Extra Credits v Harrasment On Xbox Live

[Euhan01]

Not sure if anybody has seen this already but thought I'd copy a message from Extra Credit's Facebook page -

"Microsoft has asked me to sit down with the enforcement team on Tuesday and talk to them about how we could resolve the harassment issues on Live.

Well done team."

For those who don't know, Extra Credits is a show that tries to put gaming in a positive light, and work out ways to improve the medium. Recently they did a show about the amount of harassment that happens on Xbox Live in particular, and asked people to tell Microsoft how they felt about the issue - and it seems like they have had some effect!

 

[Eddie the head]

The last time I saw Extra Credits brought up here it didn't end well.

 

[Kae]

Aye, a lot of us are familiar with the show since it used to be featured here, but anyway, yeah I saw that episode, glad to hear Microsoft has finally decided to do something about that, it's been going on for so long that I thought they didn't care, but can you mention anything about how the effect was on Microsoft, since I have no idea what this effect you are talking about is, have people started proposing solutions or something?

 

[Vrex360]

Well, good for them I guess. I have to be honest I really think their solutions for cleaning the Xbox Live gutter was actually pretty good. Auto mute players who get muted too many times, don't allow them the right to speak with strangers until they reach a certain level, make it so you can only communicate with people on your friend's list etc.

It's admittedly very heavily dealt but if the games industry is truly committed to getting rid of the angry embittered misogynists of the online world then they might as well come down hard on them.

 

[Serving UpSmiles]

The last time I saw Extra Credits brought up here it didn't end well.

Yeah, that one thread where the poll was dominated by EC but over half of the posts were rants against EC... I did find it quite entertaining because it showed a little about the kind of people who watched the shows in discussion.

Captcha: hoity-toity

I think it's the community being angry at both EC and the site managers for EC leaving, when EC first arrived they were seen as a godsend and represented the Escapist's attitude to gaming perfectly, now it's just sad, and the forums havn't been the same since...

 

[Smooth Operator]

Well I was pretty shocked XBL didn't have such features ages ago, but it's nice to see someone bringing them around.

And on that vs thread, it was bound to go wrong when people who identify with Jim were invited, he is employed by Escapist for professional trolling for christ sakes, of course shit went up the wall.

 

[Jack and Calumon]

For those who don't know, Extra Credits is a show that...

Oh trust me, we are all aware of Extra Credits. All of us, with reasons that are confusing at best.

OT: Good, I am glad Microsoft is taking some action on this and I'm glad Extra Credits are the people voicing this, as their ideas were good. Abusive messages in games need to stop, with threats of bannings for those who disobey. That way you can clear all the scum of XBL easily.

The PS3 could do with a clean up too, but since no-one talks on PS3, it's less of a problem.

If bannings don't work, then can Microsoft please give all reigns of punishment to Jim Sterling, who I'm sure will be all too pleased to make XBL more civilised through cruel and unusual punishments.

Calumon: Like making them eat cake until they explode!

 

[tippy2k2]

Oh dear God I hope not...their ideas that they presented in that episode I thought were just plain bad. The only good one was the auto-mute thing and even that one has it's own problems (for example, there are players who just mute everyone but their buddies, which is going to skew that system).

The "Limit them to sending messages to their friends if their messages don't get responses" doesn't make any sense. Maybe if there was a report system to put that into affect might work better but how often do you respond to messages on Live (from friends or otherwise)? The "BLOCK COMMUNICATION" button exists for a reason...

Blocking communication and making players earn it? Seriously, can you make the system any more newbie unfriendly? You're putting your players in a black hole and treating them as scum until they prove otherwise with this.

Lastly, the clan one kind of works if you have ONE jerk in a big group. Maybe that happens more often but it seems like you'd just have jerk clans who don't give a crap about their reputation continuing to be a jerk clan.

People already have the tools to deal with harassment; use them. If people are using the Report system, Microsoft needs to enforce it.

 

[Scow2]

The last time I saw Extra Credits brought up here it didn't end well.

Yeah, that one thread where the poll was dominated by EC but over half of the posts were rants against EC... I did find it quite entertaining because it showed a little about the kind of people who watched the shows in discussion.

Captcha: hoity-toity

I think it's the community being angry at both EC and the site managers for EC leaving, when EC first arrived they were seen as a godsend and represented the Escapist's attitude to gaming perfectly, now it's just sad, and the forums havn't been the same since...

Can I get a drama-free recap of the drama that made EC go away? I used to like that show, even if I didn't agree with it.

On the subject at hand, though, I have to agree with this guy:

Oh dear God I hope not...their ideas that they presented in that episode I thought were just plain bad. The only good one was the auto-mute thing and even that one has it's own problems (for example, there are players who just mute everyone but their buddies, which is going to skew that system).

The "Limit them to sending messages to their friends if their messages don't get responses" doesn't make any sense. Maybe if there was a report system to put that into affect might work better but how often do you respond to messages on Live (from friends or otherwise)? The "BLOCK COMMUNICATION" button exists for a reason...

Blocking communication and making players earn it? Seriously, can you make the system any more newbie unfriendly? You're putting your players in a black hole and treating them as scum until they prove otherwise with this.

Lastly, the clan one kind of works if you have ONE jerk in a big group. Maybe that happens more often but it seems like you'd just have jerk clans who don't give a crap about their reputation continuing to be a jerk clan.

People already have the tools to deal with harassment; use them.

 

[getoffmycloud]

Oh dear God I hope not...their ideas that they presented in that episode I thought were just plain bad. The only good one was the auto-mute thing and even that one has it's own problems (for example, there are players who just mute everyone but their buddies, which is going to skew that system).

The "Limit them to sending messages to their friends if their messages don't get responses" doesn't make any sense. Maybe if there was a report system to put that into affect might work better but how often do you respond to messages on Live (from friends or otherwise)? The "BLOCK COMMUNICATION" button exists for a reason...

Blocking communication and making players earn it? Seriously, can you make the system any more newbie unfriendly? You're putting your players in a black hole and treating them as scum until they prove otherwise with this.

Lastly, the clan one kind of works if you have ONE jerk in a big group. Maybe that happens more often but it seems like you'd just have jerk clans who don't give a crap about their reputation continuing to be a jerk clan.

People already have the tools to deal with harassment; use them.

I don't know about others but I mute everyone because of the foul language you get on XBL so if there was auto mute I would give people a chance.

Ok the message thing perhaps not the best idea but tbh how often do you send a message to a person you don't know because you normally only encounter them in a game so you would just use your headset so maybe just limiting messages to friends only for everyone or having it set to that by default so people can turn it off if they want to.

Making players earn communication should be a last resort because that would hurt people who don't play MP that often or have to share an account with a family member who is a a bit of a knob online but they are not.

And anyway I am sure Microsoft will be able to put their ideas across as well so they can sort out what is practical and what isn't

 

[BreakfastMan]

Calumon: Like making them eat cake until they explode!

Sorry Calumon, I really don't think that would be a good idea. It would be more like a reward than a punishment. XD

OT: Good for them, I guess. Honestly, whatever MS is doing to clean X-Box live is not working. This at least shows they are looking into alternative ways to solve the problem instead of just ignoring it, which I can get behind.

 

[Lilani]

I think it's the community being angry at both EC and the site managers for EC leaving, when EC first arrived they were seen as a godsend and represented the Escapist's attitude to gaming perfectly, now it's just sad, and the forums havn't been the same since...

I agree. When they were around people were always singing their praises, and only a few on the margins calling them preachy and maybe arrogant. But now every time it's brought up, there is a lot more dissent and a lot more jumping on the preachy/arrogant bandwagon. I think it's more sour grapes over why/how they left than anything else. EC didn't change, only the perception of it according to this community did.

 

[Phasmal]

As a lady who likes to use mic but does not like getting shit for it, I can only say `Yay`.

I stopped paying for gold on Xbox live because of all the rubbish, there's no reason I can't be myself in a game. If that means using mic, dudes need to deal.

People who say its not a big deal or that the ones getting the harrassment should just deal with it are usually people who have never encountered it themselves.

 

[Lilani]

Oh dear God I hope not...their ideas that they presented in that episode I thought were just plain bad. The only good one was the auto-mute thing and even that one has it's own problems (for example, there are players who just mute everyone but their buddies, which is going to skew that system).

The "Limit them to sending messages to their friends if their messages don't get responses" doesn't make any sense. Maybe if there was a report system to put that into affect might work better but how often do you respond to messages on Live (from friends or otherwise)? The "BLOCK COMMUNICATION" button exists for a reason...

Blocking communication and making players earn it? Seriously, can you make the system any more newbie unfriendly? You're putting your players in a black hole and treating them as scum until they prove otherwise with this.

Lastly, the clan one kind of works if you have ONE jerk in a big group. Maybe that happens more often but it seems like you'd just have jerk clans who don't give a crap about their reputation continuing to be a jerk clan.

People already have the tools to deal with harassment; use them. If people are using the Report system, Microsoft needs to enforce it.

I'll agree that the message system would work better with the auto-block set on how many times they are reported rather than how many times they don't get a response. However, what they mentioned was a start anyway (I imagine that's why Microsoft arranged a talk with them rather than just simply taking them at their word and applying them instantly). Either way it would be better than continuing to ignore the problem. And they mentioned in the video punishing new players should be avoided if at all possible.

And I think you've misread the clan thing. Yes there probably will be jerk clans who don't care, but aren't there ALREADY jerk clans out there who don't care about what they do? I know I've seen them. All the system would do is label them for what they are so people quickly know what they're dealing with, and would motivate the clans who don't want such a reputation to manage their memberships to make sure they don't devolve into the same thing.

You can't argue that SOMETHING has to be done about this, and I applaud the EC crew for actually getting a few tangible ideas on the table. I feel like the rest of the gaming community is quick to huff and puff about how bad it is without actually offering any possible solutions. Outrage without action is simply bile, useless and inert.

 

[Scow2]

Oh dear God I hope not...their ideas that they presented in that episode I thought were just plain bad. The only good one was the auto-mute thing and even that one has it's own problems (for example, there are players who just mute everyone but their buddies, which is going to skew that system).

The "Limit them to sending messages to their friends if their messages don't get responses" doesn't make any sense. Maybe if there was a report system to put that into affect might work better but how often do you respond to messages on Live (from friends or otherwise)? The "BLOCK COMMUNICATION" button exists for a reason...

Blocking communication and making players earn it? Seriously, can you make the system any more newbie unfriendly? You're putting your players in a black hole and treating them as scum until they prove otherwise with this.

Lastly, the clan one kind of works if you have ONE jerk in a big group. Maybe that happens more often but it seems like you'd just have jerk clans who don't give a crap about their reputation continuing to be a jerk clan.

People already have the tools to deal with harassment; use them.

I wanted to call you a lot of names, but I digress.

Each option they presented was noteworthy, and each option has been discussed with me and my friends very often before - it was very nice to see an industry figure come out with the same kind of ideas. You have to realize, gaming has NEVER been newbie-friendly, in a sense. Take someone nwebish who is beginning to grasp COD today and give them Mega Man on the NES and ask them to complete the game. With the current attention span of gaming and life in general, only true gamers would stick with it until the end - those who love to play.

That's the kind of people I want to see in the gaming community, people who love games, people who love to play and people who want to share their love with others! Not some crap-spouting idiots and jerks who can't handle defeat even in the realm of video games and send messages like that to people in the EC episode! That's just sick and effed up. The fact that you are basically defending them makes me feel like you are one of these types.

Looks like someone's riding a high horse that needs to take an arrow in the knee.

Modern gamers are no less "intelligent" than the long-time gamers. Also, the new players generally aren't the ones that are foul-mouthed shit-talkers. In fact, I'd venture a guess and think that most "newbies" come into a game like Halo, Call of Duty, or Battlefield with the naively idealistic idea that voice-chat is used almost exclusively for communicating important tactical data. It's the bored, jaded long-time players and aggressive, hyper-competitive (And therefore high-level) players that make the place a wreck.

Am I the only one that doesn't get annoyed by having people angrily message me after a game? Feel free to just block them, delete the message, and consider it an award for a well-played game against intellectually and socially inferior opponents.