The Tipping Payment Salary System. Why is it still a thing?

[Parasondox]

Who here loves their job? If you say yeah you do, brilliant. I am happy for you. If you said no, I am sorry, i am on the same boat.

"Find another job then"

I am currently doing so but an application for one job role takes an hour. WHY?!?!

That isn't the talking point. I am lead to believe that staff who work in the food serving industry are paid a salary but the major of their salary comes from tips. Why? Why can't the employers pay staff a decent wage and not have waiters/waitresses earn a living through tips. Doesn't that cheat a system in the US. Yes, most of these claims come from the US. I don't hear much about it from the UK because the EU... or wait we are leaving. I hope the government come up with ways to protect workers rights once we are fully out.

Anyway does this still happen? Have you been in this position before? Why not be fair and pay staff a decent wage and what exactly is the US minimum wage or is it divided by the state?

Questions, answers and applying for work is a pain in the bowels.

 

[Saelune]

Tipping as far as I know, is a uniquely US thing.

But yes, here in the US, tipping waiters is still standard in all restaurants and diners.

 

[thebobmaster_v1legacy]

The federal minimum wage is $7.25 an hour, but the minimum wage itself varies based on where you live. In California, for example, the minimum wage is $10 an hour.

As for tipping, the way it is supposed to work is that the employer pays only as much as it takes to make minimum wage. For example, if someone earned enough in tips to reach $7 an hour, then the employer would have to pay the remaining 25 cents for each hour.

I don't really like that, because it shouldn't be up to the customer to ensure the waitstaff gets a fair pay, but because of the way the culture seems to be, I don't see it changing any time soon.

 

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

I worked at a restaurant where the house collected all the tips. And we still got below minimum wage. It was a small mom/pop Indian restaurant, but still...totally sucked.

 

[TheMysteriousGX]

Business interests in some states have grandfathered expectations for tips. For example, a restaurant owner still has to make sure that their servers make $7.25 an hour, but if the server makes enough tips to cover it, they only have to pay $4 or whatever. If the server doesn't reach the threashold, the owner has to pay the difference, and as a consequence will probably fire the server.

It's complete bullshit propped up by the same anti-labor arguments that show up every single goddamed time someone tries to help the little guy: "paying more will bankrupt businesses" "servers still make more money this way" "that just means they wont hire as many people", etc, etc, et-fucking-c.

Thank god Montana doesn't put up with that bull. I mean, we still don't pay servers enough, and our minimum wage is too low, but at least when I give someone a tip I'm not subsidizing some greedy git's payroll account.

 

[Nielas]

Wow. Just the other day I was thinking about tipping and that I have not seen a thread on this on the Escapist in quite a while.

In the end I always come to the conclusion that it is a shitty system but I am not enough of an ideological zealot to refuse to tip and thus screw over a waiter.

One thing that always perplexed me was why we are supposed to tip for pizza delivery. It's a fixed service and the driver really does not add additional value beyond just driving. The FedEx or UPS guy does not expect to be tipped and some of the stuff they deliver can be extremely heavy.

 

[Catnip1024]

I don't hear much about it from the UK because the EU...

I wouldn't put that down to the EU - it's just never been the done thing. It's a very American approach to screwing people over.

It would never work in the UK because we are tight, soulless, moneypinching bastards. I am that guy that will happily ask a restaurant to remove a "voluntary" tip that they added to the menu for you, without actually asking. I pay the price you advertise. wysiwyg.

That said, if there has been genuinely good service, they can have 10%. But that should be a bonus, not subsistence.

It's similar to the way that some places in the US put prices before tax, to screw you over when you get to the till.

 

[Elijin]

Oh, I know this one!

Because as a country the US doesn't believe in a livable minimum wage.

Man, that was easy.

 

[Bob_McMillan]

One thing that always perplexed me was why we are supposed to tip for pizza delivery. It's a fixed service and the driver really does not add additional value beyond just driving. The FedEx or UPS guy does not expect to be tipped and some of the stuff they delivercan be extremely heavy.

Well, a motorcycle is a lot less comfortable than a van. The hours are worse too, FedEx guys don't deliver things at 12 in the evening (as far as I know). And pizza is generally delivered within thirty minutes, so it takes some skill and effort to be on time.

OT: Tipping in my country is a thing, but it's not required. It really is just an expression or gratitude for good service. Other restaurants include service charge. So whether you tip or not, you don't have to worry about your waiter going hungry.

 

[Parasondox]

Oh, I know this one!

Because as a country the US doesn't believe in a livable minimum wage.

Man, that was easy.

But, why? Why do certain politicians fight against this?

 

[Elijin]

Because obviously the economy would implode and inflation would run out of control and businesses would close en masse!

He says, from a country with livable minimum wage where none of that has happened.

 

[davidmc1158_v1legacy]

Oh, I know this one!

Because as a country the US doesn't believe in a livable minimum wage.

Man, that was easy.

But, why? Why do certain politicians fight against this?

The main lobbyists that fought to have the alternative minimum wage for those that can earn tips are those from the restaurant companies. In fact, one of the biggest dipshit that has fought tooth and nail to keep things this way ran for president on the Republican ticket a while back. You might have heard of him: Herman Cain, former head of Godfather's Pizza. He even went so far as to demand a guarantee from Congress that if the federal minimum wage was ever raised, the alternative minimum wage would not. He apparently got his way.

 

[PainInTheAssInternet]

The main lobbyists that fought to have the alternative minimum wage for those that can earn tips are those from the restaurant companies. In fact, one of the biggest dipshit that has fought tooth and nail to keep things this way ran for president on the Republican ticket a while back. You might have heard of him: Herman Cain, former head of Godfather's Pizza. He even went so far as to demand a guarantee from Congress that if the federal minimum wage was ever raised, the alternative minimum wage would not. He apparently got his way.

Considering the sheer numbers of those serving food, I'd say the term "Federal minimum wage" is incorrect. Here, you're expected to tip between 15-20%.

 

[Queen Michael]

I'm Swedish. I usually tip my waiter just to be nice.

 

[ObsidianJones_v1legacy]

Oh, I know this one!

Because as a country the US doesn't believe in a livable minimum wage.

Man, that was easy.

But, why? Why do certain politicians fight against this?

Because the average politician listens to whoever is campaigning for them the most. You also know it as Funding them. We shy away from saying Bribing, because it would be Libel... or Slander, depending on the method of how you say it.

And then they twist the facts so people who actually dine out believe that Waiters are secretly very rich and that they are just greedy for asking for the same minimum wage that everyone else gets. Or, as the OP said, they would tell them just to find another job.

In short, everyone believes everyone else is playing them, so they don't feel anything when others are played.

 

[Baffle]

One thing that always perplexed me was why we are supposed to tip for pizza delivery. It's a fixed service and the driver really does not add additional value beyond just driving. The FedEx or UPS guy does not expect to be tipped and some of the stuff they deliver can be extremely heavy.

I did pizza delivery for a while many years ago. If you are a regular non-tipper, you'll get your pizza in the last few minutes of the delivery window, by which time it will be cold. I have, technically, fulfilled my side of the bargain.

 

[Neurotic Void Melody]

Acceptable Worker's rights and a liveable minimum wage are not part of the American dream. Punching down while jumping up with a bag full of lobby cash is, however (capitalist Mario game idea first seeded there). And it won't get any better unless people cooperate together and relentlessly fight it instead of dividing and/or becoming apathetic and apolitical.

 

[Xeorm]

To answer your questions: minimum wage will be defined by location. There's a federal minimum wage, most states will have a higher minimum, and some cities even increase that number. It can vary a lot. With groups that get paid by tips, the employer will have to make sure the employee makes at least minimum wage averaged over number of hours worked for a certain period. So, assuming the employer and employee are working by the rules, the employee will always at least make minimum wage on average. If they're not going by the rules, then as usual anything goes.

Now, why still tip? Because it's hard to change the system and little interest to do so, especially organically. If the store wants to pay the servers a full wage and disallow tips, then that means the customers need to pay more to the restaurant. People are often offended if you add the "tip" as a mandatory expense when the check comes in, so that method isn't amazing. Increasing prices lowers your ability to compete with other restaurants on cost, because your server costs are factored in. Especially difficult if you're competing against other businesses that offer more takeout, since they don't have to worry about paying servers in the first place.

There's also other complicated bits based on how people tend to spend money that you lose out on if you don't use tipping. Different customers will pay different amounts of money for the same good, and ideally any business wants to take advantage of this. Tipping works similarly to offering sales in that regard. Or how people will tend to be more free with their money after they've eaten than they would have before, and so can pay more into the restaurant if you leave that server charge till after they've eaten. Things like that.

 

[Tanis]

It's still a thing because, unless it's Guns or Jesus, Americans are spineless dolts.

 

[twistedmic]

Why not be fair and pay staff a decent wage and what exactly is the US minimum wage or is it divided by the state?

Because if you giver the food service workers (servers, cooks, dishwashers etc.) a living wage/pay them more, then the restaurant owners would have to raise the prices of the menu items (I'm guessing somewhere between 15-20%) and you would end up having to pay more for your food and service.
Just completely ignore the fact that with societal pressure practically forcing you to tip you are already paying more for your food than was advertised.