Terrible Plot lines adaptions did better

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immortalfrieza

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Since there isn't a general media section to this forum I decided to put this here. What are some bad plots that were done much better when adapted into another media? Why was the original bad and the adaption better?

I'd say an excellent example would be the Superior Spider-Man comic storyline. In the original comic book storyline, Doctor Octopus, one of Spider-Man's Rogue's galaxy and a particularly notable one at that was having their body badly failing after years of fighting superheroes. So he steals Spider-Man's body, somehow performs a turn to the good side (kinda) and goes parading around in it for several issues known as the Superior Spider-Man comic books.

There's a lot of issues with this storyline. For one, Doctor Octopus has done a number of heinous things over the course of his supervillain career, including trying to basically kill every person on earth at one point. His sudden turn to good even if he was going antihero and even under the influence of Peter's memories didn't feel believable for a moment due to this. For another, it required an avalanche of stupidity on the part of every other character in the story not to instantly realize that Peter had been brainwashed or replaced. In a medium where that kind of thing happens to a superhero somewhere like 3 times a week. This was particularly bad with the people who should know Peter intimately like his ex-wife and aunt, while someone who barely knows Peter at all (a painfully contrived Mary Sue love interest at that) does figure it out and does nothing. Another issue is it tries to justify Doc Ock staying Spider-Man through both some nonheroic actions like murdering supervillains (which I agree with doing but that's neither here nor there) while making Peter himself do the things he would never do (he's still in his body during most of this, it's weird) like risking the life of a little girl to conceal himself in order to make Doc Ock look better. Finally, though there's more, the storyline and the people writing it act like it's a permanent change.

Then there's the adaption of this storyline in the 2017 Spider-Man animated series. This series also did this storyline, but IMO did it much MUCH better. To start with, Doc Ock was an arrogant dick but he spent quite a while on the show not a supervillain and perhaps more importantly he didn't have a long history of atrocities and attempted atrocities, which made Ock becoming a hero much more believable, and SPOILER Ock eventually dies a hero here too. Everybody not figuring out what's going on was also much more believable because the animated series had next to no similar body swap incidents and people didn't put up with Peter-Ock's behavior for long either.

Probably most significant, the writers made it clear from the start that Peter was going to get his body back and took steps to facilitate that from the beginning of the storyline. Peter spent his time in a virtual world and spent the whole storyline trying to get out and get his body back. In comics there are very few permanent or even long term changes and everyone even vaguely familiar with comic books knows this. In both versions of this storyline Peter loses his body and eventually gets it back, but in this version they don't insult everyone's intelligence by acting like Peter wasn't going to come back so they don't write like Peter isn't going to come back.

Then of course there's just plain better written dialog and story in general, but that's the gist of it.
 

Xprimentyl

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I mentioned this in another thread (can't remember which,) but The Lord Of The Rings cinematic trilogy is far superior to the books. I watched the films first, then read the books, and man, were they a slog. I don't know who his editor was (or if he even had one,) but the books' runtime is at least 500 pages too long with a lot of unnecessary detail padding the tale in between the points of actual interest.
 

immortalfrieza

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I mentioned this in another thread (can't remember which,) but The Lord Of The Rings cinematic trilogy is far superior to the books. I watched the films first, then read the books, and man, were they a slog. I don't know who his editor was (or if he even had one,) but the books' runtime is at least 500 pages too long with a lot of unnecessary detail padding the tale in between the points of actual interest.
The vast majority of any given book is simply spending time describing things that in a visual medium the viewer can simply see and thus don't need description. Really the only thing that books potentially do better is getting into the minds of the characters in a way a movie or TV show or game can't without lots of narration. I find a happy medium between the two with comic books and graphic novels which can do both.

But yes, the Lord of the Rings trilogy is generally better than the books themselves. I'd say the same thing about the Hobbit trilogy if it weren't for the fact that the third movie had pacing issues because they were trying to stretch 2 movies worth of material into 3, even counting how they stuck some Silmarillion stuff in there to fill time between the 3 movies.

Still, I think with a few changes the third movie could've been good enough to close out the trilogy with. I think one of the biggest things is the final battle against Smaug should've taken place in the second movie rather than the beginning of the third, or taken the meeting and fighting against Smaug that occurred at the end of the second movie and moved it to the start of the third. It felt really out of place and disjointed at the start of the third because the buildup we had occurred in a movie most people had watched a half a year ago.
 
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Xprimentyl

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The vast majority of any given book is simply spending time describing things that in a visual medium the viewer can simply see and thus don't need description. Really the only thing that books potentially do better is getting into the minds of the characters in a way a movie or TV show or game can't without lots of narration. I find a happy medium between the two with comic books and graphic novels which can do both.

But yes, the Lord of the Rings trilogy is generally better than the books themselves. I'd say the same thing about the Hobbit trilogy if it weren't for the fact that the third movie had pacing issues because they were trying to stretch 2 movies worth of material into 3, even counting how they stuck some Silmarillion stuff in there to fill time between the 3 movies.

Still, I think with a few changes the third movie could've been good enough to close out the trilogy with. I think one of the biggest things is the final battle against Smaug should've taken place in the second movie rather than the beginning of the third, or taken the meeting and fighting against Smaug that occurred at the end of the second movie and moved it to the start of the third. It felt really out of place and disjointed at the start of the third because the buildup we had occurred in a movie most people had watched a half a year ago.
That's the point though; not a lot of it was used for character development. Tolkien used a lot of mindless cardinal directions detailing Frodo and Sam's journey to Mordor, sometimes paragraphs at a time. I didn't need to know they were headed east, stopped for lunch, then headed north, then crossed a stream, etc. The books were clearly a passion project that would come to be adapted into something more readily digestible in the films.

Now, The Hobbit trilogy, imho, went in the exact opposite direction, taking a singular, well-written book and protracting it into a cinematic trilogy. I enjoyed the book much more than the films if only because the book was concise whereas the movies stretched the effort out over 3 years.
 

Casual Shinji

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I'd say the Raimi movies for getting rid of the webshooters. I'm less adverse to them now than I used to be, but I still don't see the point to them. Yes, I know they're supposed to show how Peter is a genius, but then why didn't he invent other crime fighting gadgets - why just the webshooters? Also, you have a superhero called Spider-Man, yet one of the most defining characteristic of a spider (maybe even the most defining characteristic) - spinning webs - is the one superpower he doesn't have.

Even now when I see anything Spider-Man the webshooters might as well not even be there. I'm assuming the only reason Spider-Man was originally given webshooters is so Peter wouldn't come across (to the reader) as freakish or gross for being able to produce webs from his wrists.
 

Kyrian007

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I'd say the Raimi movies for getting rid of the webshooters. I'm less adverse to them now than I used to be, but I still don't see the point to them. Yes, I know they're supposed to show how Peter is a genius, but then why didn't he invent other crime fighting gadgets - why just the webshooters? Also, you have a superhero called Spider-Man, yet one of the most defining characteristic of a spider (maybe even the most defining characteristic) - spinning webs - is the one superpower he doesn't have.

Even now when I see anything Spider-Man the webshooters might as well not even be there. I'm assuming the only reason Spider-Man was originally given webshooters is so Peter wouldn't come across (to the reader) as freakish or gross for being able to produce webs from his wrists.
Well, and running out of web fluid was a useful plot device. Any time you needed him to fall back instead of press on, any time you needed him to get set back by a villain that by all rights he would easily wipe the floor with... oops, out of web fluid.

And I have to say... Watchmen. Doing the same twist but without "Aliens..." it's just better for the story.
 
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Vampire Hunter D Bloodlust is better than novel#3 it was adapting from and all of the other novels that came afterward.

Tenchi Universe ended up being better than the original manga continuity & Tenchi OVA after OVA 1 & 2. Universe told a complete story that finished by 1998, while the OVA continuity is still ongoing and dragging with nothing to show for it. You read that right. No dubbing company has bothered to pick up the series at OVA 4 and beyond. OVA 4 had an official sub release on digital only, but nothing afterward.

Universe also lacks the weird incest cropped up in the original continuity.

The Crow is better than comic original, but the source material is not bad, just more depressing in tone.
 
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Casual Shinji

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Well, and running out of web fluid was a useful plot device. Any time you needed him to fall back instead of press on, any time you needed him to get set back by a villain that by all rights he would easily wipe the floor with... oops, out of web fluid.
Yeah, but even this only ever really was a thing in the 90's animated series, where him running out of web fluid was akin to no longer being able to fight since Spidey wasn't allowed to punch anyone.

And I have to say... Watchmen. Doing the same twist but without "Aliens..." it's just better for the story.
Maybe... if they didn't tie it to Dr. Manhattan, who is at once a very familiar person for humanity (nulifying the shock of a completely foreign enemy) and a symbol of America's dominance, making it quite easy to lay the blame on them.
 

Kyrian007

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Yeah, but even this only ever really was a thing in the 90's animated series, where him running out of web fluid was akin to no longer being able to fight since Spidey wasn't allowed to punch anyone.

Maybe... if they didn't tie it to Dr. Manhattan, who is at once a very familiar person for humanity (nulifying the shock of a completely foreign enemy) and a symbol of America's dominance, making it quite easy to lay the blame on them.
Actually, Dr. Manhattan is why I thought it worked better. Seeing their own "nuclear deterrent" turn on them would have humbled the Nixon administration (which was basically proto-fascist at that point) far more than simply a completely foreign enemy. Making it less of a ID4 "the US saves the day and now everybody celebrates Independence Day" and more of a "OMG, what have we done? Let's band together to protect one another against a mistake WE made... we're sorry." It seems to be more in line with what Ozymandias would have envisioned as a preferable enough future than one where basically the U.S. and maybe even Nixon eventually takes over the world. Maybe it's just looking at it from too political a view, but it seems more coherent.

Tenchi Universe ended being better than the original manga continuity & Tenchi OVA after OVA 1 & 2. Universe told a complete story that finished by 1998, while the OVA continuity is still ongoing and dragging with nothing to show for it. You read that right. No dubbing company has bothered to pick up series at OVA 4 and beyond. OVA 4 had an official sub release on digital only, but nothing afterward.
We've argued about Tenchi before, and I still prefer the OVA's... but otherwise I agree whole heartedly. Yes, it is very annoying that it is still dragging on and not dubbed like the others anymore.
 
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We've argued about Tenchi before, and I still prefer the OVA's... but otherwise I agree whole heartedly. Yes, it is very annoying that it is still dragging on and not dubbed like the others anymore.
I prefer both continues with Universe being my favorite and the best, but of the ovas, the original still the best. OVA 2 it's fine, you notice where the animation budget takes a hit (Universe still had lower budget animation until it's two movies), and it just becomes a slice of life story with some of the Sci-Fi/fantasy elements still attached (aside from that small arc with Dr Clay). There's nothing inherently wrong with it, and it's the characters interactions that work, which keeps most viewers and fans watching. Also, the first two ovas still have the best soundtrack out of the entire franchise.
 
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immortalfrieza

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Well, and running out of web fluid was a useful plot device. Any time you needed him to fall back instead of press on, any time you needed him to get set back by a villain that by all rights he would easily wipe the floor with... oops, out of web fluid.
Not to mention having the shooters damaged or the villain able to rip straight through his webbing anyway. Most versions of Spider-Man these days have multiple cartridges that auto rotate into place when the old one is used up with his webshooters so the issue of running out of webbing is rarely brought up.

To be fair, most of Spider-Man's rogue's gallery are far stronger than he is, webbing or not. Most of the enemies he fights that aren't street level thugs Spidey wins due to outthinking them rather than outfighting them. It's part of Spider-Man's appeal, he's the underdog in nearly all his fights but not because Spider-Man is himself weak.
 

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Seirei no moribito

The adapatation just had a lot more stuff to flesh out the characters and show their dynamics. It was a surprise for me as i read the book because usually it is the other way around.
 
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Chimpzy

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From what I heard, The Darkness is better than the comics its adapting from.
It is. What I remember from The Darkness comics was your usual 90s Image Comics fare, i.e. usually good to great art but garbage writing, more preoccupied with cool and edgy, gore and t&a than narrative stuff like characters building, world building, storylines and internal consistency. Kind of fun sometimes in its audacity, but mostly pretty dumb.
 
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I understand King complaining about Nicholson, being Nicholson, looking batshit insane from the get go. But still, sorry, Kubrick's movie is way better than the book.

Also, Leloux' Time Masters is better than Wul's The Orphan of Perdide - which I remember as a space traveller with multiple watches keeping track of time distortion being, by the end if the book, all confused by time distortion as if it was a novel idea to him.

Also, again, the ending of Darabont's The Mist. But King spontaneously admitted that.

Also any Tom Clancy adaptation, I guess.
 
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Thaluikhain

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The Mortal Engines film was one of, if not the, biggest box office flop of all time. It was way, way better than the book. If you told me to write a parody of a bad YA novel designed purely to irritate people who don't like YA, that's going to be my main source of inspiration.
 

Casual Shinji

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Also, again, the ending of Darabont's The Mist. But King spontaneously admitted that.
I honestly never cared much for it. It just felt like a textbook bad ending. As soon as he shot everyone in the car I just knew safety was gonna be just around the corner to rub it in. If it was telegraphed that help was right behind them I could've actually appreciated it as a genuine tragedy, but as is it feels trite. I actually find him seeing that lady from earlier safe with her kids in the truck a way more effective twist, since nothing indicated she was any less dead than any of the others who wandered out into the mist. Yet she made out better than everyone who remained at the supermarket.
 

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I honestly never cared much for it. It just felt like a textbook bad ending. As soon as he shot everyone in the car I just knew safety was gonna be just around the corner to rub it in. If it was telegraphed that help was right behind them I could've actually appreciated it as a genuine tragedy, but as is it feels trite. I actually find him seeing that lady from earlier safe with her kids in the truck a way more effective twist, since nothing indicated she was any less dead than any of the others who wandered out into the mist. Yet she made out better than everyone who remained at the supermarket.
I felt similarly after watching another movie yesterday, 'All Quiet on the Western Front'. Just felt like it went one step too far with the tragedy it was showing. I would have preferred it if Paul had died from getting shot trying to steal eggs rather than the whole "Yes we will soon end the war but I'm forcing you to go out and die before the and, whoops, Paul dies ten seconds before the armistice is called." The whole call back to the early part of the movie when Paul collected "dog tags" by having someone else collect his was cute but again, one step too far with the "Just one week to retirement" thing.