Legacy of the Void related questions

[Mangod]

Does that answer your question?

Um, no? I don't see what you're getting at, all that's stated is that Kerrigan is influenced by the will of Amon. That jives with what HotS says, that she was affected, but never controlled, and jives with her WoL persona, that Kerrigan demonstrates fatalism, believing from the outset that she can't win. The Q&A only reinforces what the games themselves tell us.

That's what I meant by subliminal - Kerrigan's actions are not her own, because she's being influenced to act in that way by someone else.

And while we're on the subject of SCII's writing being BS:

Question: In the introductory booklet for the original StarCraft, we learn that the Xel'naga created the Zerg in an attempt to make a creature that was pure not in form (like their "failed experiment," the Protoss) but in function. They created the Overmind and tried to remain hidden from it as they orbited Char, slowly influencing the evolution of the Zerg. But then the story goes that the Overmind learned of the Xel'naga's presence and attacked them, driving them clear out of the sector. If the Xel'naga aren't around now because the Overmind crushed their fleet, how could the Overmind have been enslaved by the Xel'naga all along, as WoL says?

Answer: Who said the Overmind was enslaved by the Xel'naga?

"The zerg were... altered. A single overriding objective was forced on them... the destruction of our people. The Overmind was formed with thought and reason but not with free will. It screamed and raged in a prison of its own mind."

"Tassadar", from the "Echoes of the Future" mission in SCII.

I really don't see what you're getting at. The user asks about the Overmind being enslaved by the xel'naga. It wasn't, only by Amon and his renegades. The xel'naga that it crushed were the ones not aligned with Amon. If anything, the quote shows that the revelations presented in LotV were planned even back then.

So Amon is not a Xel'naga? Duran isn't a Xel'naga? His other followers (presumably) weren't Xel'naga?

 

[Hawki]

That's what I meant by subliminal - Kerrigan's actions are not her own, because she's being influenced to act in that way by someone else.

Influenced, yes, but not controlled. There's nothing contradictory about that. Amon's influence was to effectively ground down Kerrigan's old 'drive.' The first hint of that comes at the end of Brood War, and we see it in action in WoL. It's also established that this only starts to occur at the end of the Brood War. Amon's influence is no more or less different narratively speaking than the Overmind, which turns Kerrigan into the Queen of Blades.

So Amon is not a Xel'naga? Duran isn't a Xel'naga? His other followers (presumably) weren't Xel'naga?

Maybe I should have explained that better. Of course they're xel'naga, but the phrasing of the question was based on the idea of there being one collective whole of xel'naga. The revelation that Amon was leading a renegade group didn't come up into LotV. So, the answer to the question is avoiding answering at all. The alternatives would be to outright lie (that the Overmind was never enslaved), or to spoil LotV three years before it was released.

 

[Mangod]

That's what I meant by subliminal - Kerrigan's actions are not her own, because she's being influenced to act in that way by someone else.

Influenced, yes, but not controlled. There's nothing contradictory about that. Amon's influence was to effectively ground down Kerrigan's old 'drive.' The first hint of that comes at the end of Brood War, and we see it in action in WoL. It's also established that this only starts to occur at the end of the Brood War. Amon's influence is no more or less different narratively speaking than the Overmind, which turns Kerrigan into the Queen of Blades.

Not saying that you're wrong, but can you give me a quote on that?

And I still don't see how this doesn't count as some form of mind control - she's controlled by the Overmind in SCI, yes, but if Kerrigan wasn't influenced/controlled by Amon, shouldn't she have turned back into Kerrigan 1.0 when the Overmind bit the dust?

She doesn't, which suggest that she's either Kerrigan was in full control of herself when she told Jim "I like what I am." in which case, purging her of the Zerg in WoL shouldn't have caused her personality to make a 180, or she wasn't, in which case she's being made to act against her own best interest by an outside force, i.e. mind control?

 

[Hawki]

Not saying that you're wrong, but can you give me a quote on that?

The quote within the game occurs on Zerus, after Kerrigan becomes the primal queen of blades. It occurs if you speak to Zurvan after the event:

Zurvan: And are you the equal of Amon, who once controlled you?

Kerrigan: He never controlled me. I felt...an influence. A trace of something dark, but long gone. Amon must have died before I was infested.

And I still don't see how this doesn't count as some form of mind control - she's controlled by the Overmind in SCI, yes, but if Kerrigan wasn't influenced/controlled by Amon, shouldn't she have turned back into Kerrigan 1.0 when the Overmind bit the dust?

Either Kerrigan was in full control of herself when she told Jim "I like what I am." in which case, purging her of the Zerg in WoL shouldn't have caused her personality to make a 180, or she wasn't, in which case she's being made to act against her own best interest by an outside force, i.e. mind control?

Kerrigan was never controlled by the Overmind. Even SC1/BW makes this apparent, and SC2 builds on it that her being independent is the entire reason for her existence in infested form. So, Kerrigan is in control of herself when she tells Jim tha she likes what she is, but to use the analogy, this is "Kerrigan 2.0" talking. Kerrigan in HotS is Kerrigan "3.0," so to speak, with plenty of darkness within her. That darkess existed as far back as "Kerrigan 1.0," so to speak.

Since it's something that's come up, I'll take this time to address it. I can understand the idea that people might not like Kerrigan being redeemed if they follow the logic that there's no personality divide at all between Sarah Louise Kerrigan, Terran Ghost, and Sarah Kerrigan, the Queen of Blades. SC1 and BW don't really outright state anything against this, as a lot of BW Kerrigan's actions are based on avenging transgressions done to her past self (e.g. she tells Mengsk that a lot of what she's done is payback for New Gettysburg). However, even back then, I would have disagreed with this interpretation, based on the following:

-Sarah Kerrigan did terrible things, but always regretted them (e.g. killing Mengsk's family). Throughout the terran campaign of SC1, she calls Mengsk out on his genocidal actions, even if she holds onto the hope that it's for a better tomorrow. You don't go from a person like that to the Queen ***** of the Universe without either a) heavy character development, or b) severe character change.

-It's definitively a case of the latter in my mind. She's put inside a chrysalis, infested, allowed to keep her sapience, but still altered on the biological level that, in my mind, even back then, is the main catalyst for changes on the psychological level. Everything that Kerrigan does in SC1/BW can be attributed to a combination of zerg influence and her old persona. Because without doubt, elements of the old persona remain - a zerg thrall has no reason to seek revenge - but Sarah Kerrigan, the terran, wasn't genocidal or sadistic.

-Which, brings us to the question of Amon. Indications are that Amon's influence (exerted through the zerg mutagen in her system) begins to occur at the end of Brood War. She gets the sense of a hollow victory, and senses the looming threat he presents. Four years later, and she's become fatalistic. Chances are you're going to do worse in a battle you believe you're fated to lose than in believing that you might actually win.

Fun fact, her hero page on SC2 does both confirm and deny this, the quote being

Soon after her ascension, the death of the Overmind left a power vacuum in the Swarm. The ensuing Brood War saw Kerrigan defeating foe after foe, and she even turned on old allies like Jim Raynor. When the conflict ended, she was in full control of the zerg.

"Or so she believed, for a dark influence, with twisted plans for the zerg and the galaxy, crept into her thoughts, exerting its will through her zerg mutagens?Kerrigan could not resist. She quietly prepared the Swarm until the Dark Voice commanded her to claim a powerful xel'naga artifact. She obeyed."

Now, that Amon directs her to retrieve the artifact doesn't make any sense within WoL itself (why would Duran foil her), within HotS (where she claims that she was never controlled), or in an interview that occurred between WoL and HotS, where it was stated that her reason for seeking the Keystone was to use it as a weapon. But even then, it does make a clear distinction between Brood War Kerrigan and post-Brood War Kerrigan.

So, anyway, I can understand why people like "Queen *****" Kerrigan more than her later incarnations. Certainly I loved her as a villain back then. But I don't feel that SC2 negates her characterization in those games. Everything she does in SC1 and BW is of her own volition. A form of volition brought on by zerg infestation, but her volition nonetheless.

 

[JamesStone]

That's not a RetCon at all. A RetCon is when you change what already happened, not when something else happens afterward that (partially) undoes the effects of something prior.

Very true. Kerrigan turning back into the Queen of Blades during the first half of HotS is not a retcon. However, it does render the plot of WoL sort of... moot? Mengsk is still alive at the beginning of HotS, Kerrigan is the Queen again... HotS doesn't retcon WoL, but it hits the Reset Button [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ResetButton]. What did WoL accomplish?

Other than introducing Space!Sargeras to the setting, I mean?

It removed Kerrigan of Amon's influence, greatly expanded the power of Raynor's Raiders, allowed the opportunity for a peaceful transition of power (which so many La Resistance! trope-users forget) with the introduction of Valerian Mengsk, introduced the foundations for the trilogy's hybrid threat as a thing that was happening right now, not just a veiled threat in the distant future like it was on Brood War, and effectively killed a villain: QueenBitch! Kerrigan is not the same person as Ghost!Kerrigan, but the character we control in HotS is, just traumatized and filled with a need for vengeance.


I'd say it accomplishes a lot, all things considered.