We got our favorite genres, rpgs, adventure games, beat them ups. So what are some things that decides if the game meets the expectation of your fave genre
Things you look for in a genre you are familiar with?
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RPGs:
Is combat purely a grind, purely just about "get levels, spam strongest skill", or is it a game that requires me to learn the combat system's intricacies in order to kick ass? If it's the first kind, meh, as long as the story is good, I'll kinda like it. If it's the second kind, oh hell yes it's on >
(The second kind is the kind I try to make. Considering one of my games, on a VERY challenging Hard Mode, has the game end usually around level 9, and one maniac beat the game on Hard with everyone at level 4 after skipping every single non-boss in the game...I think I'm pretty decent at making those kinds of games)
Space sims:
Is the space combat newtonian, or am I flying a plane in space? Also, how much does the world interact with me?
...Seriously, I keep trying out space sims and none of them really fully satisfy me. ;_; There's always some problem that prevents me from fully enjoying it.
Is combat purely a grind, purely just about "get levels, spam strongest skill", or is it a game that requires me to learn the combat system's intricacies in order to kick ass? If it's the first kind, meh, as long as the story is good, I'll kinda like it. If it's the second kind, oh hell yes it's on >
(The second kind is the kind I try to make. Considering one of my games, on a VERY challenging Hard Mode, has the game end usually around level 9, and one maniac beat the game on Hard with everyone at level 4 after skipping every single non-boss in the game...I think I'm pretty decent at making those kinds of games)
Space sims:
Is the space combat newtonian, or am I flying a plane in space? Also, how much does the world interact with me?
...Seriously, I keep trying out space sims and none of them really fully satisfy me. ;_; There's always some problem that prevents me from fully enjoying it.
Stealth genre: 1. Ample options of how to progress through the maps, based on my personal thought process of avoiding threats.
2. Ample amusing/interesting/creepy/informative conversations to be overheard, to reward me for being a sneaky bastard. One of my favorite moments was in...I think the first Thief game, or else Thief 2, where I was listening to 2 kitchen servant women talking about the master, and how much of an asshole he was, and how they knew X secret about him. Which directly impacted what I was there to do. Even got a little update to my quest log, and Garrett commented on it. It's something you can totally miss if you don't sneak around that way, but it felt good to benefit from my stealthy voyeurism.
3. Something I sort of refer to as the "Robin Hood" effect. The people that you steal from, are usually portrayed as being assholes, or some other form of scum, so stealing from them feels vindicated.
2. Ample amusing/interesting/creepy/informative conversations to be overheard, to reward me for being a sneaky bastard. One of my favorite moments was in...I think the first Thief game, or else Thief 2, where I was listening to 2 kitchen servant women talking about the master, and how much of an asshole he was, and how they knew X secret about him. Which directly impacted what I was there to do. Even got a little update to my quest log, and Garrett commented on it. It's something you can totally miss if you don't sneak around that way, but it felt good to benefit from my stealthy voyeurism.
3. Something I sort of refer to as the "Robin Hood" effect. The people that you steal from, are usually portrayed as being assholes, or some other form of scum, so stealing from them feels vindicated.
RPGs: Freedom. Thats the main draw of RPGs. Doesnt always have to be Elder Scrolls level, but the more freedom, the better, usually.
Fighting Games: Clear, consistent controls. Like how Mortal Kombat has High/Low Punch/Kick, Street Fighter has Low, Mid, High Punch/Kick, Soul Calibur has vert attack, horizontal attack, and guard. Things that show the game has a clear fighting system that is logical across all characters.
Fighting Games: Clear, consistent controls. Like how Mortal Kombat has High/Low Punch/Kick, Street Fighter has Low, Mid, High Punch/Kick, Soul Calibur has vert attack, horizontal attack, and guard. Things that show the game has a clear fighting system that is logical across all characters.
Strategy Sims: Dynamic storytelling systems. I am really fond of sims that manage to simmulate dynamic character interaction such as in Rimworld, Dwarf Fortress and X-Com. So that the actions taken throughout the playthrough are reflected on the mental and physical development of the pawn.
They can form relationships, come from different background which affect their view of the world, develop and overcome mental illnesses and so on. So when they go you feel like you lost a friend instead of a faceless pawn.
It's also useful when this is intergrated into the rest of the mechanics which ascend the game. For example, after seeing his sister shot before his eyes George goes berzerk and charges through a hail of bullets, taking out the enemy tank, but losing a few imbs in the process.
FPS: Vicera. To quote Yahtzee: "A shotgun should sound like God smashing his car door."
Gibs help. The more the better.
They can form relationships, come from different background which affect their view of the world, develop and overcome mental illnesses and so on. So when they go you feel like you lost a friend instead of a faceless pawn.
It's also useful when this is intergrated into the rest of the mechanics which ascend the game. For example, after seeing his sister shot before his eyes George goes berzerk and charges through a hail of bullets, taking out the enemy tank, but losing a few imbs in the process.
FPS: Vicera. To quote Yahtzee: "A shotgun should sound like God smashing his car door."
Gibs help. The more the better.
Puzzle games: focus on specific rules/mechanics and present them in wide variety of executions.
Survival horror: proper environment, outsmarting the enemy is more satisfying (or more viable) than fighting, have some pauses between moments of tension.
Western RPGs: meaningful choices in combat, equipment, leveling and narrative. Good lore/story. Freedom of exploration.
JRPGs: diversity of characters in the party (mechanically and in narrative), well-written/memorable characters, good story. Freedom of exploration.
Survival horror: proper environment, outsmarting the enemy is more satisfying (or more viable) than fighting, have some pauses between moments of tension.
Western RPGs: meaningful choices in combat, equipment, leveling and narrative. Good lore/story. Freedom of exploration.
JRPGs: diversity of characters in the party (mechanically and in narrative), well-written/memorable characters, good story. Freedom of exploration.
What kind of freedom are we talking here?Saelune said:
Freedom of exploration? Freedom to shape the narrative? Freedom in terms of how you want to build your party?
I'm curious, since I make JRPGs as a hobby and more information on what people enjoy is always a good thing.
(Even though I doubt I'll ever be able to make a big open world type game.
)
I left it intentionally vague. Games like The Elder Scrolls and Dark Souls both offer alot of freedom, though not exactly the same kind.aegix drakan said:What kind of freedom are we talking here?Saelune said:
Freedom of exploration? Freedom to shape the narrative? Freedom in terms of how you want to build your party?
I'm curious, since I make JRPGs as a hobby and more information on what people enjoy is always a good thing.
(Even though I doubt I'll ever be able to make a big open world type game.
I assume by "JRPG" you mean turn-based perhaps party based RPG, since I dont think you're japanese. Ever play Dragon Quest 3 or 9? In both you can make your own party (as opposed to pre-designed party members) and are given large worlds to explore, both are also examples of "freedom" that I enjoy.
Yeah, I meant JRPG in terms of "traditionally turn-based (or ATB) RPGs with a preset story".Saelune said:
:s Sadly, I don't think I'll ever be able to make one with a giant world. Trying to make massive games like is too much for one guy. Hell, I've got a dungeon-crawler-ish game with just 8 dungeons that I've been trying to finish for almost 2 years now. :s (Although that one has a lot of skill customization for the characters, at least)
Stealth: I need realistic and fluid open environments. I hate when a stealth game does something like a conveniently placed, grown man-sized 2 foot long air duct that leads directly from a hallway into a bedroom. For that matter, I hate when they do air ducts PERIOD! I?m no engineer or architect, but I highly doubt any (let alone ALL) functional air ducts in a building simply lead from one room to another without hitting a main ventilation unit somewhere?
Interesting that you cite both Elder Scrolls and Dark Souls as examples of games with a lot of freedom.Saelune said:I left it intentionally vague. Games like The Elder Scrolls and Dark Souls both offer alot of freedom, though not exactly the same kind.aegix drakan said:What kind of freedom are we talking here?Saelune said:
Freedom of exploration? Freedom to shape the narrative? Freedom in terms of how you want to build your party?
I'm curious, since I make JRPGs as a hobby and more information on what people enjoy is always a good thing.
(Even though I doubt I'll ever be able to make a big open world type game.
I assume by "JRPG" you mean turn-based perhaps party based RPG, since I dont think you're japanese. Ever play Dragon Quest 3 or 9? In both you can make your own party (as opposed to pre-designed party members) and are given large worlds to explore, both are also examples of "freedom" that I enjoy.
I dislike massive open world sandbox games like Skyrim. That type of freedom is too much for the completionist in me, and I usually find those types of games tedious and boring.
But on the flipside, I absolutely love the Dark Souls series. Yes, there is freedom to do areas in different order, but the real estate of a Dark Souls world is thankfully confined, manageable, and fully explorable by a completionist without it ever feeling tedious.
Or maybe you were simply referring to Dark Souls' freedom of build and gear choices?
I only really have specific criteria for turn based RPGs. Combat and character building must be simple, but deep. Mixing together a melange of systems with no real depth, such as in every Final Fantasy game, is not appealing to me. I consider Bravely Default's combat and class system to be the apex.
The freedom of how you make and play your character but also a game world that is both linear and not linear, and open. Also how you actually play the game, and not just whether you use a sword or bow or something like that.Kerg3927 said:Interesting that you cite both Elder Scrolls and Dark Souls as examples of games with a lot of freedom.Saelune said:I left it intentionally vague. Games like The Elder Scrolls and Dark Souls both offer alot of freedom, though not exactly the same kind.aegix drakan said:What kind of freedom are we talking here?Saelune said:
Freedom of exploration? Freedom to shape the narrative? Freedom in terms of how you want to build your party?
I'm curious, since I make JRPGs as a hobby and more information on what people enjoy is always a good thing.
(Even though I doubt I'll ever be able to make a big open world type game.
I assume by "JRPG" you mean turn-based perhaps party based RPG, since I dont think you're japanese. Ever play Dragon Quest 3 or 9? In both you can make your own party (as opposed to pre-designed party members) and are given large worlds to explore, both are also examples of "freedom" that I enjoy.
I dislike massive open world sandbox games like Skyrim. That type of freedom is too much for the completionist in me, and I usually find those types of games tedious and boring.
But on the flipside, I absolutely love the Dark Souls series. Yes, there is freedom to do areas in different order, but the real estate of a Dark Souls world is thankfully confined, manageable, and fully explorable by a completionist without it ever feeling tedious.
Or maybe you were simply referring to Dark Souls' freedom of build and gear choices?
FPS - fast and responsive movement, meaty combat
RPG - freedom, amazing worlds, proper tile-based UI, talent trees/good character lvl-uping mechanics, lots of gear
Racing - Unique point-to-point tracks, destruction, no catch-up, good progression mechanics, deep upgrade system
RPG - freedom, amazing worlds, proper tile-based UI, talent trees/good character lvl-uping mechanics, lots of gear
Racing - Unique point-to-point tracks, destruction, no catch-up, good progression mechanics, deep upgrade system
Not that picky for the most part, but when it comes to Space Games I tend to ask "What's the biggest thing I can pilot?"
I'm not really that fond of such games where you're limited to fighter-size vessels. I'm fine with not being able to fly the game's biggest ships, but I'd at least like something that utilizes some sort of Turret-based firepower.
I'm not really that fond of such games where you're limited to fighter-size vessels. I'm fine with not being able to fly the game's biggest ships, but I'd at least like something that utilizes some sort of Turret-based firepower.
RtS: Good focus on whats is good macro vs good micro. Does it emphasize skirmishes or does it emphasize Tower defense style grinders?
I do like my fighting games and what I look for is 1. a decently sized cast of cool characters (one of the reasons I can't do Guilty Gear, the only character I like is Ramlethal and holy fuck she's hard) and 2. a game that has good air mobility.
I just can't deal with the MK games or Injustice because jumping in that game especially feels like jumping through pudding. Meanwhile you have airdashes and double jumps for mobility and swag combos in games like BlazBlue. The classic 6D into air Overdrive cancel link into air dash j.2D on Terumi is my personal favourite combo link ever.
Also shoutouts to comeback mechanics and a good set of basic universal mechanics. I heavily appreciate BlazBlue's universal mechanics because every single one of them is used in some way or another. I don't see many people use Counter Assault but it definitely has a place, especially on someone like Lambda or Nu who performs badly once someone gets through her sword shenanigans.
Meanwhile you've got Guilty Gear Xrd which is crazy overloaded with mechanics that are kind of unused even in pro play last time I checked. Like you've got 5 plus universal defensive options that you really do not need. I really want to like Guilty Gear but I just don't. Roman Cancel is so integral to the game and it's just not my kind of thing. I come from a year and a half of daily UMVC3 and meter = supers not meter = RC pressure and combo extenders. Fact
I just can't deal with the MK games or Injustice because jumping in that game especially feels like jumping through pudding. Meanwhile you have airdashes and double jumps for mobility and swag combos in games like BlazBlue. The classic 6D into air Overdrive cancel link into air dash j.2D on Terumi is my personal favourite combo link ever.
Also shoutouts to comeback mechanics and a good set of basic universal mechanics. I heavily appreciate BlazBlue's universal mechanics because every single one of them is used in some way or another. I don't see many people use Counter Assault but it definitely has a place, especially on someone like Lambda or Nu who performs badly once someone gets through her sword shenanigans.
Meanwhile you've got Guilty Gear Xrd which is crazy overloaded with mechanics that are kind of unused even in pro play last time I checked. Like you've got 5 plus universal defensive options that you really do not need. I really want to like Guilty Gear but I just don't. Roman Cancel is so integral to the game and it's just not my kind of thing. I come from a year and a half of daily UMVC3 and meter = supers not meter = RC pressure and combo extenders. Fact
Shooters: They need to be fast, with relatively quick ttks that aren't straight up one-shots. Enough variety that when a meta develops, there's still room for experimentation and personal taste. Most crucially, it should be relatively easy to figure out what's going on and why. Incidently, that's what turned me off the Battlefield 1 beta: 95% of the time, I didn't know why I died, let alone who killed me and with what. And I was playing on the PS4, so it wasn't just a crappy set up. Something like CoD (at least until MW3, haven't played a newer one yet) where the action is close in and frantic is more my speed. That and the plethora of little bars that fill up at the end of the match pleases my lizard brain.
Tactical JRPGs: just... more of them on systems I own. I mean, the PS 4 just has, what? Disgaea?
Tactical JRPGs: just... more of them on systems I own. I mean, the PS 4 just has, what? Disgaea?