Marijuana legalization

[PurpleRain]

I hear a lot of people bickering about marijuana legalization. While I'm very anti-drug and anti-drug trade, I tend to view the way people argue as a 'Yes, because it ain't that harmful' or 'No, it screws your brain' type argument. I'm siding with the latter. Marijuana can be and is widely cut with all sorts of shit, so unless you know a guy growing it, you may be not getting the full whack. But there's the thing: growing the plant. This is the point of view I want to discuss.

I would imagine a better stance to take is making Marijuana seeds legal, but not the selling or buying of the plant. Of course, enforce the usual rules about not being able to smoke in public areas and don't smoke before driving but they're a whole other case. If people were able to grow their own plants, it would mean that they had control of what they were putting in their own body. It's personal and they can form their own judgments with the thing. With this, the trading of the drug would be cut drastically and so you'd get less people having to need a quick amount as it would be more of a growing and timely experiment.

I am very much against the drug and the use of it, but I would be okay with this. I enjoy people having freedoms to put whatever they want in their bodies, be is McDonalds, to this, to as far as acid, and I hold that freedom above my own beliefs.

 

[GoldenCondor]

Wait, so you can plant it but can't buy or se- what the hell?
Wouldn't this just mean it won't be allowed anywhere? Unless you steal it or harvest it from fields?

EDIT: I am not a smoker, nor am I interested in starting it, I'm just a little bit confused on PurpleRain's course of action, unless his intention is to completely disallow it, then I understand.

 

[Radeonx]

While that's a good idea, there would still be a lot of exchanging between "farmers" going on.
Seems interesting, though.

 

[thiosk]

I don't think it should be the governments business to tell people what to do with their bodies. Its the height of hypocrisy to say smoking cigs and drinking alcohol are ok, but smoking marijuana isn't.

All you have to do is look at the "deaths caused by" and "dollars spent enforcing" to see how stupid the whole thing is.

Anti-drug? Great, eat a cookie, put out a public service announcement, and talk to groups at your church. Prohibition has a long history of abject failure. Why is marijuana cut with shit? Because its illegality makes it expensive, and a limited supply can be bolstered by cutting. Thats the government's fault, not marijuana's. Also, gangs are interested in it because smuggling is lucrative.

California does the grow it at home thing quite frequently, and its not really working out too great. The best option is to end the stupid prohibition, and regulate through the ATF&E. Then we get on to doing more important things.

Also, there is little credible evidence to support brain damage caused by marijuana.

 

[AizenTheAzure]

That's the thing though, people consider it a gateway drug, if it was perfectly legal, with the same restrictions as alcohol, then people would be less likely to move on to something more serious. Legalization would also reduce the chances of buying it with something laced into it that you don't know about because you wouldn't be buying it from a dealer, you would be buying it at a gas station, or walmart. It would also be taxed, thus it would be profitable for the economy.

 

[Ammadessi]

PurpleRain: I'd like to introduce you to a concept called Prohibition that we tried here in the United States back in the 20's.

It was a miserable failure, created more crime than our country had seen it's inception and made criminals out of ordinary folk who just wanted a beer.

This is what the criminalization of Marijuana is doing.

And really, marijuana is a bloody plant, you don't "cut" it with things like you can with heroin unless you're getting yours from somebody who thinks it's funny to throw Oregano in with your stash.

Besides, for all that marijuana can do to you (very little), we have these wonderful things called alcohol and tobacco here that are far worse for you and as legal as waving the American flag.

Plus, can anyone name a mind-altering stimulant that's not only legal but so socially acceptable in the USA that you can buy it in almost every business you walk into? If you guess Caffeine, you're right! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caffeine

 

[GonzoGamer]

I don't think it should be the governments business to tell people what to do with their bodies. Its the height of hypocrisy to say smoking cigs and drinking alcohol are ok, but smoking marijuana isn't.

All you have to do is look at the "deaths caused by" and "dollars spent enforcing" to see how stupid the whole thing is.

Anti-drug? Great, eat a cookie, put out a public service announcement, and talk to groups at your church. Prohibition has a long history of abject failure. Why is marijuana cut with shit? Because its illegality makes it expensive, and a limited supply can be bolstered by cutting. Thats the government's fault, not marijuana's.

Also, there is little credible evidence to support brain damage caused by marijuana.

Yes, this.
If the government legalized it, there would be less instances of it being cut with other stuff, people would be able to find out if a particular source is cut, and they could do something about it. Take it out of the hands of criminals and it will be safer.

Just like with alcohol prohibition. The bathtub gin people used to make during prohibition was sometimes so strong it would kill people. Sure people still die of alcohol poisoning (as opposed to weed which has never killed anyone) now but at least now they know how much alcohol they are getting when they open a bottle.

 

[PurpleRain]

Wait, so you can plant it but can't buy or se- what the hell?
Wouldn't this just mean it won't be allowed anywhere? Unless you steal it or harvest it from fields?

EDIT: I am not a smoker, nor am I interested in starting it, I'm just a little bit confused on PurpleRain's course of action, unless his intention is to completely disallow it, then I understand.

You realize, people can grow it at home. This stops the growing by the farmers and keeps it for personal use. People can buy the seeds like any plant.

I don't think it should be the governments business to tell people what to do with their bodies. Its the height of hypocrisy to say smoking cigs and drinking alcohol are ok, but smoking marijuana isn't.

All you have to do is look at the "deaths caused by" and "dollars spent enforcing" to see how stupid the whole thing is.

Anti-drug? Great, eat a cookie, put out a public service announcement, and talk to groups at your church. Prohibition has a long history of abject failure. Why is marijuana cut with shit? Because its illegality makes it expensive, and a limited supply can be bolstered by cutting. Thats the government's fault, not marijuana's. Also, gangs are interested in it because smuggling is lucrative.

California does the grow it at home thing quite frequently, and its not really working out too great. The best option is to end the stupid prohibition, and regulate through the ATF&E. Then we get on to doing more important things.

Also, there is little credible evidence to support brain damage caused by marijuana.

Umm, I feel you didn't read what I wrote or misunderstood because you're going in way another direction.

While that's a good idea, there would still be a lot of exchanging between "farmers" going on.
Seems interesting, though.

People can 'give it to their friends' but if money is involved it would become an offense. How it is controlled, I don't know. But honestly, it makes little sense why someone would still be trying to push it if it was legal in the store, unless the people buying are completely lazy.

 

[PurpleRain]

That's the thing though, people consider it a gateway drug, if it was perfectly legal, with the same restrictions as alcohol, then people would be less likely to move on to something more serious. Legalization would also reduce the chances of buying it with something laced into it that you don't know about because you wouldn't be buying it from a dealer, you would be buying it at a gas station, or walmart. It would also be taxed, thus it would be profitable for the economy.

It can't be laced because you're growing it.

PurpleRain: I'd like to introduce you to a concept called Prohibition that we tried here in the United States back in the 20's.

It was a miserable failure, created more crime than our country had seen it's inception and made criminals out of ordinary folk who just wanted a beer.

This is what the criminalization of Marijuana is doing.

And really, marijuana is a bloody plant, you don't "cut" it with things like you can with heroin unless you're getting yours from somebody who thinks it's funny to throw Oregano in with your stash.

Besides, for all that marijuana can do to you (very little), we have these wonderful things called alcohol and tobacco here that are far worse for you and as legal as waving the American flag.

Plus, can anyone name a mind-altering stimulant that's not only legal but so socially acceptable in the USA that you can buy it in almost every business you walk into? If you guess Caffeine, you're right! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caffeine

I don't understand why the US keeps popping up. It is illegal in most countries you realize. Also, I'm not discussing the chemicals of it, just the buying and selling of seeds.

I think many people missed my point.

 

[GoldenCondor]

Wait, so you can plant it but can't buy or se- what the hell?
Wouldn't this just mean it won't be allowed anywhere? Unless you steal it or harvest it from fields?

EDIT: I am not a smoker, nor am I interested in starting it, I'm just a little bit confused on PurpleRain's course of action, unless his intention is to completely disallow it, then I understand.

You realize, people can grow it at home. This stops the growing by the farmers and keeps it for personal use. People can buy the seeds like any plant.

I totally missed the seed thing, I get it now.

 

[Lysserd]

That actually makes a lot of sense. The only thing that came to mind against it is that it would be hard to tell what is grown product or product that was traded somehow. That and people would still go through dealers a lot, the base of most consumers buying habits is that they're lazy.

 

[thiosk]

snip

California has lost control of marijuana, and a huge number of people are home growing all over the state.

The remaining federal ban on all marijuana is conflicting here, and this move is causing an increase in crime. If we decriminalized at the federal level, and allowed home growers to grow, that would be fine; but I argue its a half step.

Just end prohibition and leave it to the states and counties to regulate and tax; just like alcohol and tobacco.

 

[jpoon]

I'm all for being able to grow your own pot. It's a good idea, though legalization and at least decriminalization is something that really needs to happen.

I still can't believe that people would be able to fear weed more than they fear alcohol, it just makes no sense if you have ever used it (frequent user here). I would easily be able to smoke for hours and still be confident in doing almost anything that requires skill and a focused mind. The same I definitely cannot say for alcohol.

 

[Pegghead]

Sure, but what if say, ol' farmer Benson started up the cannabis trade in his farm atop the village. Then one day there was an enormous fire which spread all the way through his fields, and possibly even to the villagers marijuana growths. I can guarantee you the whole damn town would be high as a kite for a week. I say any substance that can make the world go funny and slow, and if overdone CAN cause health problems should not be allowed, to cultivate, use, abuse, trade anything associated with it. Simple as that. And no I am not a blowhard, joyless old man.

 

[RockThineWorld]

In the UK, cannabis plant seeds are legal... you're just not allowed to grow the plant. Odd double standards yet again! On another interesting note, a well-known campaigner for the legalisation of cannabis in the UK has suggested that ALL drugs should be re-graded based on the impact they have on the human body and mind. With his suggestion, alcohol and nicotine would both be regarded as more harmful than cannabis, ecstasy, and LSD!

 

[jpoon]

That's just a rediculous idea though Pegghead. What about industrial operations that catch fire, releasing deadly poisons across city blocks? Should they be forced to permenantly close down before it happens just for the fact that it could catch fire? This could be a substance that make people go funny, slow down then die. Might as well make cars illegal in this city because they cause a lot of harm to people. What about pharmaceuticals, they harm people, take them off the market too!

 

[PurpleRain]

snip

California has lost control of marijuana, and a huge number of people are home growing all over the state.

The remaining federal ban on all marijuana is conflicting here, and this move is causing an increase in crime. If we decriminalized at the federal level, and allowed home growers to grow, that would be fine; but I argue its a half step.

Just end prohibition and leave it to the states and counties to regulate and tax; just like alcohol and tobacco.

How is it only half a step though? You want your weed, you got it, but you have to grow it. It makes it more healthy and makes you more aware of what you're putting inside of you. Most people are not aware of that last part, even in diets. People eat whatever they want.
What more would have have them do? It is legal, just the trade outside of stores aka most things (notice how packages of chips say 'not for resale'?). For it to be illegal smoking outside also makes sense. I don't want that shit blown into my face.

That's just a rediculous idea though Pegghead. What about industrial operations that catch fire, releasing deadly poisons across city blocks? Should they be forced to permenantly close down before it happens just for the fact that it could catch fire? This could be a substance that make people go funny, slow down then die. Might as well make cars illegal in this city because they cause a lot of harm to people. What about pharmaceuticals, they harm people, take them off the market too!

Industrial operations? What the hell are you talking about? Read my OP. Operations are illegal. You can only trade the seeds. They are not hallucinogenic if they burned.

In the UK, cannabis plant seeds are legal... you're just not allowed to grow the plant. Odd double standards yet again! On another interesting note, a well-known campaigner for the legalisation of cannabis in the UK has suggested that ALL drugs should be re-graded based on the impact they have on the human body and mind. With his suggestion, alcohol and nicotine would both be regarded as more harmful than cannabis, ecstasy, and LSD!

In that case it is not marijuana. Hemp seeds are different but come from the same plant. They are not hallucinogenic but are really healthy for you. I put them in my cereal.

Sure, but what if say, ol' farmer Benson started up the cannabis trade in his farm atop the village. Then one day there was an enormous fire which spread all the way through his fields, and possibly even to the villagers marijuana growths. I can guarantee you the whole damn town would be high as a kite for a week. I say any substance that can make the world go funny and slow, and if overdone CAN cause health problems should not be allowed, to cultivate, use, abuse, trade anything associated with it. Simple as that. And no I am not a blowhard, joyless old man.

Read the OP. Seriously folks. Trading the plant is illegal. Perhaps there would also be restrictions on the size and amount that people were able to grow.

 

[Ammadessi]

-snip-

PurpleRain: I'd like to introduce you to a concept called Prohibition that we tried here in the United States back in the 20's.

It was a miserable failure, created more crime than our country had seen it's inception and made criminals out of ordinary folk who just wanted a beer.

This is what the criminalization of Marijuana is doing.

And really, marijuana is a bloody plant, you don't "cut" it with things like you can with heroin unless you're getting yours from somebody who thinks it's funny to throw Oregano in with your stash.

Besides, for all that marijuana can do to you (very little), we have these wonderful things called alcohol and tobacco here that are far worse for you and as legal as waving the American flag.

Plus, can anyone name a mind-altering stimulant that's not only legal but so socially acceptable in the USA that you can buy it in almost every business you walk into? If you guess Caffeine, you're right! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caffeine

I don't understand why the US keeps popping up. It is illegal in most countries you realize. Also, I'm not discussing the chemicals of it, just the buying and selling of seeds.

I think many people missed my point.

I brought up the US because I live here and it's a brilliant example of how prohibition creates crime and doesn't actually stop something from being used.

I was addressing, mostly, the beginning of your post when you claimed that marijuana "screws up your brain". I have a hard time dealing with the rest of your post because allowing the sale of seeds and seeds only sounds far too similar to the Marijuana Tax Act: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marihuana_Tax_Act_of_1937

 

[jpoon]

Industrial operations? What the hell are you talking about? Read my OP. Operations are illegal. You can only trade the seeds. They are not hallucinogenic if they burned.

Dude, I wasn't even talking to you. As in my post, had you paid attention, you would've seen I was speaking to Pegghead.
I'm all for your idea bud, and if you burned the best ganja around it's still not hallucinogenic so that's a moot point.