Save Scumming in Divinity: Original Sin

[alxtronic]

I've been playing lots of Divinity: Original Sin lately, and I've been enjoying it quite a bit. The combat is generally very strategic, the story is getting more and more interesting, and there's a lot of loot (a LOT of loot). But I couldn't shake the feeling that the combat was so random at times that strategy didn't matter as much as persistent reloading.

The boss at the end of Act 1, for example, casts an AOE fear at the beginning of the fight. If your party gets a bad roll, everyone will be incapacitated for up to 2 turns, free to get pulverized by the powerful adds. The boss is immune to silence, so this can't be prevented, and fear can't be dispelled. If you don't have the fear immune trait, all you can do is engage over and over until your party gets a good roll, then save and treat that as the true beginning of the fight.

There's another fight in act 1 against a mini-boss named Evelyn who's easily the hardest fight I've had so far. I quickly figured out that there's one add, a skeleton archer who summons a melee pal, who do a truckload of damage. In addition, one will resummon the other if one dies. If I couldn't incapacitate the add and keep him CC'ed for as long as possible, I would stand no chance of survival.

In general, loss of character control is extremely important to all the fights that aren't extremely easy, and if you get CC'ed, or if you fail to CC a strong enemy (based purely on a roll), you may as well reload and start over. While I do enjoy the combat in the game, having a roll fail at a crucial point makes me want to tear my hair out. And I can't help but feel that the constant reloading artificially pads the length of the game.

What do you guys think of games that encourage this type of save scumming? Should rolls be predetermined like in XCOM: EU, to prevent this, or is the problem that CC effects are just too powerful and widespread?

 

[Smooth Operator]

Oh the skelly boss, you did notice that AOE is centred on the boss so only those in proximity will be affected?
There are also potions and scrolls that will give you fear immunity, and scrolls that can dispel it. And if you still intend to ignore those options you can use terrain to your advantage, or retreat when things are going badly, hell there is even a "Run away" button that will instantly return you to the nearest portal from where you can regroup and go at it again.

So yes the game has a full range of save systems but the only one who encourages you for those to be the first resort is you. I suggest you go into key binding and un-bind quicksave/load if that trigger finger is just too itchy.

And a minor tip for unpredictable enemies: engage them with summons, summons are as tough as party members but will not be missed when incapacitated. Also consider all your tools or even getting new ones, the game wasn't made for people to stumble through it blindly.

 

[Tanis]

I think the biggest problem with the game is the ability to get so damned outclassed so fast.

If you don't level yourselves properly, then some bosses are IMPOSSIBLE to beat.
-Short of an act by The Nine.

I had to use a save editor to 're-roll' my characters because I did a straight up archer/thief and knight/healer combo.
This...this did not work out well.

 

[Tragedy's Rebellion]

Most of the fights in Cyseal are balanced, even if the last one is a bit hard (but that's good). I liked Cyseal a lot and its bosses were imaginative. After that the combat gets really boring because you are so overpowered and the enemies so pathetically weak that the combat just wastes time. Madora practically one shots bosses with Flurry if she gets a lucky roll. So you don't have to worry about save scumming after that ;p

 

[gigastar]

I think savescumming is justified when a boss youre fighting for the first time drops a goddamn meteor strike that kills half your party without a chance to act.

...yes i was underlevelled. But trying to figure out what youre supposed to do at your given level in D:OS is like stumbling around in a dark room full of bear traps.

 

[bjj hero]

If save scumming is your thing then go for it, I will not do it though. X-com had plenty of random bs, as did fire emblem but I pushed on seeing it as part of "my" story.

 

[DoPo]

...yes i was underlevelled. But trying to figure out what youre supposed to do at your given level in D:OS is like stumbling around in a dark room full of bear traps.

Umm...go to areas that have your level. And you can actually look at the boss and see what level he is.

I think the biggest problem with the game is the ability to get so damned outclassed so fast.

Really? I found the opposite to be true - you very fast start outclassing your enemies.

If you don't level yourselves properly, then some bosses are IMPOSSIBLE to beat.
-Short of an act by The Nine.

And weirdly, that's what the level system is for. It's a sort of "You must be this tall to fight me". It's what it's usually for. In particular, in D:OS you are expected to tackle enemies +/- 1 or 2 levels from you. And incidentally, if you follow the path that has your level enemies, you would...actually be OK. You can then go a different path with your level enemies. Repeat until you reach a boss...which would be your level.

The boss at the end of Act 1, for example, casts an AOE fear at the beginning of the fight. If your party gets a bad roll, everyone will be incapacitated for up to 2 turns, free to get pulverized by the powerful adds. The boss is immune to silence, so this can't be prevented, and fear can't be dispelled. If you don't have the fear immune trait, all you can do is engage over and over until your party gets a good roll, then save and treat that as the true beginning of the fight.

The AOE is around the boss - you can keep your party away. You can also get the talent/trait that gives you immunity to fear (if you really feel like going for the talent). There is some equipment with Fear immunity, too. Willpower helps for saving against Fear and luckily, the Obedient/Independant trait both give you +1 Willpower. You would have one or the other on your main characters, of course, and Obedient only triggers if you have Leadership but...guess what - Leadership is really, really useful. 1 point in it, gives all your characters +1 Willpower. It's also really easy to find an equipment piece with a +1 Leadership.

So, in reality, you would have at least a +2 on your main characters and even maybe some characters who are outright immune. I don't see how that encourages save scumming.

There's another fight in act 1 against a mini-boss named Evelyn who's easily the hardest fight I've had so far. I quickly figured out that there's one add, a skeleton archer who summons a melee pal, who do a truckload of damage. In addition, one will resummon the other if one dies. If I couldn't incapacitate the add and keep him CC'ed for as long as possible, I would stand no chance of survival.

I pulverized everybody on the first go. I did reload the fight against the boss because of a mistake I made (I actually engaged before I wanted to) but Evelyn was...well, not easy but certainly not a problem. I had my party on the top of the stairs, aside from my rogue who snuck up and engaged her with a backstab. Which made her immediately summon everything but whatever - I teleported Evelyn next to Madora and proceeded to beat and nuke her to death, while the rest of the baddies had to waste their turn running up the stairs. At that point, Madora tanked them, my mages CC'd and nuked them, and my rogue backstabbed the archer to death (or whatever happens when his HP drops to 0).

In general, loss of character control is extremely important to all the fights that aren't extremely easy, and if you get CC'ed, or if you fail to CC a strong enemy (based purely on a roll), you may as well reload and start over. While I do enjoy the combat in the game, having a roll fail at a crucial point makes me want to tear my hair out. And I can't help but feel that the constant reloading artificially pads the length of the game.

My characters are level 11. Well, level 12, actually, but they were level 11 at the time - I went west of Silverglen - the area where all of your characters are slowed. Also, the area that is full of level 14 stuff. Normally, a level or two above is what you can safely tackle, and that's assuming you aren't permanently debuffed. I just started the fight with some spiders and spider cultists and halfway through it, I started wondering why most of my CC wasn't affecting them - that's when I noticed they were 3 levels above. There wasn't anything that difficult in the fight - in fact, all of my characters had Glass Cannon at the time, too, so they had less HP than they should have. Some time later, I tackled and obliterated the Spider queen. No prep, either - I assumed she'd talk to me (she was shown as a yellow dot) but instead, she immediately attacked. And I decided "What the hell, let's try it" and killed her. Just like that. Yes, my characters were still level 11 and they were still perma slowed.

I don't think you particularly need to save scum - with just the application of some strategy the fights are not that much of a problem. If you are having issues, I'd suggest re-examining your combat tactics.