Political Correctness and Halloween Costumes

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Jun 16, 2010
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So, today two different British retailers (Tesco & Asda) pulled their "mental patient" Halloween costumes in response to criticism that they are perpetuating a negative stereotype and reinforcing the stigma against mental illness. (Link to news article [http://www.scottishdailyexpress.co.uk/news/uk/432316/Tesco-and-Asda-remove-offensive-mental-Halloween-costumes-after-backlash])

There is a lot of backlash, however, from people who feel this is over-sensitive and "political correctness gone mad" (see comments of linked article).

I was just wondering what people on The Escapist thought about this.

Now, admittedly I may be a bit biased on this issue, because my brother currently is a mental patient. But then again, 'bias' is an easy way to write off the fact that I have direct experience of what it's actually like, and most of these detractors have only movies to go off. I've been visiting a maximum security psych ward; I have seen it all. And even the worst, most violent patients (my brother included) are less threatening/scary than your average wannabe hard-man out to prove how tough he is.

But it isn't the reinforcement of the "all mental patients are knife-wielding maniacs" stereotype that really hacks me off. That was ignorant and lazy on the part of Asda, but they swiftly apologised. It's the people saying "Oh look, here comes the PC brigade to spoil all our fun again. *eye-roll*"

Essentially what you're saying is:
"Alright, I'll accept that I shouldn't call black people niggers any more, or call gays faggots, because I'll get in trouble. But now I can't even dress up as a nutter? Who am I supposed to ridicule and dehumanise for fun now?! All I've got left is fat people and old people!"

I don't mean to poison the wells of a reasonable debate.
To be clear, I don't think political correctness is something that should be legally enforced. But if someone uses a lazy, ill-informed, damaging stereotype instead of actually researching what they are portraying (something that takes 5 minutes on Google these days), I think that's stupid of them. And defending that stupidity on the basis of "it's just a bit of fun" is downright despicable.

Another thing I feel I should make clear: using stereotypes ironically doesn't bother me, as long as the point of the joke/story element is intended to criticise the stereotype, rather than reinforce it. For example, Sarah Silverman's "I hate chinks" joke is different from her just unironically hating 'chinks'.
For artists/comedians, this can be a bit of a grey area (i.e. "how much should I try to 'wink' at the audience to show I'm not really racist/sexist/etc?").

But for commenters who say, "What's the big deal? I don't think it was so bad," despite having zero knowledge or experience on the matter... it drives me insane. No pun intended.

Edit:
For those who don't want to bother with the article, here is the original picture:



Note: bloody straight-jacket, knife, crazy mask = "mental patient".
Not even 'murderous' mental patient; apparently that's a given.
 

Bertylicious

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I totally agree with you and I can't imagine that there would be many who would disagree. What I find really perplexing is how a modern, corporate, entity like ASDA, and Tesco and Aldi as well I guess, could make such a a crude mis-step in terms of product selection.

Then again, what if they'd titled the costume something like "psycho killer"? That would potentially have been a bit more nuanced.
 

DefunctTheory

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I see absolutely no problem with this.

It was a costume, based off of a common horror theme. Whoop-de-do.
 

MysticSlayer

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To me, it is a Halloween costume inspired by horror movies, a popular movie genre for the holiday. If no one said anything, I wouldn't even think about it trying to represent a mentally ill person, but, then again, I guess I've never viewed mentally ill people in a stereotypical manner.

Of course, if this was obviously meant as a mentally ill stereotype I'd be willing to raise concerns, but again, I don't see that. It's based on horror movies, and even if horror movies get their inspiration from the stereotype, I'm pretty sure people will associate it with a horror movie villain much more than a mentally ill person, especially given that people would be wearing it on Halloween.
 
Jun 16, 2010
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AccursedTheory said:
I see absolutely no problem with this.

It was a costume, based off of a common horror theme. Whoop-de-do.
I think that is the main problem with it. Not only is it saying "this is what mental patients look like", but it's also implying "mental patients are something to be terrified of" and strengthening the association of the mentally ill with 'other' monsters you commonly dress up as for Halloween.

Not to mention that merely having a 'costume' representing a certain group of people will dehumanise them:



It wasn't so long ago that this was an acceptable bit of fun, too.
 

Thaluikhain

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Heh, I assumed this'd be about race, and the OP would be complaining about political correctness gone mad.

James Joseph Emerald said:
Essentially what you're saying is:
"Alright, I'll accept that I shouldn't call black people niggers any more, or call gays faggots, because I'll get in trouble. But now I can't even dress up as a nutter? Who am I supposed to ridicule and dehumanise for fun now?! All I've got left is fat people and old people!"
More or less, yeah.

James Joseph Emerald said:
Ironically, I think those kind of people are borderline mentally ill themselves, with their fundamental inability to question their own beliefs or consider the consequences of what they say and do.
Er...not really.

...

Anyhoo, yeah, every year this comes up, people say "Please stop perpetuating stereotypes about my minority group" and people saying "No, it's fun for us privileged types, I don't care how you feel".
 

krazykidd

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Bertylicious said:
I totally agree with you and I can't imagine that there would be many who would disagree. What I find really perplexing is how a modern, corporate, entity like ASDA, and Tesco and Aldi as well I guess, could make such a a crude mis-step in terms of product selection.

Then again, what if they'd titled the costume something like "psycho killer"? That would potentially have been a bit more nuanced.
Really? Then what about those guys that dress up like girls for holloween? Or they offending trangenders?
Or those girls that dress up as sexy nurses! They give nurses such a bad rep!
Or the girls that dress up as babies ( litteral babies) . They are promotting pedophilism!

Seriously guys this shit is getting out of hand . Maybe we should just cancel holloween this year , people are over sensitive about everything.
 
Jun 16, 2010
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krazykidd said:
Really? Then what about those guys that dress up like girls for holloween? Or they offending trangenders?
Or those girls that dress up as sexy nurses! They give nurses such a bad rep!
Or the girls that dress up as babies ( litteral babies) . They are promotting pedophilism!
I really hope you are joking around here. I would use what you just said verbatim as a parody of people who completely miss the point.

There are so many things wrong with what you just said, it's exhausting to even consider going into every single aspect of how wrong that is. From your trivialising of the stigma against mental illness by likening it to how real nurses feel about sexy nurse outfits (WTF?) to the assumption that naming a baby costume "pedophile bait" wouldn't also be horrid (another big WTF)... I just don't even.
 
Jun 16, 2010
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thaluikhain said:
James Joseph Emerald said:
Ironically, I think those kind of people are borderline mentally ill themselves, with their fundamental inability to question their own beliefs or consider the consequences of what they say and do.
Er...not really.

...
Fair enough, that might've been a bit of an exaggeration.
 

Casual Shinji

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Wait, how do you dress up as a mental patient? Just wear a straight jacket?

From the image in the linked article it just looks like a regular homicidal maniac get-up, nothing to link it to people with actual mental disabilities other than they're both human.

So I'm gonna have to say 'What's the big deal?' And that's coming from someone who has his fair share of experience with mentally disabled people.
 
Jun 16, 2010
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Casual Shinji said:
Wait, how do you dress up as a mental patient? Just wear a straight jacket?

From the image in the linked article it just looks like a regular homicidal maniac get-up, nothing to link it to people with actual mental disabilities other than they're both human.
For some reason the article changed its main picture. Here is the original:



Note: bloody straight-jacket, knife, crazy mask = "mental patient".
No qualifications whatsoever.

It wouldn't be half as bad if it was called "homicidal maniac" or whatever.
 

hazabaza1

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They probably should have renamed it to "bloodied psychopath" or something but I don't really have an issue with people dressing up as whatever.
That being said, do exercise some caution for what you dress up as. If you're going to a little kids party and you go in black face with a watermelon crown calling yourself "King of the Niggmatrons" then yeah there might be an issue.
 

DefunctTheory

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James Joseph Emerald said:
krazykidd said:
Really? Then what about those guys that dress up like girls for holloween? Or they offending trangenders?
Or those girls that dress up as sexy nurses! They give nurses such a bad rep!
Or the girls that dress up as babies ( litteral babies) . They are promotting pedophilism!
I really hope you are joking around here. I would use what you just said verbatim as a parody of people who completely miss the point.

There are so many things wrong with what you just said, it's exhausting to even consider going into every single aspect of how wrong that is. From your trivialising of the stigma against mental illness by likening it to how real nurses feel about sexy nurse outfits (WTF?) to the assumption that naming a baby costume "pedophile bait" wouldn't also be horrid (another big WTF)... I just don't even.
It's not though.

This costume can be considered offensive by the mentally ill because some people can construe it as a statement that all mentally ill, institutionalized people are psychos. Why does that not apply to anything else? Sexy nurse uniforms could make a nurse feel trivialized and sexualized, like her occupation is just a nice dress up for being a whore. Dressing up as the opposite sex can be viewed as a mockery of transgenders, as Halloween is supposed to be an event where you dress up as something scary or silly.

You see how this works? It takes almost no effort to find a group of people who may be offended. Yet you have a double standard - The mental patient thing is offensive because of your personal experiences. But other peoples examples are bullshit, because you can't see why people would be offended.

For shame, sir.
 
Jun 16, 2010
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hazabaza1 said:
That being said, do exercise some caution for what you dress up as. If you're going to a little kids party and you go in black face with a watermelon crown calling yourself "King of the Niggmatrons" then yeah there might be an issue.
Some frat boy doing that as a joke would be one thing. Actually having a big corporate entity selling a "Niggmatron, King of Watermelons" costume is a totally different matter. In fact, the only real difference between that, and what has just happened, is that currently the mentally ill are a slightly more culturally acceptable target.
 

Casual Shinji

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James Joseph Emerald said:
For some reason the article changed its picture. Here is the original:



Note: bloody straight-jacket, knife, crazy mask = "mental patient".
No qualifications whatsoever.

It wouldn't be half as bad if it was called "homicidal maniac" or whatever.
Yeah, I still don't see the big deal.

This looks like the typical movie rendition of the psycho axe murderer, a la Leatherface. It's a harmless horror trope.

Now if it was a costume that included slit wrists and drool and a hospital garment or something... But this? No.
 

Bertylicious

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krazykidd said:
Bertylicious said:
I totally agree with you and I can't imagine that there would be many who would disagree. What I find really perplexing is how a modern, corporate, entity like ASDA, and Tesco and Aldi as well I guess, could make such a a crude mis-step in terms of product selection.

Then again, what if they'd titled the costume something like "psycho killer"? That would potentially have been a bit more nuanced.
Really? Then what about those guys that dress up like girls for holloween? Or they offending trangenders?
Or those girls that dress up as sexy nurses! They give nurses such a bad rep!
Or the girls that dress up as babies ( litteral babies) . They are promotting pedophilism!

Seriously guys this shit is getting out of hand . Maybe we should just cancel holloween this year , people are over sensitive about everything.
I dunno, I can't help but think those are bad examples. Like, a sexy nurse isn't really a derogatory statement like a blood drenched serial killer costume with "mental patient" written on it.

Perhaps a better example would have been a pope outfit with "I like to fuck kiddies" on the hat and you could say that would be discriminating against Catholics, but to be honest I doubt that'd sell that well. Perhaps that'd be more one aimed at the student market?

I mean whether or not you reckon mental patients are all dangerous and should be lumped in with Daleks and Goblins and such, you've got to admit that it's a pretty dopey supermarket that blunders into areas of controvesy.
 
Jun 16, 2010
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AccursedTheory said:
James Joseph Emerald said:
krazykidd said:
Really? Then what about those guys that dress up like girls for holloween? Or they offending trangenders?
Or those girls that dress up as sexy nurses! They give nurses such a bad rep!
Or the girls that dress up as babies ( litteral babies) . They are promotting pedophilism!
I really hope you are joking around here. I would use what you just said verbatim as a parody of people who completely miss the point.

There are so many things wrong with what you just said, it's exhausting to even consider going into every single aspect of how wrong that is. From your trivialising of the stigma against mental illness by likening it to how real nurses feel about sexy nurse outfits (WTF?) to the assumption that naming a baby costume "pedophile bait" wouldn't also be horrid (another big WTF)... I just don't even.
It's not though.

This costume can be considered offensive by the mentally ill because some people can construe it as a statement that all mentally ill, institutionalized people are psychos. Why does that not apply to anything else? Sexy nurse uniforms could make a nurse feel trivialized and sexualized, like her occupation is just a nice dress up for being a whore. Dressing up as the opposite sex can be viewed as a mockery of transgenders, as Halloween is supposed to be an event where you dress up as something scary or silly.

You see how this works? It takes almost no effort to find a group of people who may be offended. Yet you have a double standard - The mental patient thing is offensive because of your personal experiences. But other peoples examples are bullshit, because you can't see why people would be offended.

For shame, sir.
No, you're also missing the point. You're assuming that people are mad because of an implicit association. If you look at the original article, and the image I put in the OP, you'll see this is extremely explicit.

Put simply:
Having a sexy baby outfit called "Baby costume" -- perhaps in poor taste (due to people with dirty minds)
Having a sexy baby outfit called "Pedo bait" -- offensive/vile (explicit association)
Having a sexy nurse outfit called "Sexy nurse" -- skirting the line, maybe (nurses implicitly objectified)
Having a sexy nurse outfit called "One of those fuckable sluts who flunked out of med-school" -- offensive/vile (nurses explicitly objectified)
Having a blood-soaked straight-jacket-clad murderer outfit called "Crazed murderer" -- nothing particularly wrong with it
Having a blood-soaked straight-jacket-clad murderer outfit called "Mental Patient" -- offensive/vile (explicit association between monstrous behaviour and mental illness)

This is one of many ways in which that argument falls down.
Another would be to compare the number of mentally ill people who commit suicide due to feelings of worthlessness and hostility, to the number of nurses who commit suicide because everyone thinks they're sexy.

Another way it falls down is that in order to say "it's all fair game", you'd also have to accept everything, or else you're a complete hypocrite. But this is not a black-and-white issue: you draw a line somewhere for yourself. And where you choose to draw that line says a lot about who you are as a person.
 
Jun 16, 2010
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Casual Shinji said:
James Joseph Emerald said:
For some reason the article changed its picture. Here is the original:



Note: bloody straight-jacket, knife, crazy mask = "mental patient".
No qualifications whatsoever.

It wouldn't be half as bad if it was called "homicidal maniac" or whatever.
Yeah, I still don't see the big deal.

This looks like the typical movie rendition of the psycho axe murderer, a la Leatherface. It's a harmless horror trope.

Now if it was a costume that included slit wrists and drool and a hospital garment or something... But this? No.
How is it a harmless trope when there are people who come out of a mental hospital and feel like this is how society views them? I mean, this stigma already exists, bubbling beneath the surface. But to see it manifested as plain as day, it makes me angry and depressed and I'm not even living under the stigma.

Imagine applying for a job, trying to compete with people in this economic climate, and then seeing how everyone views you: as the thing in that picture. It makes you feel like your life is worthless and there's no hope.

It's enormously damaging and regressive and a 'big deal' in every sense of the word.
 

DefunctTheory

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James Joseph Emerald said:
AccursedTheory said:
James Joseph Emerald said:
krazykidd said:
Really? Then what about those guys that dress up like girls for holloween? Or they offending trangenders?
Or those girls that dress up as sexy nurses! They give nurses such a bad rep!
Or the girls that dress up as babies ( litteral babies) . They are promotting pedophilism!
I really hope you are joking around here. I would use what you just said verbatim as a parody of people who completely miss the point.

There are so many things wrong with what you just said, it's exhausting to even consider going into every single aspect of how wrong that is. From your trivialising of the stigma against mental illness by likening it to how real nurses feel about sexy nurse outfits (WTF?) to the assumption that naming a baby costume "pedophile bait" wouldn't also be horrid (another big WTF)... I just don't even.
It's not though.

This costume can be considered offensive by the mentally ill because some people can construe it as a statement that all mentally ill, institutionalized people are psychos. Why does that not apply to anything else? Sexy nurse uniforms could make a nurse feel trivialized and sexualized, like her occupation is just a nice dress up for being a whore. Dressing up as the opposite sex can be viewed as a mockery of transgenders, as Halloween is supposed to be an event where you dress up as something scary or silly.

You see how this works? It takes almost no effort to find a group of people who may be offended. Yet you have a double standard - The mental patient thing is offensive because of your personal experiences. But other peoples examples are bullshit, because you can't see why people would be offended.

For shame, sir.
No, you're also missing the point. You're assuming that people are mad because of an implicit association. If you look at the original article, and the image I put in the OP, you'll see this is extremely explicit.

Put simply:
Having a sexy baby outfit called "Baby costume" -- perhaps in poor taste (due to people with dirty minds)
Having a sexy baby outfit called "Pedo bait" -- offensive/vile (explicit association)
Having a sexy nurse outfit called "Sexy nurse" -- skirting the line, maybe (nurses implicitly objectified)
Having a sexy nurse outfit called "One of those fuckable sluts who flunked out of med-school" -- offensive/vile (nurses explicitly objectified)
Having a blood-soaked straight-jacket-clad murderer outfit called "Crazed murderer" -- nothing particularly wrong with it
Having a blood-soaked straight-jacket-clad murderer outfit called "Mental Patient" -- offensive/vile (explicit association between monstrous behaviour and mental illness)

This is one of many ways in which that argument falls down.
Another would be to compare the number of mentally ill people who commit suicide due to feelings of worthlessness and hostility, to the number of nurses who commit suicide because everyone thinks they're sexy.

Another way it falls down is that in order to say "it's all fair game", you'd also have to accept everything, or else you're a complete hypocrite. But this is not a black-and-white issue: you draw a line somewhere for yourself. And where you choose to draw that line says a lot about who you are as a person.
It is all fair game, unless the intent of the costume is actually malicious.

That seems like a pretty good place to draw the line to me.

As for you argument, it's your opinion. You admitted that you have a bias due to your own experiences. So why do you get to draw a line, and and say whats offensive to any particular group?

So, here's where I stand - I view costumes as costumes and not some political statement on the behalf of the wearer, while you seem to think that this 20 pound costume was created and sold to advance a stereotype that doesn't actually exist in the minds of most people.

This is an old, old argument - As old as the PC movement - Is the offense born from the intent of the individual, or the mind of the sufferer? I say its from intent. YOu say its from the mind of the offended. Take from that what you will.
 

Thaluikhain

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James Joseph Emerald said:
How is it a harmless trope when there are people who come out of a mental hospital and feel like this is how society views them? I mean, this stigma already exists, bubbling beneath the surface. But to see it manifested as plain as day, it makes me angry and depressed and I'm not even living under the stigma.

Imagine applying for a job, trying to compete with people in this economic climate, and then seeing how everyone views you: as the thing in that picture. It makes you feel like your life is worthless and there's no hope.

It's enormously damaging and regressive and a 'big deal' in every sense of the word.
I'd also ask what was the last time mental illness got mentioned in the media that you remember.

Cause for me it was "Crazy guy shoots a bunch of people"

Before that it was "Another crazy guy shoots another bunch of people"

Before that was "We should lock crazy people up to stop shootings".

Even assuming the people were all mentally ill (and that was just an assumption people like jumping to when the shooter isn't, say, black), there's no mention of mentally ill people who are victims of violence (and the mentally ill are more likely to be victims than perpetrators), there's no mention of treatment or societal changes to help them. Hell, no mention of anything not directly related to them being mentally ill.

It's solely Them out to get Us. Maybe on a good day it's some celebrity not coping with fame very well. There's never anything positive.