Poll: What's your attitude towards exploits?

[irishda]

Clarification! Read First!I didn't realize the site was cutting off part of the poll options. So to clarify, the first option is "What the fuck is this? Game's broken for me now." and the second option is "Sweet. That'll make things easier for me."
I was inspired by the recent D3 article that explains the immortal wizard exploit to find out the community's overall opinion on exploits in general. When you find one in your game or online, do you stop playing, use it, or keep playing but don't use it?

There was one comment on the article that caught my attention, essentially

it's Blizzard's fault the exploit is in there, so they shouldn't punish anyone for using it

There's kind of an unwritten rule between games and gamers, and that is to play fair. Not just in multi-player but also in single player as well, since finding some sort of back door that gets you the end result is kind of a complete disregard for the experience and the work put into it. So even if you find an exploit, using it kind of breaks the unspoken agreement you had with the game.

Personally, I've found proponents of the "it's there, why not use it crowd" to be one of two groups. Either they're constantly looking for the "best" way to do something, and that best way just happens to be an exploit that makes you invincible or puts you in an advantageous spot (the hardcore "optimal build" crowd). Or they're too lazy to do the work the game was asking for, and this is the easiest way (the casual "I want everything but I don't wanna earn it" crowd). Either way it boils down to looking for the "easiest" way to play something.

To me that kind of violates the spirit of the game. The point was never about doing something "the best way" or about beating it/unlocking everything. The point of the game was for you to PLAY it, and have fun doing it. If the only way for you to have fun was to find the easiest way to play it, then that makes it seem less like a game and more like an obstacle you had to hurdle no matter what.

 

[ChildishLegacy]

In D3's case you had to exploit to get ahead because the end game was broken (and still probably is - haven't played it in a month or so), either that or just grind for hours on end so you could buy one piece of gear on the AH, rinse and repeat until you could finally do 1/20th of Act II inferno. Oh, and then they just changed all of the stats and abilities anyway so that gear you worked for was fucking useless compared to other gear. Sorry - the thought of that game just pisses me off now.

Also to call that D3 build an exploit is bullshit, it was a perfectly accessible build for the Wizard that you could make by selecting skills. The only thing that exploits is the skill set that every Wizard was given, I don't understand how 5 years of class design can happen and they allow that into the release version of the game and have the nerve to call it some sort of bug.

Also, exploits in old games could often give them "character", they're kind of like unintended easter eggs. Like Missingno on the old pokemon games, it was like some sort of magical anomaly that you could discover or hear about that was kind of weird/interesting to "summon" and made your game do strange things. That was actually really fun to mess around with, and in a single player game, I'd say you can do what the hell you want with your game.

 

[Dr Pussymagnet]

Normally, I'd say yes for single player and no for multiplayer, but it really does just depend on the game. Blizzard's the fastest I've seen when it comes to fixing exploits in the multiplayer in their games, and for good reason. Exploits and bugs can't last long in competitive games.

But there are other games where I'm fine with it. Hell, in Gears 1 I had more fun discovering and using glitches like crabwalking and skydiving than I did just playing the regular game.

 

[oplinger]

I don't care for exploits, and I don't care to use them. I play games to be challenged. Unless the challenge ahead of me is ABSOLUTELY IMPOSSIBLE for my current skill level, and I'm angry at it. I won't use any exploits. Sometimes exploits are the only way... I've run into that a few times too.

I don't really like people who look for exploits, and utilize every exploit in the game to get ahead and feel superior. Which is sort of how they tend to be. My friend is much like this, he will exploit the hell out of any glitches he can find in a game, he'll look them all up before he plays, learn the best way to do things without exploits, then play the game in the easiest way he possibly can, and claim he's a god at it.

...So I like to surprise him, and play games with him he's never played. It's damned hilarious.

 

[Daystar Clarion]

I'm fine with taking advantage of exploits as long as you keep them to the single player game.

If you start using them in multiplayer, you are a knave and a cur.

 

[Danceofmasks]

Exploits are not working as unintended, gives retards the ability to do things I, as someone who is moderately competent, can - which cheapens my ability.
What's this particular one? You have to animation cancel a specific type of teleport with archon (or something)? It's NOT something you do by accident, and therefore should be permaban worthy.

Anyone who does anything to demean my ability is barely worth my time spitting on.
But I'll do it, every time, because it is my duty as a service to the highly skilled minority.

Having said that, however, Diablo 3 is a horrible mess and isn't worth my time (yes, I've done inferno).
I mean any game that has items that are worth real money and subject to being rebalanced?
Are you serious?
If someone spends $200 on an item that is intended for a lifesteal combo or something, and it doesn't work a day later, the item is not fit for purpose and the sale probably unethical to the point of potential legal action in Europe.

So, on the grand scale of things, exploits are not a big problem here.
The entire fucking game is.

 

[skywolfblue]

It is a little bit tricky to slice it all one way or the other.

Both the gamers, and the developer share responsibility.

In this particular case I'd probably go with the fact that it's so easily accessible that they probably shouldn't ban anyone for using the skill set that they were given.

A glitch has to be at least a little out of the way in order to be bannable. (Saronite Bombs, or Flower Power from WoW are I think good examples of exploits to ban players using.)

 

[piinyouri]

It really depends on the situation and circumstances.

Like for instance, when I was playing Mega Man X8 your currency with which you purchase upgrades are these chips, which drop from enemies. There was something for sale at one point that was exceedingly higher than anything else I had seen to that point. I think it was in the neighborhood of 100,000 chips or something.

Getting chips is a long, grindy, menial, boring task (read going through levels over, and over, and over, and over again) that I really just wasn't interested in.

In another scenario where getting that many chips would have been fun, I would have totally done it. But because of the nature of the situation, I used a glitch/cheat/exploit that gives you lots of chips very fast.

 

[AndrewF022]

Single-Player = fine

Multi-Player = don't do it

Developers shouldn't impose bans for using multi-player exploits though, unless patching it is not an option, and then only after adequate warning that bans will be used on offenders.

The D3 one is tricky though, because you could be playing that as a solely single-player experience. However since the real money auction house exists, even soloists could profit off of it unfairly, although Blizzard would as well I suppose...

 

[dimensional]

Im also one of those who believes any exploits you use in single player is ok its your game do what the hell you like.

For multiplayer it depends on the exploit for example if someone found a way to give themselves a huge advantage in a game for very little effort thats not so good and even if the other person could copy the exploit to even the field it still isnt great and the game should be patched as people will not stop doing it (unless youre with friends and want a decent game) just because it breaks the game.

However if say an infinite combo was found in a fighting game (yeah shocking I know) that resulted in an instant touch of death when you got hit but the combo was filled with loads of 1 frame links and was ridiculously tricky to pull off I would have no problem with people using that even though it wasnt meant to be in the game if they can pull it off consistently to use it to their advantage I would just be in awe of their skill.

 

[Manji187]

I was inspired by the recent D3 article that explains the immortal wizard exploit to find out the community's overall opinion on exploits in general. When you find one in your game or online, do you stop playing, use it, or keep playing but don't use it?

There was one comment on the article that caught my attention, essentially

it's Blizzard's fault the exploit is in there, so they shouldn't punish anyone for using it

There's kind of an unwritten rule between games and gamers, and that is to play fair. Not just in multi-player but also in single player as well, since finding some sort of back door that gets you the end result is kind of a complete disregard for the experience and the work put into it. So even if you find an exploit, using it kind of breaks the unspoken agreement you had with the game.

Personally, I've found proponents of the "it's there, why not use it crowd" to be one of two groups. Either they're constantly looking for the "best" way to do something, and that best way just happens to be an exploit that makes you invincible or puts you in an advantageous spot (the hardcore "optimal build" crowd). Or they're too lazy to do the work the game was asking for, and this is the easiest way (the casual "I want everything but I don't wanna earn it" crowd). Either way it boils down to looking for the "easiest" way to play something.

To me that kind of violates the spirit of the game. The point was never about doing something "the best way" or about beating it/unlocking everything. The point of the game was for you to PLAY it, and have fun doing it. If the only way for you to have fun was to find the easiest way to play it, then that makes it seem less like a game and more like an obstacle you had to hurdle no matter what.

How does one define "exploit"?

For instance, in Morrowind one can become god-like simply by using the game's Alchemy mechanic. This is not a glitch or bug, it is just the mechanic functioning properly. It definitely can make the game boring though. Haven't played Skyrim, but I've read that crafting/ enchanting/ alchemy can get pretty insane. If "playing fair" means using those means which are available as part of the game functioning properly, then Alchemy is fair. But is it "fair" when it is nonetheless potentially game breaking? And what is the developer's role in this?

Also, to an extent everybody tries to play effectively. For instance, in Deus Ex: HR some augmentations are objectively either completely useless (node info aug) or just not that good (anti flash aug, because hardly anybody throws flash grenades and looking away for a second suffices). If you invest in them as opposed to stuff that WORKS (definitely hacking) you will have a harder time.

What I'm saying is, even when not cheating or using exploits (however defined), everybody is automatically looking for the best way to play a game. That is, trying to figure out what actually works. Sometimes certain weapons or moves or mechanics just happen to work so well that they can break the game (making it substantially easier, to the point of too easy). But that means the developer did not balance the game properly.

Oh and some people actually have fun exploiting the hell out of/ breaking their games. That's the way they are and it's their choice.

 

[FalloutJack]

If the Deathclaw flies off into the stratosphere like a bird, I DON'T CARE.

If parking my car over that nigh-unkillable cat-thing in Saint's Row 3 makes it dead, I DON'T CARE.

If it produces an odd or amusing effect...I care, but only because it's funny.

 

[joshuaayt]

Single player, it really depends- Am I *enjoying* the game's challenge, or just trying to win? For example, if I were deep within a robo-scorpion lair, and found a first-aid box with unlimited respawning stimpaks, I'd probably just take one or two and move on.

If, however, I were stuck having to escort some useless kid through a lengthy dungeon, and I found a way to use solid walls as shortcuts? You bet I'd phase my ass through those walls.

Online, though, I generally play as fairly as possible, if only because I get pissed when other people cheat.

Games that force you to be online during single player are a special case- meaning I'll exploit the fuck out of them. Who knows? Might just discourage further online SP nonsense.

 

[jake557]

Multiplayer - Never.

Singleplayer - Depends. Does the exploit add or subtract from my enjoyment of the game? Some exploits are fun to use, or can to get me past a section I'm not enjoying. Sometimes it's fun just to see how far you can push a system in ways the developers didn't intend.

 

[Dandark]

I usually enjoy bugs in single player games. Me and my friends spent plenty of time breaking the campaign of Halo 3, it was a lot of fun however that is just campaign.
I would consider it bad to use exploits on multiplayer games, if you find a glitch that makes you invincible in a FPS or an exploit that gives you infinite resources in an RTS then that needs to be patched and anyone using it should feel bad as your messing up someone elses game.

 

[Andy Shandy]

Fine in single player, and perhaps local multiplayer, but not on online multiplayer.

 

[Karoshi]

I hate exploiters and hackers in multiplayer games with a burning passion. WoW made me detest such people.

Exploits in singleplayer though - dont give a damn. Never use them myself.

 

[Kordie]

I was inspired by the recent D3 article that explains the immortal wizard exploit to find out the community's overall opinion on exploits in general. When you find one in your game or online, do you stop playing, use it, or keep playing but don't use it?

Honestly, watch this clip...

Here are some core concepts about people when it comes to exploiting a system;
- Most people will do it a little bit (in gaming case this could be in game exploits but not full out hacking)
- If people are seen doing it un punished it can result in more people doing it (plenty of videos show how to do the exploit in question and still no word from blizzard about it)
- If their cheating can result in something that can be exchanged for cash it will increase cheating (exploiting can get you items faster that can be sold on the RMAH for profit)

Given that, I wouldn't be suprised to see greater cases of people doing what they can to gain an edge. Whether they draw the line at in game exploits or not is going to vary, but it is much easier to justify in game exploits as opposed to other hacking/cheating methods.

Personally, if I had D3, I would try this out just for the fun of it. If I am playing alone it does not hurt anyone and can be fun. The bigger moral question would come from what to do with the loot, and honestly, I don't see myself using the RMAH in any regard. So unless I found an uber unique item that could go for big bucks, I would likely vender stuff.