Is it just me... or does the Xbox one violate EU laws?

[Karadalis]

Most noticably the "allways on" kinect that watches you and monitors/records whatever you do or say as long as the xbox one is turned on?

As far as I know it is illegal to build something like that into your console without giving the user the option to turn this so called "feature" off in the EU (or atleast in germany)

Then theres the whole idiotic idea of stiffling the used games market. If i recall correctly the EU judged that if you are the owner of a game you can sell just as if you would sell anything else that you bought. Microsoft demanding a fee to install a game you bought from a person who bought it legally steps right over this.

Somehow I doubt that the Xbox one will be able to be sold as is in the EU without atleast enabling to shut down the kinect camera. The used games blockade though might be still pushed through since no one would have to guts or the money to actually sue them because of their unfair business practices that go clearly against the EU judging of used game sales.

 

[Tom_green_day]

Can you not just unplug the Kinect?
I don't think people have the right to sell anything that you bought, there are laws on certain items although I don't know if games fall under those laws. I don't think they actually break laws, just really piss people off.

 

[Hades]

Watching the presentation i got the impression Microsoft forgot Euorope existed in the firt place. I think its possible Microsoft didn't bother to check the law of every European country.

 

[Karadalis]

According to the information at hand the kinect is a MUST.. it is mandatory that it is allways active when the xbox one is used. Atleast if you believe the reports.

Also what you think is right and whats the actual law differ greatly. We have used car sales, we have private auctions, we have markets where people can sell their used items. And all that is legal. Everything you bought and are the owner of you are allowed to sell to someone else. That is the actual situation. You only get in trouble if you make copies of the original and selling those.

Also as i said before: not many months ago the EU made a judgement that generaly speaking a Customer is entitled to reselling his online bought games just.. and this is important.. as if he owned a physical copy of said game.

It doesnt take a brain surgeon to read out of this where the EU stands in terms of pre owned game sales. For them a disk and the data on it can be resold, just not copied.

But pre owned games aside, the 24/7 spying cam of the kinect makes me scratch my head more then anything else.

 

[LTlewis]

The best thing to do would be to put some tape over the Kinect. Or turn it around. But if they are the only two options then I think Microsoft have gone soft in the head (Bad pun laugh).
I like my 360, but this Xbox one is not doing a lot to win me over. I buy pre-owned games, because I can afford them, if I can't well, I may have to look to Sony.

 

[Karadalis]

The kicker is that the kinect also suposedly records sound.. aka conversations.

You know.. microsoft is delivering a hackers dream... all they need to do is hack into your xbox.. and lets face it someone WILL do it... and they can spy on you. The fact that the camera and audio recorder are allways on anyways make it that much more easier since no one who owns an xbox one will be suspicious of the kinect doing what microsoft wants it do do anyways right? XD

 

[Froggy Slayer]

Can you not just unplug the Kinect?
I don't think people have the right to sell anything that you bought, there are laws on certain items although I don't know if games fall under those laws. I don't think they actually break laws, just really piss people off.

Oh, the Kinect has to stay plugged in for the console to work now. No, I don't understand why either.

 

[ToastiestZombie]

If I wanted a surveillance camera in my house, I would have bought and installed one if I had the money. I really hope the EU does something about this, Microsoft is going to get a real kick in the balls if the EU does.

 

[Vegosiux]

Well, the presentation itself seemed like they mostly talked about stuff hardly anyone outside USA gives a damn about. As huge of a deal as NFL Fantasy Football is over there, it's not exactly a selling point in the rest of the world, for example...

 

[Hero in a half shell]

Funnily enough most people probably have an uncovered webcam facing them right now from their laptops, potentially recording everything they do without their consent.

Personally I solve the problem with blue tack. Covers the lens, easily and cleanly removed when you want to use it.

 

[Adam Jensen_v1legacy]

It's very much illegal. And most of it's advertized TV features don't work in Europe anyway. It's a console designed for the US, I guess.

 

[Karadalis]

Funnily enough most people probably have an uncovered webcam facing them right now from their laptops, potentially recording everything they do without their consent.

Personally I solve the problem with blue tack. Covers the lens, easily and cleanly removed when you want to use it.

I highly doubt your laptop turns the webcam on automatically.. and even if.. it has the function to turn it off.

Something the Xbone wont have...

And what will you do about it recording audio?

 

[J Tyran]

The kicker is that the kinect also suposedly records sound.. aka conversations.

You know.. microsoft is delivering a hackers dream... all they need to do is hack into your xbox.. and lets face it someone WILL do it... and they can spy on you. The fact that the camera and audio recorder are allways on anyways make it that much more easier since no one who owns an xbox one will be suspicious of the kinect doing what microsoft wants it do do anyways right? XD

You can say this about a lot of things, phones, tablets, smartphones, some TVs, (My TV has a motion control like Kinect anyway and yes its still shit) laptops and even cars.

So many things have devices that can see you, hear you and report your location and any that connect to the internet or a network of some type can be hacked. The Xbone has a lot of problems but being spied on is either a non issue or just another device on the list at worst.

 

[Hero in a half shell]

Funnily enough most people probably have an uncovered webcam facing them right now from their laptops, potentially recording everything they do without their consent.

Personally I solve the problem with blue tack. Covers the lens, easily and cleanly removed when you want to use it.

I highly doubt your laptop turns the webcam on automatically.. and even if.. it has the function to turn it off.

Something the Xbone wont have...

And what will you do about it recording audio?

It can happen: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/8523807.stm
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2013/03/rat-breeders-meet-the-men-who-spy-on-women-through-their-webcams/

And audio? I dunno. I think inwardly? I don't use Skype or anything, always have headplones in, and this laptop is in my room so it's only me in here, All anyone would get is multiple hours of power metal and small snippets of me cursing while playing Battlefield, so unless my bank accounts' secret answer is "Bloody OP Helis" I think I'm safe.

 

[Vegosiux]

And audio? I dunno. I think inwardly? I don't use Skype or anything, always have headplones in, and this laptop is in my room so it's only me in here, All anyone would get is multiple hours of power metal and small snippets of me cursing while playing Battlefield, so unless my bank accounts' secret answer is "Bloody OP Helis" I think I'm safe.

Butt hat's just the "It doesn't affect me, so it's okay" logic. Why would people have to take extra steps to protect their privacy/delicate information?

 

[Karadalis]

The kicker is that the kinect also suposedly records sound.. aka conversations.

You know.. microsoft is delivering a hackers dream... all they need to do is hack into your xbox.. and lets face it someone WILL do it... and they can spy on you. The fact that the camera and audio recorder are allways on anyways make it that much more easier since no one who owns an xbox one will be suspicious of the kinect doing what microsoft wants it do do anyways right? XD

You can say this about a lot of things, phones, tablets, smartphones, some TVs, (My TV has a motion control like Kinect anyway and yes its still shit) laptops and even cars.

So many things have devices that can see you, hear you and report your location and any that connect to the internet or a network of some type can be hacked. The Xbone has a lot of problems but being spied on is either a non issue or just another device on the list at worst.

And all these devices have the option to shut the recording down. But if you want to use your xbone.. you cannot shut down the kinect part that keeps recording both visual and audio... aslong as you use the xbox.

My phone? I can turn off the camera. My laptop? Ditto. Furthermore both will not passively record any conversations that i have with other people... the xbone will.

See the difference now?

 

[Hero in a half shell]

=snip-

Butt hat's just the "It doesn't affect me, so it's okay" logic. Why would people have to take extra steps to protect their privacy/delicate information?

Oh, don't get me wrong, including a camera and microphone in the Xbox without the ability to turn them off or cover them is stupid, and it will almost certainly lead to hackers exploiting it for whatever reasons. I was just mentioning that a lot of us also have uncovered webcams which are essentially the same thing, yet it's never bothered us before (although it's slightly different to a Kinect which will most likely be set up to have a very clear view of a central room in your house.)

 

[J Tyran]

The kicker is that the kinect also suposedly records sound.. aka conversations.

You know.. microsoft is delivering a hackers dream... all they need to do is hack into your xbox.. and lets face it someone WILL do it... and they can spy on you. The fact that the camera and audio recorder are allways on anyways make it that much more easier since no one who owns an xbox one will be suspicious of the kinect doing what microsoft wants it do do anyways right? XD

You can say this about a lot of things, phones, tablets, smartphones, some TVs, (My TV has a motion control like Kinect anyway and yes its still shit) laptops and even cars.

So many things have devices that can see you, hear you and report your location and any that connect to the internet or a network of some type can be hacked. The Xbone has a lot of problems but being spied on is either a non issue or just another device on the list at worst.

And all these devices have the option to shut the recording down. But if you want to use your xbone.. you cannot shut down the kinect part that keeps recording both visual and audio... aslong as you use the xbox.

My phone? I can turn off the camera. My laptop? Ditto. Furthermore both will not passively record any conversations that i have with other people... the xbone will.

See the difference now?

Because if the device is hacked the hacker can turn it on? Short of physically disconnecting microphones and cameras turning them off achieves little. Do you go through a devices options every 20 seconds or less to check they are not on? Can you even reliably tell if they are on or off? What happens if the hacker turns them on but leaves the notification that they off in place?

So again either a non issue or another device on the list. Phones can passively record conversations so I don't know where you got the idea that they can't from, not only can conversations or data transferred by a phone be tapped they act as a portable microphone that can record and transmit conversations that happen around (after all most phones have speakerphone capability) them they can transmit images and in some cases video too. Worse still turning it off will not stop it either, removing the battery is the only way because they can listen and transmit passively and even be turned on remotely by the mobile service provider. Its unlikely a hacker would have most of the options available to say the authorities as they are only possible with the cooperation of the network provider but its possible to hack a phone over wifi and get control of the operating system.