instead adopt the "opt-in" approach that, to this day, most developers simply ignore. I have to hand this to Microsoft - they did their system right from the beginning and by completely separating it from the developers, they have universal support. Its very unlikely that you'll ever see mandatory support for custom soundtracks in games on our system, I'm afraid.
So yeah, lets nail this on the head: The next time someone starts blaming Microsoft for something the PS3 doesn't have, tell them they're an idiot, they don't know what they're talking about. Are we clear on this? This is a pet peeve of mine because while everyone's happy to go around blaming Microsoft, the real culprits are getting off scott-free. Of course, I can't actually name them directly or, should I get caught, I might even get done for slander (you can never be too careful), but you can figure it out - it's not Activision and they have a poor history with the PS3.

So what has this got to do with Cross-game voice chat?

Guess.

I warned you that we might hit a snag and we did. We've found a couple of titles that just don't like it. Similar to the custom soundtrack fiasco, it can cause lag, crashes, desyncronisation (very very bad when this happens), you name it. It can't be used in these games and it just so happens that some of these games are owned by the same company I've been talking about above.
So we're in a predicament: Cross-game chat is useless if only certain games support it. It's not too bad if its just the odd one that doesn't like it, but at this rate we'd have to drop support for the ENTIRE back catalogue, which would (As I said) make the whole thing useless.
Furthermore, we can't rely on developers to implement direct support for it. It didn't work with Custom Soundtracks, so why would it work here?
So right now, we're trying every little trick in the book to find a solution that works for everyone, but don't hold your breath on this one, so far it looks like the best you're going to get is a gimped implementation of it that only works with a handful of new games.

Now as I said, FW isn't actually my department and even I'm not supposed to know some of this stuff, but this is actually where we are right now. It sucks majorly, but there you have it. Depending on the end result, it could come in FW 3.1 or it could come in FW 4.0, hell it might not even come at all but rest assured they are working very hard on it. And if it doesn't come, you know who to blame.
Then, after six pages of guesswork on the parts of the forumers:

http://forums.n4g.com/Cross-game-chat-and-why-it39s-currently-MIA-m700070-p7.aspx

Some of you people could really do with learning to read. I specifically said it was NOT Activision. I thought I gave enough hints as to who it was without directly stating it, but I guess not, so lets try this again, except we'll make it interesting. Here lies the answers, lets see who is clever enough to figure it out?
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As for those curious as to why I would call the whistle on this, tell me good sir, what would you do? You have a vested interest in the company you work for and you see this other company constantly getting in the way. Oh sure, on the outside everyone's all buddy-buddy, but that's just good business. And that's what it boils down to - business. Why fix something that doesn't need to be fixed when you can just **** over everyone else and get away with it? You know Sony isn't going to make a huge fuss, they can't afford to alienate publishers and developers (especially HUGE ones), not when Microsoft and Nintendo are happy to welcome them with open arms. Still, all our hard work and it just gets pissed down the drain because one company can't be bothered doing some support? I ask you again - what would you do?

Oh and I appreciate all of you guys trying to spread this around, I hope that they'll back track and enable that feature for as many titles as
The seemingly gibberish portion isn't gibberish at all, but rather Base64. The translation:

It's not Activision.
It's not Ubisoft.
It's not Capcom.
It's not Insomniac.
It's not Konami.
It's not Take 2.
It's not Midway.
It's not Squaresoft.

are wE All getting the picture yet?

One point I want to reiterate - there's a difference between the games that didn't work with in-game XMB and the games that DID work with in-game XMB but DIDN'T work well with custom soundtracks, so stop picking out the ones that simply didn't do in-game XMB.

Also, it wasn't just ONE game that caused this, either. Although one title does come to mind and it wasn't even what you or I would call a "Big" game. I'll give you a hint: HPatOofP.
In many, myself included, the reaction was along the lines of "Death to EA!!!" or "Boycott EA!!!"

And, my personal favorite, "Death to EA!!! Kill it with Fire!!!"

Thoughts?
 

LordGarbageMan

New member
Jul 24, 2009
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Im not gonna read all that I'm too lazy but EA screws everyone over by making shit games.

Edit: Army of Two and Dead Space were good ideas but got WAY too boring.
 

QuirkyTambourine

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Jul 26, 2009
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Interesting, I'm apparently wayy out of the loop on my PS3, what is Cross Talk?

I was wondering just yesterday why my PS3 didn't have a custom soundtrack feature, when even my old XBox. Thanks "EA" or whoever the publisher is who caused all this.

Anyone know what the game title was?
 

Markness

Senior Member
Apr 23, 2008
565
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Whats this cross game chat and custom soundtracks? I don't get it, what is EA denying you.
 

Osaka-chaness

New member
Jul 4, 2009
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QuirkyTambourine said:
Interesting, I'm apparently wayy out of the loop on my PS3, what is Cross Talk? I was wondering just yesterday why my PS3 didn't have a custom soundtrack feature, when even my old XBox. Thanks "EA" or whoever the publisher is who caused all this.

Anyone know what the game title was?
Cross Talk is like what the 360 has where if a friend of yours is playing, say, Call of Duty 4, and you are playing, say, Call of Duty: World at War, you could both talk to each other. The PS3 only allows that if you're A) In the same in game "party" as your friend or B) You're both not playing a game and using the voice chat that the PS3 has (which you're unable to use while playing a game).

Oh and as for the custom soundtrack thing...some games have it. Killzone 2 online and Burnout Paradise, among a few other games, let you listen to music you have on your PS3. So it's not exactly the publisher's fault, it's the game designers for not putting it in...which, if you complain about that, is stupid. Take out your iPod, turn the game music volume down, and turn on your music, and there you go. It's not like it's that hard to do xP
 

QuirkyTambourine

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Jul 26, 2009
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Osaka-chaness said:
QuirkyTambourine said:
Interesting, I'm apparently wayy out of the loop on my PS3, what is Cross Talk? I was wondering just yesterday why my PS3 didn't have a custom soundtrack feature, when even my old XBox. Thanks "EA" or whoever the publisher is who caused all this.

Anyone know what the game title was?
Cross Talk is like what the 360 has where if a friend of yours is playing, say, Call of Duty 4, and you are playing, say, Call of Duty: World at War, you could both talk to each other. The PS3 only allows that if you're A) In the same in game "party" as your friend or B) You're both not playing a game and using the voice chat that the PS3 has (which you're unable to use while playing a game).

Oh and as for the custom soundtrack thing...some games have it. Killzone 2 online and Burnout Paradise, among a few other games, let you listen to music you have on your PS3. So it's not exactly the publisher's fault, it's the game designers for not putting it in...which, if you complain about that, is stupid. Take out your iPod, turn the music volume down, and turn on your music, and there you go. It's not like it's that hard to do xP
Oh that does sound pretty cool, and I guess the game was the Order of the Phoenix game for the PS3. Really interesting thread
 

Osaka-chaness

New member
Jul 4, 2009
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QuirkyTambourine said:
Osaka-chaness said:
QuirkyTambourine said:
Interesting, I'm apparently wayy out of the loop on my PS3, what is Cross Talk? I was wondering just yesterday why my PS3 didn't have a custom soundtrack feature, when even my old XBox. Thanks "EA" or whoever the publisher is who caused all this.

Anyone know what the game title was?
Cross Talk is like what the 360 has where if a friend of yours is playing, say, Call of Duty 4, and you are playing, say, Call of Duty: World at War, you could both talk to each other. The PS3 only allows that if you're A) In the same in game "party" as your friend or B) You're both not playing a game and using the voice chat that the PS3 has (which you're unable to use while playing a game).

Oh and as for the custom soundtrack thing...some games have it. Killzone 2 online and Burnout Paradise, among a few other games, let you listen to music you have on your PS3. So it's not exactly the publisher's fault, it's the game designers for not putting it in...which, if you complain about that, is stupid. Take out your iPod, turn the music volume down, and turn on your music, and there you go. It's not like it's that hard to do xP
Oh that does sound pretty cool, and I guess the game was the Order of the Phoenix game for the PS3. Really interesting thread
Oh and I forgot to mention...EA published Burnout Paradise xD
 

LtFerret

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Jun 4, 2009
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So people are overeacting to a small issue and calling out death threats

what else is new?

EDIT: I guess overeacting is a bit of an understatment
 
Jul 31, 2009
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Custom soundtracks: playing your own music stored on the hdd instead of the game's own music while playing, I guess.
Cross game chat: chatting to your friend while both playing a different game?

It's an interesting post (if this 'inside source' actually is one, at least), but the finger pointing isn't entirely justified if you ask me.
The fact that their entire back catalog would be unable to work with these implementations says more about sony's unwillingness to implement these, for a 'next gen' gaming console, quite basic features from the start. If they had provided it earlier, developers could have implemented it in their games right away. You cannot blame people for not using something that isn't there in the first place. That's not crappy programming. It's sloppy on sony's part.

On the other hand, it's not fair for a company to ***** and moan when the odd game doesn't seem to do it properly. So he has a point there.

It aren't features I'm necessarily looking for myself on my ps3, but having the option would certainly be plus.I do hope they'll fix it eventually.

Why won't they do like they did on the psp and use skype anyway? Wouldn't that solve some of the issues?
 

Debatra

Kaedanis Pyran
Sep 6, 2008
661
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The King And His Fool said:
(if this 'inside source' actually is one, at least)
While I personally can't vouch for him, some of the posters say that this guy's been right before.
 

Imat

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Feb 21, 2009
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I don't really get what the big deal is...So a company doesn't want their sales to drop because some other company came up with code that works well with everybody else's code but not with theirs? I honestly don't see that as EA being evil, I see that as EA trying it's hardest not to lose the market because somebody else's code makes their code not work.

The real evil is the propaganda you're spreading here by not mentioning that their sales would undoubtedly drop. How would you like to write a book and then, when you're finished, find out that some other language or genre was becoming more and more popular and threatened to stop all sales of your book? How do you think EA feels, putting a lot of work into coding a game (A game which, from what he's mentioned, works perfectly fine on it's own. And that's saying something, knowing what I do about game glitches and the like), and then somebody complains because the code they wrote breaks the code EA wrote. Not EA's fault. They shouldn't lose sales because of it. Otherwise everybody who is using a PC at this second should go complain to Microsoft because that virus they got while streaming...Adult materials...has caused some glitch in their machine (And Mac users, don't laugh. If the Mac ever becomes more widespread than the PC, viruses will find their way onto Macs as well. Not that that will happen, cuz PC's are just that much better ATM). Does it seem fair to blame Microsoft because you made a mistake and some loser created incompatible software? If it does, clearly you need to recheck what's fair and what ain't.

EA is not in the wrong to dislike this software. You are in the wrong for hating them for it, however.
 

Cryo84R

Gentleman Bastard.
Jun 27, 2009
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Sony is blaming other people for a lack of features that came out LAST generation?
What ever helps you sleep at night I guess.
 
Jul 31, 2009
84
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Imat said:
I don't really get what the big deal is...So a company doesn't want their sales to drop because some other company came up with code that works well with everybody else's code but not with theirs? I honestly don't see that as EA being evil, I see that as EA trying it's hardest not to lose the market because somebody else's code makes their code not work.

The real evil is the propaganda you're spreading here by not mentioning that their sales would undoubtedly drop. How would you like to write a book and then, when you're finished, find out that some other language or genre was becoming more and more popular and threatened to stop all sales of your book? How do you think EA feels, putting a lot of work into coding a game (A game which, from what he's mentioned, works perfectly fine on it's own. And that's saying something, knowing what I do about game glitches and the like), and then somebody complains because the code they wrote breaks the code EA wrote. Not EA's fault. They shouldn't lose sales because of it. Otherwise everybody who is using a PC at this second should go complain to Microsoft because that virus they got while streaming...Adult materials...has caused some glitch in their machine (And Mac users, don't laugh. If the Mac ever becomes more widespread than the PC, viruses will find their way onto Macs as well. Not that that will happen, cuz PC's are just that much better ATM). Does it seem fair to blame Microsoft because you made a mistake and some loser created incompatible software? If it does, clearly you need to recheck what's fair and what ain't.

EA is not in the wrong to dislike this software. You are in the wrong for hating them for it, however.
But it's a bit petty to say "If it doesn't work for this one game, it shouldn't work for any other either!". I can understand EA not being all to happy about it, but they can't really tell sony what feature's they are allowed to make for their gaming console, can they?
To continue with your book analogy, that'd be the same as saying that other genres and languages shouldn't be an option for writers. That's not their call to make.
 

Imat

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Feb 21, 2009
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The King And His Fool said:
Imat said:
I don't really get what the big deal is...So a company doesn't want their sales to drop because some other company came up with code that works well with everybody else's code but not with theirs? I honestly don't see that as EA being evil, I see that as EA trying it's hardest not to lose the market because somebody else's code makes their code not work.

The real evil is the propaganda you're spreading here by not mentioning that their sales would undoubtedly drop. How would you like to write a book and then, when you're finished, find out that some other language or genre was becoming more and more popular and threatened to stop all sales of your book? How do you think EA feels, putting a lot of work into coding a game (A game which, from what he's mentioned, works perfectly fine on it's own. And that's saying something, knowing what I do about game glitches and the like), and then somebody complains because the code they wrote breaks the code EA wrote. Not EA's fault. They shouldn't lose sales because of it. Otherwise everybody who is using a PC at this second should go complain to Microsoft because that virus they got while streaming...Adult materials...has caused some glitch in their machine (And Mac users, don't laugh. If the Mac ever becomes more widespread than the PC, viruses will find their way onto Macs as well. Not that that will happen, cuz PC's are just that much better ATM). Does it seem fair to blame Microsoft because you made a mistake and some loser created incompatible software? If it does, clearly you need to recheck what's fair and what ain't.

EA is not in the wrong to dislike this software. You are in the wrong for hating them for it, however.
But it's a bit petty to say "If it doesn't work for this one game, it shouldn't work for any other either!". I can understand EA not being all to happy about it, but they can't really tell sony what feature's they are allowed to make for their gaming console, can they?
To continue with your book analogy, that'd be the same as saying that other genres and languages shouldn't be an option for writers. That's not their call to make.
But it's not petty. It effects the sales of EA games, therefore they have a say in the matter. Just like how we have representation before taxation (Supposedly). And to further continue the book analogy, it's like that one new language or genre is trying to eliminate the other language/genre. Should they be allowed to do that because they're the big man on campus? I don't think so. Just because EA is little in this scenario doesn't mean they don't have the right to speak out against something which will undoubtedly hurt future sales.

It would be petty for EA to purposely continue this line of coding so that PS3's coding will always break their games and they will always have legal precedent to fight back. But trying to save current games is not petty, it's a business trying not to lose the millions of dollars they put into a game.
 

Citrus

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Apr 25, 2008
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I wish I knew what a custom soundtrack was. Playing your own music in place of the game's? Is that it?

If so, that's definitely not something to make a big deal out of.
 

Markness

Senior Member
Apr 23, 2008
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LtFerret said:
So people are overeacting to a small issue and calling out death threats

what else is new?

EDIT: I guess overeacting is a bit of an understatment
wow