Mutations?

[andrewfox]

The modern evolutionary theory relies on a number of processes including mutation, random genetic drift, gene flow and natural selection.

A quick question about mutations however. It seems that the general definition of mutation is; "It?s important to remember that mutations are random; they do not occur in response to an organism?s need. Mutations can have neutral, harmful or beneficial effects. "

Q: What's a beneficial HUMAN mutation? More importantly, where can I find one?

Although I hate citing wiki, their definition seems more accurate.

"Mutations are changes in the DNA sequence of a cell's genome and are caused by radiation, viruses, transposons and mutagenic chemicals, as well as errors that occur during meiosis or DNA replication."

Nothing I've seen or read has lead me to believe that mutations are beneficial to evolution.

If this is true, then it's a big problem to the theory as a whole.

Without positive variation at a genetic level, change from generation to generation would be unlikely(impossible).

 

[Floppertje]

easy, a beneficial mutation would be, say, the changing of the color of an animal's fur so it's better camouflaged and can hunt more easily.
therefore it is more likely to survive and produce offspring, which will have the same mutation, this way you get a new, more successful breed of animal, i.e., it has evolved.

 

[Dags90]

The thought of "beneficial mutations" is meaningless without an environment. In the environment of Sub-Saharan Africa, Sickle-Cell mutations are beneficial, especially in the heterozygote form. So in Sub-Saharan Africa:

The gene defect is a known mutation of a single nucleotide (see single-nucleotide polymorphism - SNP) (A to T) of the β-globin gene, which results in glutamate being substituted by valine at position

Is a beneficial mutation.

Both definitions are correct, and combining them gives a better example of how DNA works. Mutations aren't beneficial to evolution, mutations and the passing on of genes are why (and how) evolution happens.

Many people have a distorted quasi-Lamarkian view of genetics and evolution, which is why the first definition makes those clarifications.

 

[andrewfox]

I should have specified. HUMAN mutation.

 

[kikon9]

Well, the hammerhead is a good example of a beneficial mutation. A mutation that caused the head to be shaped in a unique manner. The gene for the strange head was successful and was passed on to more and more offspring. Until we reach the present day in which we have the hammerhead species.
Also, Natural selection doesn't work using mutations. Just whichever ones survive pass on their genes. So, the genes that pass into the gene pools get more and more specialized and differentiate from the species that once was. This is the fundamental method of evolutionary change that occurs and causes genes (and thus DNA) to change slowly over millions of years.

 

[andrewfox]

That's not evolution. Will it is but its Micro evolution. That's adapting.

You don't get a new breed, just a better animal.

 

[kikon9]

I should have specified. HUMAN mutation.

Just because a human mutation hasn't occurred yet doesn't mean that all of evolution has been debunked. Besides, what about the mutation that caused Cro-Magnon to divert from Neandertal?

 

[sheic99]

I should have specified. HUMAN mutation.

Sickle cell is a mutation. It gives a natural resistance to malaria, ergo beneficial.

 

[Georgie_Leech]

Well, we have oppossable thumbs, An upright gait allowing us to grasp things with our hands, and the brains necessary to create tools. Do those count?

 

[kikon9]

You are thinking in the short term. Over billions and billions of years the gene changes add up into a completely different species.

 

[andrewfox]

Well, the hammerhead is a good example of a beneficial mutation. A mutation that caused the head to be shaped in a unique manner. The gene for the strange head was successful and was passed on to more and more offspring. Until we reach the present day in which we have the hammerhead species.
Also, Natural selection doesn't work using mutations. Just whichever ones survive pass on their genes. So, the genes that pass into the gene pools get more and more specialized and differentiate from the species that once was. This is the fundamental method of evolutionary change that occurs and causes genes (and thus DNA) to change slowly over millions of years.

Animal mutation, not human. Furthermore, mutations work against Natural Selection. It's why the green beetle gets eaten more often the the brown one. The brown beetle had a mutation that caused its shell to turn green.

 

[andrewfox]

I should have specified. HUMAN mutation.

Sickle cell is human evolution. It gives a natural resistance to malaria, ergo beneficial.

That's a wide-believed myth.

The problems with this are obvious, as the sickle cell mutation, like the many other described hemoglobin mutations, clearly impairs the function of the otherwise marvelously well-designed hemoglobin molecule. It can in no way be regarded as an improvement in our species, even though its preservation is enhanced in malaria-endemic parts of central Africa by natural selection.

 

[kikon9]

Well, the hammerhead is a good example of a beneficial mutation. A mutation that caused the head to be shaped in a unique manner. The gene for the strange head was successful and was passed on to more and more offspring. Until we reach the present day in which we have the hammerhead species.
Also, Natural selection doesn't work using mutations. Just whichever ones survive pass on their genes. So, the genes that pass into the gene pools get more and more specialized and differentiate from the species that once was. This is the fundamental method of evolutionary change that occurs and causes genes (and thus DNA) to change slowly over millions of years.

Animal mutation, not human. Furthermore, mutations work against Natural Selection. It's why the green beetle gets eaten more often the the brown one. The brown beetle had a mutation that caused its shell to turn green.

You do realize that I said Natural Selection DOESN'T use mutations. Right?

 

[Dags90]

That's not evolution. Will it is but its Micro evolution. That's adapting.

You don't get a new breed, just a better animal.

There's no real distinction made between micro and macro evolution other than one obviously requiring a lot more time. I think you either have a serious agenda you're trying to prove, are seriously misguided, or trolling.

 

[andrewfox]

Well, we have oppossable thumbs, An upright gait allowing us to grasp things with our hands, and the brains necessary to create tools. Do those count?

Those are not mutations. The same way speech isn't a mutation.

 

[andrewfox]

Well, the hammerhead is a good example of a beneficial mutation. A mutation that caused the head to be shaped in a unique manner. The gene for the strange head was successful and was passed on to more and more offspring. Until we reach the present day in which we have the hammerhead species.
Also, Natural selection doesn't work using mutations. Just whichever ones survive pass on their genes. So, the genes that pass into the gene pools get more and more specialized and differentiate from the species that once was. This is the fundamental method of evolutionary change that occurs and causes genes (and thus DNA) to change slowly over millions of years.

Animal mutation, not human. Furthermore, mutations work against Natural Selection. It's why the green beetle gets eaten more often the the brown one. The brown beetle had a mutation that caused its shell to turn green.

You do realize that I said Natural Selection DOESN'T use mutations. Right?

Right. But without mutations, there's no evolution.

 

[andrewfox]

That's not evolution. Will it is but its Micro evolution. That's adapting.

You don't get a new breed, just a better animal.

There's no real distinction made between micro and macro evolution other than one obviously requiring a lot more time. I think you either have a serious agenda you're trying to prove, are seriously misguided, or trolling.

D. None the above. Just trying to learn more. XD

OT: So, mutation+time= profit?

 

[BrassButtons]

Nothing I've seen or read has lead me to believe that mutations are beneficial to evolution.

The first four results in google using "examples of beneficial mutations" yields these:

http://www.gate.net/~rwms/EvoMutations.html
examples of beneficial mutations
http://www.buzzle.com/articles/beneficial-mutation.html
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/mutations.html

There are more, but you get the idea. A search using just the word "mutation" yields similar results, and I imagine any other similarly-worded search would give you the same. Quite frankly if you haven't been able to find examples of beneficial mutations, then you haven't tried very hard.

 

[Catalyst6]

That's not evolution. Will it is but its Micro evolution. That's adapting.

You don't get a new breed, just a better animal.

.../sigh. Once again someone hears about evolution in Bio 101 and thinks that they know everything.

If you're looking for evidence of positive mutation in humans, then you can look at the resistances to various diseases that we've built up over the years. A population gets a disease (2,3,4) almost everyone dies except the people with the resistance (5,6,7) then those survivors spawn themselves retarded (and take a bow).

As for why we don't have drastic changes in physiology, well, you need to have natural pressure to force a change and Homo sapien hasn't been pressured since we invented firearms and modern plumbing. Our technology has replaced our physical changes.

 

[andrewfox]

Nothing I've seen or read has lead me to believe that mutations are beneficial to evolution.

The first four results in google using "examples of beneficial mutations" yields these:

http://www.gate.net/~rwms/EvoMutations.html
examples of beneficial mutations
http://www.buzzle.com/articles/beneficial-mutation.html
http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/mutations.html

There are more, but you get the idea. A search using just the word "mutation" yields similar results, and I imagine any other similarly-worded search would give you the same. Quite frankly if you haven't been able to find examples of beneficial mutations, then you haven't tried very hard.

Great Jay-Z. Topic Discussion: "Q: What's a beneficial HUMAN mutation? More importantly, where can I find one?"