I asked an theist this and didn't get an answer. Can you help?

[Sayvara]

One of the great sports of YouTube is for atheists and theists to throw questions at eachother... titles such as "5 Questions Every Intelligent Atheist MUST Answer" and "10 Questions All Theists Should Answer." and their RE:s are all over the Believers vs Skeptics battlefield. What most keep forgetting in this shouting match is that one should not ask rethorical questions unless you are absolutely sure you won't get an unfavourable answer back...

One of these questioners is philos71 (a.k.a Tony). The guy's a pretty decent amateur film-maker with neat little skills in composition, editing and sound editing, something I wish I had myself. He is one of the originators of these "questions they must answer" vids.

I sent him a question in PM and didn't get an answer. This is kind of sad because I was honestly curious what his arguments for it would be. I didn't expect him to not be able to answer but rather that he would. But here I am... with an unanswered question. So maybe you can help? I'll quote...

Heya Tony!

I have a really quick question for you. Here it is:

Do I need to believe in God?

This question is somewhat open to interpretation, which makes the answer possibly complex, so let me clarify a few things about it.

"I" in this context means "I, an average, nonspecific person, living somewhere in the world, presumably Europe, the US or a similar cultures". It does not mean "I" personally as in "I, [my name], Swedish citizen with personal ID number [ID number]". "I" in this context could possibly be interchanged for "anyone" or "everyone" but that would probably make you focus on the wrong things when answering. "I" here means the average Joe... which could be anyone, or we could see everyone as average Joes... I think you get the point.

"Do I need" in this context means "Is it necessary for me to...". It does not mean "Do I have a need", as in a need on the Maslow Hierarcy of Needs, where I am certain a belief in something grander, unseen and explainatory for the mystries of the wonders and unfairnesses of our existance fits in somewhere. It's not that kind of need I'm talking about but rather if there is something that necessitates me to believe in God in order to lead a good, healthy, productive and fulfilling life.

And finally, "God" in this context is the abrahamic god descibed in various religions such as Christianity, Judaism, Islam et al.

I am very much looking forward to your answer Tony. Thank you for your time.

So... with no answer from Tony, I'm posting it to a somewhat bigger audience. Skeptics and atheists... I pretty much guessed your answer which can be summarized as "No you don't". What I am really curious about is if there is anyone out there that has a dissenting opinion and can present arguments for it.

So... is there?

/S

 

[Sgt Doom]

If you're not too fond of having unanswered questions and aren't all that bothered about the correctness of those answers, then go Abrahamic.

 

[bodyklok]

Wait hold on who were you asking? A atheist or a theist, i.e. A Muslim.

 

[thedelightfulme]

I dont think anyone needs to believe in God. This belief that religon goes hand in hand with good behaviour is rubbish. Yes, religon can SOMETIMES encourage good behave, but it also can SOMETIMES encourage very bad behaviour. I am an Athiest. But I dont HATE religon. I just find science has more answers than religon.
Religon began when man needed answers but did not have the capacity to give them, so God's were made. This answered many things, Where did we come from? WHy are we here? What happens when we die? etc. However science has now bounded forward with answer to those questions.

Religon is fast becoming a relic. I can probably ask 10 people that I know if they go to church and they will all probably say no. (I live in the UK by the way).
You don't need to believe in anything. Some people believe in both the science and the religon (most scientists will hate anyone for this as it is a contradiction).
I dont believe in God but bumble through life as best as I can.
What happens when I die? Stuffed if i know, but hey, thats part of the fun. A new adventure.
Its simple.

The average joe does NOT need to believe in God. The average Joe who believes in God WANTS to. He wants God to exist. To explain everything.

No one ever needs to. They just want to. Thus, faith, having faith that there is something without proof.

I hope i answered your question. If not, email me, and I would be happy to help more.

thedelightfulme@hotmail.co.uk


Thanks.

 

[Sayvara]

Wait hold on who were you asking? A atheist or a theist, i.e. A Muslim.

Christians are theists as well...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theism

...monotheists to be more precise...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monotheism

/S

 

[Mr_spamamam]

Religion is a matter of personal choice. if you dont want to believe that there is a god then dont. however if you read a holy book of any description and find yourself identyfing with whats written then you should give it a try at least once.

At the end of the day the world is made up of people, they can be good people, bad people or people who think that they are doing a good thing when its actually causing harm andf vice versa. I have met good people both religious and non religious just as i have met bad people, again both religious and non religious.

All it come down to is what you make of it. it is possable to live a healthy, productive and filling life weather you believe in a god or not.

Hopefully i have answered your question and not just gone off on a tangent.

P.S. I personally do believe in god, because i want to. However i haven't always.

 

[GloatingSwine]

I think my opinions are well enough known around here, but what I'm going to do is pre-empt some of the answers.

The position of many theists will, under strong scrutiny, be revealed to actually be a belief in belief itself. Most people do not believe in the exact and specific god of any religious text, and certainly do not live their lives in a manner consistent with the scriptures they hold to be the work of that god (frequently they will have some excuse for this, especially if they are Christians who have realised that the laws of the Old Testament are no longer socially appropriate, even though they are still supposed to be in force for followers of the faith), they just believe in a vague bundle of concepts that are actually somewhat divorced from those gods but given the same name.

What these people believe in is not the actual literal god they lay claim to, but the process of belief itself.

They will answer yes, but will not be able to give a compelling reasoned answer.

 

[heeeeee]

I see two possible answers to the question, neither of which can be proven correct without proof that God exists/doesn't exist.

We can easily find examples of both theists and atheists that claim to achieve happiness and health during 'life' as we know it (From physical birth to physical death), and so, if there is no God and that is all that life is, one does not need to believe in God in order to live happily. However, if God did exist, it would be possible that in order to enjoy life one must follow God's teachings, for if all non-believers went to hell, then they would have failed to live a good and healthy life simply because they did not believe in God. Now, this is assuming if God exists then so does hell, but while I admit this isn't necessarily true, it is probable that there would be some form of penalty for not believing in God.

At this point it becomes a gamble; Pascal's wager, where Pascal said that to be safe one should believe in God as the limits imposed on one's life by following God's teachings are minor compared to the potential punishments for not believing in God.

 

[bodyklok]

Wait hold on who were you asking? A atheist or a theist, i.e. A Muslim.

Christians are theists as well...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theism

...monotheists to be more precise...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monotheism

/S

OMG Are they? /sarcasm

Just answere the question; To whom did you ask this?

 

[GloatingSwine]

Wait hold on who were you asking? A atheist or a theist, i.e. A Muslim.

You wanted an e.g. there not an i.e.

Theism is the position that there is a personal interventionist god. Any faith that applies specific qualities to the object of belief is Theist.

The alternatives are Deist (impersonal noninterventionist god) or Pantheist (everything is god).

 

[ThreeWords]

Do you need to believe? No idea. When dealing with religion, I tend to follow my spiritual nose.

I don't pretend to have signed up to any religion, partly because on an intellectual level, I know there can be know 'old man on a cloud' running the universe.

However, on a gut level, I've been left with a very vague feeling that there is a power that guides this world, an entity that is, in effect, the soul of the universe.

I don't believe in Jesus, but I think the I being I believe in might be the Christian/Jewish God.

I don't think you stand to suffer from believing or not believing, so just work out what you really think, and accept it

 

[[zonking great]]

There is a need in some people's life to believe they are predestined to other things. When their life goes downhill, they will be in a place where it's not so bad. When their life is well, they praise that entity. It is not necessary at all. It's just a mechanism to maintain your sanity. I know it sounds weird. I'm saying imaginary friends equals sanity. WHERE ELSE BUT THE ESCAPIST?!

 

[albinoterrorist]

Need to believe in God? Hell no.

If there is a heaven which is only reachable by believing, then God would have to turn out a load of customers, which would make me seriously question the whole "ultimate creator loves us so huggy-wuggy much" theory.

 

[GloatingSwine]

At this point it becomes a gamble; Pascal's wager, where Pascal said that to be safe one should believe in God as the limits imposed on one's life by following God's teachings are minor compared to the potential punishments for not believing in God.

Pascal's Wager is a horribly bad bet.

People who advance it are generally only considering their own particular god as a candidate for the "yes" side. In reality, Pascal's Wager would have to account for every single god or pantheon, all of them mutually exclusive, and all the many exclusive ways of worshipping those gods. It's far from the fifty-fifty chance that it is advanced as, and you'd look very silly as the holiest and most devout of christians when Xipe Totec comes back to see why the supply of still beating hearts and flayed sacrifices has dried up.

 

[bodyklok]

Wait hold on who were you asking? A atheist or a theist, i.e. A Muslim.

You wanted an e.g. there not an i.e.

Theism is the position that there is a personal interventionist god. Any faith that applies specific qualities to the object of belief is Theist.

The alternatives are Deist (impersonal noninterventionist god) or Pantheist (everything is god).

*Sighs*
All I want to kow is if he asked someone who believed in god or not? If I had to guess, it was someone who did, because I think Philos is a Christian

 

[captainwillies]

words

just to get your attention.


the answer is no. you don't need to believe in god.

 

[ThreeWords]

Christians are theists as well...

...monotheists to be more precise...

I always found that slight amusing, where Christians insist that the God they believe in is both one single God, and at the same time, three separate beings, all of whom are no less than the one single God

The idea just doesn't work. Here it is in algebra

1 God = 3 Gods
(divide by God)
1 =/= 3

or

God/3 = God
(divide by God)
1/3 =/= 1

I believe its called 'reducto ad absurdum', or proof by contradiction. The idea put forward leads to something that cannot happen, therefore the first idea also cannot happen.

 

[thedelightfulme]

No one really needs to believe in God. They want to. Im pretty sure that you religous guys out there can confirm that. The ones who NEED to, only do to justify their actions (that includes terrorists). If their God exists, its HIS fault, HE caused the people to die. This, displacing the guilt.

If they have any...

 

[New Troll]

You "need" to believe in God to have Faith and to get into Heaven. But you don't need to believe in religion. If you're the best person in the world, yet don't have Faith, you won't be let into His kingdom, instead hanging out the rest of days in Limbo. Not really bad, but not all that great either. Think 'boring', but beats Hell where you get to spend eternity in torture.