Gamergate, No "Right Side." - We Should Avoid Picking Sides

[grassgremlin]

After much research, I can safely declare that everyone is wrong.
What I have seen is that this gaming war has become too radical on both sides.

Extremists overgeneralizing movements.
Misinformation and a Lack of Understanding.

The only choice for us as the fence sitters is to not pick a side.

This issue has devolved to the point of slinging mud. Children in the playground shouting insults to one another then crying saying "we're not poopy heads." as they shout "you are poopy heads."

Can we all just agree, Gamergate will not solve anything? Can we all agree StopGamergate will not solve anything.

The truth has always been that there is room for both.
There is room for gone home and call of duty.
There is room for Bayonetta getting a 7.5 on Polygon and 10 out of 10s from other respectable sites.

There is room for us all. We should all be gaming. We don't need a label. And if we have a label we give ourselves then so what.

The truth is, there is no "True Gamers." There is no "fake gamers". Gaming has reached the mainstream in ways we could only dream of in the 90s.

How can we save gaming? If we embrace our fellow men and women with controller in hand passing off to each other in glorious play.

For peep-sakes, can we be adults? Let's have the games the way we want it.
The truth is, your games aren't going anywhere.
You experiences will not end.
New Experiences will be created and will be accepted.

That's the truth.

If gamergate wants to truly make a difference then create a consumer group. Create a website. Rally the hundreds, thousands who pledge the hashtag. The talents they have. Rally together and create something new.

Why do we always have to keep fighting when most games come with two, four, sixteen players?
Can't we just play?

Edit: The Right Side is Pixie Jenni http://pixietalksgamergate.wordpress.com/
Seriously guys. Actual Journalism being done here.

 

[Colour Scientist]

After much research, I can safely declare that everyone is wrong.

Except for you, right? XD

This could have quite easily been posted in one of the existing GG threads rather that further monopolising the front page of OT.

 

[grassgremlin]

After much research, I can safely declare that everyone is wrong.

Except for you, right? XD

This could have quite easily been posted in one of the existing GG threads rather that further monopolising the front page of OT.

Why would I post a thread about being neutral to a thread that is not neutral?

 

[Greg White]

While I can't condone death threats and it is very safe to say that those making them are wrong, that doesn't make either side of the core argument any more right or wrong.

The phrase "not my circus, not my monkeys" is quite fitting for my view on this whole ordeal.

 

[Colour Scientist]

After much research, I can safely declare that everyone is wrong.

Except for you, right? XD

This could have quite easily been posted in one of the existing GG threads rather that further monopolising the front page of OT.

Why would I post a thread about being neutral to a thread that is not neutral?

Well, you're just kind of posting your opinion on the situation. It's not really any more novel than the millions of other opinions in the millions of other threads.

 

[grassgremlin]

After much research, I can safely declare that everyone is wrong.

Except for you, right? XD

This could have quite easily been posted in one of the existing GG threads rather that further monopolising the front page of OT.

Why would I post a thread about being neutral to a thread that is not neutral?

Well, you're just kind of posting your opinion on the situation. It's not really any more novel than the millions of other opinions in the millions of other threads.

Sounds like you're missing the point of this thread. But if my opinion doesn't matter, why respond to it then? What is it you're trying to honestly prove?

 

[Soviet Heavy]

You can choose a ready guide in some celestial voice
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice
You can choose from phantom fears and kindness that can kill
I will choose a path that's clear
I will choose freewill

 

[grassgremlin]

If we agree that death threats from both sides and genders are utterly unacceptable, and that Guilt By Association should be recognized as a fallacy, not a debate win/bypass button then I'll be happy.

We need a third hashtag. Seriously. We need a third faction to actually speak about the true flaws in gaming culture and industry. A place where we can finally have a voice without the stigmas being brought up from either side.

Can't we not be bound by the SJW Rhetoric nor the Gamer Rhetoric?
Seriously. It's messed up that there's so much mud-slinging and not any actual problems being fixed.
You know like corruption of some youtubers and especially publishers.

 

[Colour Scientist]

After much research, I can safely declare that everyone is wrong.

Except for you, right? XD

This could have quite easily been posted in one of the existing GG threads rather that further monopolising the front page of OT.

Why would I post a thread about being neutral to a thread that is not neutral?

Well, you're just kind of posting your opinion on the situation. It's not really any more novel than the millions of other opinions in the millions of other threads.

Sounds like you're missing the point of this thread. But if my opinion doesn't matter, why respond to it then? What is it you're trying to honestly prove?

I'm not missing the point, I get it.

I'm not trying to prove anything, I'm just getting slightly tired of the entire front page of OT being clogged up with GamerGate threads, especially when a lot of them could quite easily be posted as part of the pre-existing threads.

 

[grassgremlin]

After much research, I can safely declare that everyone is wrong.

Except for you, right? XD

This could have quite easily been posted in one of the existing GG threads rather that further monopolising the front page of OT.

Why would I post a thread about being neutral to a thread that is not neutral?

Well, you're just kind of posting your opinion on the situation. It's not really any more novel than the millions of other opinions in the millions of other threads.

Sounds like you're missing the point of this thread. But if my opinion doesn't matter, why respond to it then? What is it you're trying to honestly prove?

I'm not missing the point, I get it.

I'm not trying to prove anything, I'm just getting slightly tired of the entire front page of OT being clogged up with GamerGate threads, especially when a lot of them could quite easily be posted as part of the pre-existing threads.

I've posted my points to these threads before and they go largely ignored. It's better to single the point to one thread in order to make it more visible.

Posting to the monster thread will only get me responses from #gamergate when I want both sides to see that the issues they are fighting are not only largely the same, but has become muddled.

Anti-GG do not want to see the points of Gamergate, while Gamergate only acknowledges those who completely exercise there ideals from Feminism or SJW. In a sense. You can't be a SJW and support Gamergate, that's the rhetoric I hate.

I am a feminist, but I heavily disagree with how the movement has handled itself, but I would not cling to a movement viciously toxic towards a belief I believe in either.

Both sides are wrong because all they do is overgeneralize groups. Anti-gg call Gamergate a hate campaign while Gamergate calls them SJW, despite some not being such. They both attack anyone with a neutral opinion too.

You either are a SJW or a misogynist.
You either are a Gamer or a SJW.

You can not win. You must pick a side. If I have a choice, I choose freedom from the issues and the rhetoric, and the group's voice.

 

[grassgremlin]

If we agree that death threats from both sides and genders are utterly unacceptable, and that Guilt By Association should be recognized as a fallacy, not a debate win/bypass button then I'll be happy.

We need a third hashtag. Seriously. We need a third faction to actually speak about the true flaws in gaming culture and industry. A place where we can finally have a voice without the stigmas being brought up from either side.

Can't we not be bound by the SJW Rhetoric nor the Gamer Rhetoric?
Seriously. It's messed up that there's so much mud-slinging and not any actual problems being fixed.
You know like corruption of some youtubers and especially publishers.

At this point a third hashtag would be trampled into the dirt and ignored, either not generating enough interest or people form both sides assuming its secretly allied with the enemy.
But I would love to see a youtuber or such call out both sides and mock both sides. One of the reasons I actually like the forums here.

Sadly though its much easier to get attention by polarizing, and its hard to draw people by being with or against both sides... it would be interesting if someone could over come that.

I feel cracked wasted a massive opportunity. If they were more on the ball they would have written an article about how ridiculous many of gg's actions were, while not ignoring the things others did that got the fire going. Cracked snarking at both sides rather than holding a certain someone up as a saint would have been the perfect antidote. And people need to mention the death threats from BOTH genders and sides. Seriously >_>

Heck I'd even have been happy if Jim did his usual thing about calling gamers out who harassed, but also had the balls to explain why Alexnder Leigh's "gamers are dead" article was a pointless attack that did nothing to help anyone. If he didn't pretend she was an non partial observer and only attacked because of her gender and did absolutely nothing wrong, then I might still be watching his show, no matter how many guys he called out.

The truth is those Gamer is Dead articles were offensive on many levels. They should have been condemned on both sides. That is not how you handle a issue. Negativity will only breed Negativity. You asked for a fight when you sling mud.

 

[Calbeck]

Can we all just agree, Gamergate will not solve anything?

Well, given that the movement has in fact been supporting boycotts and has successfully gotten advertisers to pull ads from websites with toxic attitudes towards the gaming community, progress towards reform at those sites is indeed underway.

While it's true GG members are deeply offended by being widely tarred with a broad brush, and have said so, that's hardly a matter of equating "bad behavior"... indeed, doing so is essentially victim-shaming.

And while I do agree there is room for criticism both of the gaming journalism and the gaming community, the journalism sites have made clear they do not agree, nor do many opponents of the GG movement.

There is room for us all. We should all be gaming. We don't need a label. And if we have a label we give ourselves then so what.

Agreed. I would like my journalists to cease attacking the community with horrendous stereotyping, and then attacking people who are offended by same, so I can get back to marathoning Wasteland 2. Unfortunately, I'm not one of those types who considers organized defamation of an entire community as something to be ignored.

 

[PoolCleaningRobot]

Anti-GG do not want to see the points of Gamergate, while Gamergate only acknowledges those who completely exercise there ideals from Feminism or SJW. In a sense. You can't be a SJW and support Gamergate, that's the rhetoric I hate.

That depends on how you define a SJW and what you stand for. I agree with the gamergate stuff and I'd consider myself a "feminist". I may not have a social sciences degree, but in college I took a few courses on race and gender relations (because contrary to popular belief, there's more to such a topic than women). I know what my privileges are and I know what they aren't. Going by what I've seen, SJW's just want to argue about political correctness and do a bunch of finger pointing. Hell, I hate the phrase itself. Social Just "Warrior". We don't need warriors, there is no war. What people need are education and understanding.

We need a third hashtag. Seriously. We need a third faction to actually speak about the true flaws in gaming culture and industry. A place where we can finally have a voice without the stigmas being brought up from either side.

Can't we not be bound by the SJW Rhetoric nor the Gamer Rhetoric?
Seriously. It's messed up that there's so much mud-slinging and not any actual problems being fixed.
You know like corruption of some youtubers and especially publishers.

I know where I stand and that's good enough. I don't care that people have been acting likes shits on both sides. The difference is one side has been acting like a shit and keeps getting away with it while claiming to support "equality" then criticize people and their opinions based on their race and gender. For me its not about journalistic ethics (but most of those guys can fuck themselves). Its about what equality means and being a decent person, and its not lying and manipulating other people

To be completely honest, I've mostly been reading opinions about this on knowyourmeme who lean towards gamergate, but most people there will say they support diversity in games. I've never seen any of this "you must hate women" thing you've mentioned. Though I have seen some terrible ms paint conspiracy diagrams, but I think people are embarrassed by those now

 

[Mikeybb]

After much research, I can safely declare that everyone is wrong.

Except for you, right? XD

This could have quite easily been posted in one of the existing GG threads rather that further monopolising the front page of OT.

Fair point.

We need to try to keep this in as few a threads as possible OP.

I appreciate your message and it's one that deserves to be heard, but some posters have been expressing dissatisfaction with the overspill of GG topics in the forums and we need to try to consolidate as many topics as we can.

Got to be a good neighbor if we're going to share a forum, y'know?

 

[irishda]

Considering you either support Gamergate or you don't (because you don't know, don't care, or don't agree), I'd say there's not exactly "two sides" here. #StopGamergate doesn't count as a side, it's just people who disagree, and disagree for any number of reasons.

 

[Evil Moo]

I find the idea of grouping myself under some increasingly ill defined war banner hashtag foolish. All it accomplishes is allowing others to speak for me in ways I might not necessarily agree with and makes myself part of a convenient group to be targeted by other people who can attribute whatever negativity they want to that group.

If anyone wants my opinion on something they can ask me about a specific issue. The 'gamergate controversy' is not a specific issue.

 

[Weaver]

Guys, can't we all just get drunk, hang out and relax a bit?
PM me if you want to get drunk and hang out.