Poll: Doctor Who: Female and/or Non-White Master, Yay or Nay?

Recommended Videos

Knight Captain Kerr

New member
May 27, 2011
1,283
0
0
It seems plausible that The Doctor's arch-nemesis The Master will show up again at some point in Doctor Who. If he does he probably would have regenerated since his last appearance. There has been a lot of debate in the past over having a female or non-white actor play The Doctor but I haven't really seen any discussion about having the same thing happen with The Master. So my question is this, would you be alright with The Master being female and/or non-white in Doctor Who?

Personally I'd be fine with both, of course I'd have no problem with having a white male Master either. I just hope whoever they'd get for the role would be good in it.
 

Thaluikhain

Elite Member
Legacy
Jan 16, 2010
19,538
4,128
118
Yeah, doesn't matter, just don't muck it up this time. Doesn't matter who you get to play the role, write the role to not be awful.

OTOH, if you let the villain be black before the hero can be...yeah, careful with that.
 

Keoul

New member
Apr 4, 2010
1,579
0
0
As long as there isn't any sexual tension I'll be okay with it.
Jeez, they even did it in that Sherlock Holmes reboot, arch nemesis for centuries but now that they're a girl you just gotta bang em.

Why can't they just be evil?
 

ClockworkPenguin

Senior Member
Mar 29, 2012
587
0
21
Keoul said:
As long as there isn't any sexual tension I'll be okay with it.
Jeez, they even did it in that Sherlock Holmes reboot, arch nemesis for centuries but now that they're a girl you just gotta bang em.

Why can't they just be evil?
Pretty much this. Not all relationships have to be defined by libidos.
thaluikhain said:
Yeah, doesn't matter, just don't muck it up this time. Doesn't matter who you get to play the role, write the role to not be awful.

OTOH, if you let the villain be black before the hero can be...yeah, careful with that.
I liked John Simm as the master, at least the first time. Wasn't as keen on him the second time. Oddly he seemed less dangerous when he was more psychotic.
 

Thaluikhain

Elite Member
Legacy
Jan 16, 2010
19,538
4,128
118
Keoul said:
As long as there isn't any sexual tension I'll be okay with it.
Jeez, they even did it in that Sherlock Holmes reboot, arch nemesis for centuries but now that they're a girl you just gotta bang em.

Why can't they just be evil?
Eh, TBH, there sorta was a weird vibe between the two in the original as it was. But yeah, would inevitably become overtly sexual.

ClockworkPenguin said:
I liked John Simm as the master, at least the first time. Wasn't as keen on him the second time. Oddly he seemed less dangerous when he was more psychotic.
Simm was fine, the writing was awful. Apart from Billie Piper, I can't fault really anyone in NuWho on their acting.

And then he came back as an X-Men villain.
 

LaoJim

New member
Aug 24, 2013
555
0
0
Have to say I'm not keen on them bringing the Master back at all. Just one of those evil for the sake of being evil characters and tends to just ham everything up. (This goes for the classic episodes featuring him as well).

That said of all the characters in popular culture, Dr Who is the one you can muck about with the most. Absolutely no issues with him regenerating into any race or gender.
 

Colour Scientist

Troll the Respawn, Jeremy!
Jul 15, 2009
4,722
0
0
LaoJim said:
Just one of those evil for the sake of being evil characters and tends to just ham everything up.
How did you come to the conclusion that he's evil for the sake of being evil, out of curiosity?

OP: Yes, please.

Doctor Who basically allows for free rein in terms of casting, at least as far as time lords are concerned, and I think they should exploit that fact a bit more in terms of casting choices.

I'm excited for Peter Capaldi but they could have at least auditioned a few more people, some new up and coming actor may have seized the role. By up and coming I don't necessarily mean young, just a new face in the Whoniverse.

I think Moffat basically said or implied that he didn't want a female Doctor anytime soon but Moffat also thought that the fish fingers and custard and bow tie jokes were hilarious for over three years. Maybe Stephen Moffat should regenerate as a better executive producer or at least get a writing companion to help him sort his shit out.
 

AliasBot

New member
Jun 14, 2013
118
0
0
Wouldn't have a problem with either - the variable rules of regeneration mean they can just get the best actor for the role if they want to take that route. More likely, though, if they wanted a female Master, they'd just bring back the Rani and write her more...Masterly, I guess. Why take the risk when there's already an easy alternative? So I don't think a female Master is likely, but I would be fine with it if it was...providing the writing was good.
 

Lieju

New member
Jan 4, 2009
3,044
0
0
I don't have an issue with either.

AliasBot said:
Wouldn't have a problem with either - the variable rules of regeneration mean they can just get the best actor for the role if they want to take that route. More likely, though, if they wanted a female Master, they'd just bring back the Rani and write her more...Masterly, I guess. Why take the risk when there's already an easy alternative? So I don't think a female Master is likely, but I would be fine with it if it was...providing the writing was good.
Or you could write something along the lines of the Master possessing someone. Or being reborn in a completely new body or something.
Then you could also explain why they're different or have different story-possibilities.
 

Sigmund Av Volsung

Hella noided
Dec 11, 2009
2,999
0
0
Don't really care; it's the acting chops that make or break a character.

Although whoever does get cast as the Master will be in the unfavourable position of being compared to John Simm's brilliant performance:


And this because I love the demented bastard:

 
Dec 10, 2012
867
0
0
I won't spoiler anything here, since anyone in this thread should be familiar with Doctor Who.

The only way the Master can come back is if the Doctor returns Gallifrey to our universe. That's where he is, if he even still lives, which he shouldn't as his body was decaying due to being unnaturally revived from permadeath. He shouldn't even be able to regenerate at this point. Besides, I know that Twelve's arc is going to be about returning the Timelords and redeeming himself, but Ten made it very clear that the universe is better off without them at this point. So, if the Doctor does bring Gallifrey back, he will be reigniting a universe-spanning war as well as returning a deathless supervillian bent on total domination of reality.

Now I know that you can do almost anything you want in Who just by its very nature. But I'm starting to get just a bit miffed at all the ridiculous ass-pulls that the recent series has come up with; Eleven especially had really no rules or consistency at all. There is always another impossible thing happening, but I would prefer if there were some things that even the Doctor couldn't fix. Dancing around the consequences of every action makes things boring and exasperating.

In conclusion, you already killed the Master beyond regeneration twice. Don't bring him back again.
 

Colour Scientist

Troll the Respawn, Jeremy!
Jul 15, 2009
4,722
0
0
TheVampwizimp said:
Besides, I know that Twelve's arc is going to be about returning the Timelords and redeeming himself, but Ten made it very clear that the universe is better off without them at this point.
Did they actually hint at that and I missed it or are you just speculating?
 

Zontar

Mad Max 2019
Feb 18, 2013
4,931
0
0
In principle I'm ok with the idea, in the context of the show however it just wouldn't work. Think about this for a second, as much as we all love the stories in the future on some far off world, what about the ones on Earth in the distant past? The writers would have a hell of a time making a fun, light-hearted story in a past setting without it being weighed down by the fact that society's values where very different back then. I like the light-hearted stories set in the past that could care less about giving some important message, and I wouldn't enjoy a series without that nearly as much as one with them, and given which show we're talking about here there would probably be a heavy handed message and a darker tone to every adventure they had in the past.

I guess my position is best described as supportive in message but unwilling to bear the cost. Kind of like the exact reason community got cancelled, only without the "me being a fan of community" part.
 

BrotherRool

New member
Oct 31, 2008
3,834
0
0
I'm completely okay with this, but actually less okay than a female or non-white Doctor. I'm kind of fed up with the 'well we can't go out on a limb for the main character so lets just shove it all one the side character'. And if they do that to the Master maybe there'd be less motivation to change the Doctor.

Zontar said:
In principle I'm ok with the idea, in the context of the show however it just wouldn't work. Think about this for a second, as much as we all love the stories in the future on some far off world, what about the ones on Earth in the distant past? The writers would have a hell of a time making a fun, light-hearted story in a past setting without it being weighed down by the fact that society's values where very different back then. I like the light-hearted stories set in the past that could care less about giving some important message, and I wouldn't enjoy a series without that nearly as much as one with them, and given which show we're talking about here there would probably be a heavy handed message and a darker tone to every adventure they had in the past.

I guess my position is best described as supportive in message but unwilling to bear the cost. Kind of like the exact reason community got cancelled, only without the "me being a fan of community" part.
I used to be worried about this too and I figured it was a very good reason not to do it. But after watching some more Doctor Who I realised it's totally not a problem. The show has had plenty of black people and women go back to times when that should have caused a problem, as the assistants or one-offs and the show just ignores the problems. It works because Doctor Who isn't some gritty hardcore historical thriller, the whole tone of the show is 'anything is possible', so when this arises in episodes they're completely happy with just ignoring all that stuff and getting to the fun parts. If you think about it, if every week we're going to imagine a world where Cybermen are wondering around Rome causing volcanoes to erupt or whatever, imagining a world where a 1400's King would listen to a women isn't a big stretch.

If you watch the episodes where it happens, it basically ends up being the same sort of thing as the assistant and Doctor wearing anachronistic clothing or talking about future events. It's just handwaved (sometimes lampshaded) and if you think about it, you can assume the Tardis is making them look white or male or whatever or it's a psychic paper kind of effect.

In fact it would allow them a wider variety of episodes, because they can choose to ignore it whenever they want a fun episode, but when they want to do a serious episode they can choose to do it with the Doctor or the Master or whatever directly instead of a through a proxy like they normally do.
 

Zontar

Mad Max 2019
Feb 18, 2013
4,931
0
0
BrotherRool said:
I guess I see you're point, but I'm also a little skeptical, though it's probably due to the fact that I came in with the return of the series which had its whole run be pretty dark and drama filled compared to the science fiction oriented doctor which came after and the fantasy oriented one after that. I guess it would be completely dependent on the tone of the doctor for that series.
 

BrotherRool

New member
Oct 31, 2008
3,834
0
0
Zontar said:
BrotherRool said:
I guess I see you're point, but I'm also a little skeptical, though it's probably due to the fact that I came in with the return of the series which had its whole run be pretty dark and drama filled compared to the science fiction oriented doctor which came after and the fantasy oriented one after that. I guess it would be completely dependent on the tone of the doctor for that series.
I think that's exactly it, a female/non-white Doctor brings as much baggage as the writers and actor choose to bring. The problem is if half the writers think 'okay she's a lady, we've got to do everything differently now.' Moffat would almost certainly be a horrible choice to showrun something like this. But if we end up with soemone who thinks, 'okay I'm going to carry on writing Who episodes and find and replace all my "he's" with "she's", then it's not a problem.

EDIT: By the way, if you want some evidence of how it would work, look at Martha Jones' season. Black and a women, but travelling happily and freely in 1930's America, Elizabethan Britain, Victorian Britain, Renaissance France... There's actually a minor subplot in The Shakespeare Code where Martha keeps saying 'shouldn't I be worried about all this race stuff?' and the Doctor basically keeps replying 'Nah', and then it works out as he predicts.
 

CommanderL

New member
May 12, 2011
835
0
0
let the master stay dead He had a good arc and ended his story line by saving the doctors life bringing him back would cheapen it and he would most likely be evil again ruining that arc
with gallifrey still out there make a new evil timelord