EDIT: No Russian

Recommended Videos

urilukin

New member
May 16, 2011
84
0
0
So a long time ago I posted this : (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.304300-No-Russian?page=1)
fell free to comment on that post.

Anyway, I want to bring the subject back into the spotlight because almost all of the comments were about the No "Russian mission" and maybe that was a bad example what I wanted to say is that there is a VERY anti-Russian attitude in modern FPS's and we shouldn't make up excuses like "Oh,you know there was one good Russian dude the the game wasn't anti-Russian" for their shitty storytelling.
 
Aug 20, 2011
240
0
0
heh, I was just thinking about this. I rented MW3 (not gonna buy it), and it's just kind of wierd how the drone enemies are Russian soldiers. Not Russian terrorists, or extremists, or even commies, but regular Russian infantry men. Games do this a lot, using Russians as cannon fodder. I agree that the "no russian" level was a particularly egregious example. You know if it was set in the US there would have been a media tidal wave condemning the game, but since it was just Russians it was not really anything out of the ordinary.
 

TheIronRuler

New member
Mar 18, 2011
4,283
0
0
urilukin said:
So a long time ago I posted this : (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.304300-No-Russian?page=1)
fell free to comment on that post.

Anyway, I want to bring the subject back into the spotlight because almost all of the comments were about the No "Russian mission" and maybe that was a bad example what I wanted to say is that there is a VERY anti-Russian attitude in modern FPS's and we shouldn't make up excuses like "Oh,you know there was one good Russian dude the the game wasn't anti-Russian" for their shitty storytelling.
.
It's the cold war vibe that engulfs the teenage fantasies of gamers... like, twenty years ago.
They got tired or monsters and nazies, aliens were a bit of a stretch and terrorists were overplayed.
 

urilukin

New member
May 16, 2011
84
0
0
majora13 said:
heh, I was just thinking about this. I rented MW3 (not gonna buy it), and it's just kind of wierd how the drone enemies are Russian soldiers. Not Russian terrorists, or extremists, or even commies, but regular Russian infantry men. Games do this a lot, using Russians as cannon fodder. I agree that the "no russian" level was a particularly egregious example. You know if it was set in the US there would have been a media tidal wave condemning the game, but since it was just Russians it was not really anything out of the ordinary.
EXACTLY! if a game was released with Russians soldiers shooting American soldiers it would get slaughtered in the media and it does not matter if there are a few good Russian guys in your team at the end of the day you are an American soldier shooting Russians.
 

Ordinaryundone

New member
Oct 23, 2010
1,568
0
0
Actually, only a few missions in MW3 have you fighting the Russian army (who, by the way, are actively invading most of Europe and the US. It isn't like we are blowing up innocent bystanders here). The grand majority of the game is spent fighting Makarov's men, who are most definitely terrorists first, Russians second.

Why do Russians make a good enemy? For the exact reasons you mentioned. Of all the countries America has been at war with, Russia was our enemy the longest, and came the closest to a full scale nuclear war. Despite our friendly relationship with Russia now, it doesn't change the fact that within our parents lifetimes we were in a conflict that could have annihlated all of us. Heck, I'm sure some of the posters on this board can remember a time when Russia was THE bad guy. That sort of thing doesn't just fade out of public conciousness. Nazis are about the only stand in that works as well, being both a classic American enemy AND pretty much unarguably evil. But its been a long time since WWII, they just don't have the same resonance that they used to. Can't use the Chinese, because even though it makes more sense it also carries that dreaded "racism" subtext that people are so afraid of.

Why don't we see games featuring the Cold War from the other perspective? Because these games are made in America, and the majority of Americans might feel uncomfortable slaughtering their own countrymen, even if they are just digital stand-ins. I once showed my Grandfather CoD: WaW, particularly the Japanese campaign. He served in the Pacific, and I wanted his opinion on how accurate they got it. He actually had to leave the room from being so shaken at watching even a recreation of something that had effected him so badly. Its a good thing I didn't tell him that the multiplayer let you play as the Japanese killing Americans, or he would have probably gotten upset.

TLDR Russians are a good enemy because they are still fresh in the public conciousness AS an enemy, while still carrying enough of the silly 80's Red Dawn vibe that no one actually hates them.
 
Aug 20, 2011
240
0
0
Ordinaryundone said:
Actually, only a few missions in MW3 have you fighting the Russian army (who, by the way, are actively invading most of Europe and the US. It isn't like we are blowing up innocent bystanders here)
In MW3, yes. In MW2 you are exactly blowing up innocent bystanders.

I get your point, that it's a convenient target, but that doesn't make it right. Russia never attacked us, as bad as things got. And besides that Russia has been a western style democracy with diplomatic ties to the rest of the world for longer than most CoD players have been alive for. It makes sense to use Russians as target practice in games, because it's safe and easy. It's also extremely lazy and, in my opinion, in bad taste.
 

Ordinaryundone

New member
Oct 23, 2010
1,568
0
0
majora13 said:
Ordinaryundone said:
Actually, only a few missions in MW3 have you fighting the Russian army (who, by the way, are actively invading most of Europe and the US. It isn't like we are blowing up innocent bystanders here)
In MW3, yes. In MW2 you are exactly blowing up innocent bystanders.

I get your point, that it's a convenient target, but that doesn't make it right. Russia never attacked us, as bad as things got. And besides that Russia has been a western style democracy with diplomatic ties to the rest of the world for longer than most CoD players have been alive for. It makes sense to use Russians as target practice in games, because it's safe and easy. It's also extremely lazy and, in my opinion, in bad taste.
What do you mean innocent? They are invading the U.S.! Were the Rangers supposed to just let them waltz in?

Also, lol at Russia never attacking us. I guess they don't teach the Cuban Missle crisis in school anymore. Just because we weren't shooting directly at each other doesn't mean there wasn't a war on.
 

urilukin

New member
May 16, 2011
84
0
0
I get your point Ordinaryundone but as I said we shouldn't make up excuses like "they are a convenient enemy" reviewers should knok down points and gamers should demand better story and not just multiplayer.
 
Aug 20, 2011
240
0
0
Ordinaryundone said:
What do you mean innocent? They are invading the U.S.! Were the Rangers supposed to just let them waltz in?

Also, lol at Russia never attacking us. I guess they don't teach the Cuban Missle crisis in school anymore.
I was talking about the No Russian level. About the Cuban Missile crisis... Both sides did a lot of very stupid and risky things during that period. That incident was in response to the a US project with the ability to nuke Russian cities. It could be, and was, argued that the US intervention there was an act of war, and not the establishment of the bases in Cuba. Also, this was following a long US campaign of covert attacks on Cuba by the US. It's a complicated situation, neither side were completely innocent or completely in the wrong.
 

Phishfood

New member
Jul 21, 2009
743
0
0
Thing is, there is a reason the nazis and the communists are easy targets. They have traditionally been enemies of the US & EU, where most of these games are sold. Its probably not "right" to always pick on Russians or Germans, but what alternatives are there? Instead of attacking these games for doing it, lets think up some constructive alternatives.

Go the BF 2142 - Imply some sort of conglomeration of countries and leave it vague who started it all and who is in charge vs who was conquered/enslaved

The vague route - Never name your enemy and tie them to a country

Alien Invaders - Everyone loves shooting them right?

"Modern" Nazis - Make an alternate time-line where ww2 never ended. See, you can't use actual nazis because they want to make a modern game.

Zombies. Nuff said.

IMO all these alternatives are weaker in context. Aliens/zombies change the context completely. Nazis do not fit the criteria of modern. Made up enemies are just not as compelling as the idea of the world running out of fossil fuels so China/Russia starts a nuclear war.

TLDR:
No, its not fair to "pick" on the Russians, but its even less fair and believable to randomly say Italy has decided to invade the US.
 

tokae

New member
Mar 21, 2011
399
0
0
urilukin said:
So a long time ago I posted this : (http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.304300-No-Russian?page=1)
fell free to comment on that post.

Anyway, I want to bring the subject back into the spotlight because almost all of the comments were about the No "Russian mission" and maybe that was a bad example what I wanted to say is that there is a VERY anti-Russian attitude in modern FPS's and we shouldn't make up excuses like "Oh,you know there was one good Russian dude the the game wasn't anti-Russian" for their shitty storytelling.
You want the real reason? Fine, it's because people don't like what is different. A strong nation that is not very "american-friendly" Will be frowned upon by the west, sadly.
Russia is soon the single strongest nation on pur planet. Of-course people get abit "jittery".
That's not to say that I like it.. As a russian by blood I can't help feeling abit weird about the whole situation...

But meh, it's just games. Though beware of the Russian bear when the war finally comes. Reality is no game. :p
 
Jan 23, 2010
316
0
0
Ordinaryundone said:
majora13 said:
Ordinaryundone said:
Actually, only a few missions in MW3 have you fighting the Russian army (who, by the way, are actively invading most of Europe and the US. It isn't like we are blowing up innocent bystanders here)
In MW3, yes. In MW2 you are exactly blowing up innocent bystanders.

I get your point, that it's a convenient target, but that doesn't make it right. Russia never attacked us, as bad as things got. And besides that Russia has been a western style democracy with diplomatic ties to the rest of the world for longer than most CoD players have been alive for. It makes sense to use Russians as target practice in games, because it's safe and easy. It's also extremely lazy and, in my opinion, in bad taste.
What do you mean innocent? They are invading the U.S.! Were the Rangers supposed to just let them waltz in?
*cough* No Russian level? *cough*

Someone needs to read through the thread again properly, or at least inform themselves of the facts regarding certain games.
 
Aug 20, 2011
240
0
0
If they addressed this kind of issue in the game by acknowledging the moral dilemmas involved in going to war, it would be another thing altogether. In a big dumb war porn game like CoD it just feels callous. And that's only compounded by the fact that the Russians tend to get this treatment far more often than any modern nation.

I think the best solution would be to cast a non-government extremist militant group as the villains to avoid singling out an entire country. This would also be one of the more realistic options given the current state of the world.

Or ya know, just make North Korea the bad guys.
 

Black Arrow Officer

New member
Jun 20, 2011
676
0
0
You know what would be interesting? If the majority of Battlefield 3 was played from the viewpoint of the Russian GRU agents Kuril, Vladimir, and Dima. THAT would be an interesting viewpoint, especially if they're forced to do stuff such as shooting American soldiers. Would be much better than the terrorist whack-a-mole we have in so many games.
 

urilukin

New member
May 16, 2011
84
0
0
Bhaalspawn said:
I just realized. When the US finally debts themselves into oblivion, guess who will be the new global superpower?

Better start learning French.