New Sikorsky attack helicopter

[Faelix]

Sikorsky are just about finished building the S-97. Which may or may not be the helicopter to replace the American Apache attack helicopters. Unlike the F-35 jet, this is a real job well done.

http://www.janes.com/article/27592/sikorsky-starts-s-97-raider-final-assembly

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_aop2ePwcYg

 

[Clowndoe]

Says it has a 50 cal. machine gun and two rocket pods, it doesn't look like this is going to replace the Apache, which has a 30 mm cannon and four hardpoints which may include guided Hellfire missiles. Apart from that, there isn't much us civies can do to evaluate it except wait 30-40 years after a major war involving this machine. I'm guessing that's how long it will take before we can get an unbiased view of its true value.

 

[Frezzato]

The S-97 isn't a dedicated attack helicopter nor is it meant to replace the Apache. The intended use is to possibly replace the aging OH-58 Kiowa, a light scout/reconnaissance platform with a mast-mounted optics/laser designator package. As one of just two pusher-propeller concepts, my money is on Sikorsky, although the shrouded pushers on the AVX are interesting.

I'm hoping that, in addition to retractable landing gear, the design has internal weapons bays as well, which is clearly possible as that's how the discontinued Comanche design was.

 

[Heronblade]

That?

Its design is suited to fill recon, fast transport, and light combat roles. In other words, all purpose support. The Apache is a two person heavy assault chopper. The two birds do not have much in common.

 

[Frezzato]

That?

Its design is suited to fill recon, fast transport, and light combat roles. The Apache is a two person heavy assault chopper. The two birds do not have much in common.

In retrospect, an internal weapons bay on the S-97 doesn't make sense (as I had just written) as you reminded me of the intended cargo space for up to six passengers, in which case it's just the fixed .50 cal and unguided rockets. Unless they place a designator on the roof or mast, I can't imagine the S-97 doing much combat support as it might be best suited for medivac or even use in the civilian market.

One thing's for sure, I've always wanted to see what contra-rotating rotors could do. These fringe concepts never seem to catch on, such as the shrouded tail of the Dauphin (at an insane 3,500+ RPM) and NOTAR concept (seen in use by LA County sheriffs.

 

[J Tyran]

One thing's for sure, I've always wanted to see what contra-rotating rotors could do. These fringe concepts never seem to catch on, such as the shrouded tail of the Dauphin (at an insane 3,500+ RPM) and NOTAR concept (seen in use by LA County sheriffs.

The Russians have had several successful contra-rotating rotor helicopters, including gunships and transports. The Kamov KA-50/52 is unusual beyond its rotors too as its a single seat gunship with an ejector seat.

 

[Frezzato]

The Russians have had several successful contra-rotating rotor helicopters, including gunships and transports. The Kamov KA-50/52 is unusual beyond its rotors too as its a single seat gunship with an ejector seat.

Yeah, the Hokum was always an intriguing design for me. I didn't know about the ejector seat though.

Since the Sikorsky is a proven, working prototype, I'm hoping that someone will utilize its max speed for something like a Lifeflight role in the civilian world, or something like the Coast Guard as something to replace the Dauphin, which is already over 25 years old in design. I dunno, put some external fuel tanks and a winch at a loss of a few knots at max speed, and you would have a superb life saving vehicle I think, especially considering the claim that they can reduce rotor noise with new blade designs. But who knows what the downdraft would be with dual rotors.

 

[J Tyran]

The Russians have had several successful contra-rotating rotor helicopters, including gunships and transports. The Kamov KA-50/52 is unusual beyond its rotors too as its a single seat gunship with an ejector seat.

Yeah, the Hokum was always an intriguing design for me. I didn't know about the ejector seat though.

Since the Sikorsky is a proven, working prototype, I'm hoping that someone will utilize its max speed for something like a Lifeflight role in the civilian world, or something like the Coast Guard as something to replace the Dauphin, which is already over 25 years old in design. I dunno, put some external fuel tanks and a winch at a loss of a few knots at max speed, and you would have a superb life saving vehicle I think, especially considering the claim that they can reduce rotor noise with new blade designs. But who knows what the downdraft would be with dual rotors.

Should be fine as an S&R design, the Russians have had the KA-27 in service for decades in that role. Along with other Naval roles like ASW and assault transport.

 

[rcs619]

That?

Its design is suited to fill recon, fast transport, and light combat roles. The Apache is a two person heavy assault chopper. The two birds do not have much in common.

In retrospect, an internal weapons bay on the S-97 doesn't make sense (as I had just written) as you reminded me of the intended cargo space for up to six passengers, in which case it's just the fixed .50 cal and unguided rockets. Unless they place a designator on the roof or mast, I can't imagine the S-97 doing much combat support as it might be best suited for medivac or even use in the civilian market.

One thing's for sure, I've always wanted to see what contra-rotating rotors could do. These fringe concepts never seem to catch on, such as the shrouded tail of the Dauphin (at an insane 3,500+ RPM) and NOTAR concept (seen in use by LA County sheriffs.

Yeah, should be interesting to see. By all accounts, it ought to be pretty dang fast at least. I believe the X2 broke all sorts of speed records during its testing. In all likelihood this is just going to be a fast little scout-chopper or medivac. But if the technology proves viable, I don't think scaling it up would be much of an issue.

I know the Russians' Blackshark attack helicopter uses contra-rotating propellers (with no tail rotor at all), and it can do back-flips and stuff. Don't see why the same sort of concept, with a pusher propeller, couldn't be applied to an apache-style heavy gunship, or a blackhawk-style transport.

One thing that would be neat though, and I don't know if they're going to try this or not, would be if the pusher prop's blades had variable pitch. If the blades themselves could be rotated in place, the propeller could transition from forward to reverse thrust with the push of a lever, and the prop itself would never have to stop or change directions. It could just keep spinning, and they could adjust the pitch of the blades to go fast, to throw it into reverse, or flatten out the blades to where the pusher provides almost zero thrust to let the chopper maneuver in a more traditional way. I know they use that sort of thing in robotic quadrotors, and it lets them transition instantly from upright to inverted flight. Propellers keep spinning the same direction, only the blades reverse their bite.

 

[Frezzato]

Should be fine as an S&R design, the Russians have had the KA-27 in service for decades in that role. Along with other Naval roles like ASW and assault transport.

Incredibly, the more I look up different helicopter specs online, the more choppers I find that have almost twice the service ceiling of the S-97 prototype. This includes the 30-year old KA-27 That high top speed comes at a significant cost it seems.

I love the look of the KA-27, too. It looks like it's from a Miyazaki movie, which by no means is an insult.