Three really good reasons to abolish the death penalty

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Good morning blues

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1. It's open to hideous, terrible abuse. The death penalty is the tool of choice for oppressive political regimes and social movements. It's a handy way of quashing dissent and getting rid of people your society doesn't like for whatever reason. This is true in all countries that use it. Consider the United States: in Texas, people on death row are often there thanks to completely incompetent court-appointed defense lawyers with no experience in such cases (rather than the experienced public defenders that are vital in such a system) - and do I really need to mention the race issue? You can tell me all you like that your own government would never allow such a travesty to occur (or be perpetuated), but you'll excuse me if I'm skeptical.

2. A common argument for the death penalty is that it is an effective deterrent, because nobody wants to get executed. This is bullshit, because nobody commits a crime if they expect to get caught. The psychological evidence here is pretty clear - nobody is going to say "maybe I shouldn't shoot this guy" because they might get executed for it in fifteen years.

3. The death penalty is fundamentally incompatible with the fundamental assumption of Western criminal law, which is that it is worse to punish an innocent man than it is to let a guilty man go free. (This is why you are "innocent until proven guilty," and why you need to be proven guilty "beyond a reasonable doubt" - if there's any doubt, you should be considered innocent in order to avoid any possibility of punishing an innocent person.) It stands to reason that this principle should be enforced especially rigorously the worse the punishment is. A death sentence is about as bad as a punishment gets. Despite this, even such enlightened societies as the United States have executed innocent men. Take the case of Leonel Torres Herrera, who was executed in 1993, despite the fact that he had evidence that could have seen him acquitted. We cannot take the risk of this happening even one more time.

So, let's have some reasoned, level, argumentative dialogue about this issue in here! Please, don't troll, flamebait, or otherwise be a prick.
 

1ronJ4m

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Feb 1, 2009
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Yep, death penalty is not exactly pleasant. Although we don't have it here in Hungary since 1989, but before that in the USSR, killing innocent people for saying the "almighty regime is a bit evil" was a usual routine.
 

S.H.A.R.P.

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The infamous SCAMola said:
I'm very much against the death penalty in any circumstance.
So am I. It seems like a simple solution to a major problem, but letting them rot in jail is probably a better deterrent than an easy quick death.

I agree with the OP's points. But it's to early in the morning to provide reasonable and well thought of arguments to support that mention.
 

SharPhoe

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Feb 28, 2009
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The infamous SCAMola said:
I'm very much against the death penalty in any circumstance.
This. Call me stupid, but I think that anyone, if properly rehabilitated, can still return and function in society after serving a fitting sentence.
 
Mar 17, 2009
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SharPhoe said:
The infamous SCAMola said:
I'm very much against the death penalty in any circumstance.
This. Call me stupid, but I think that anyone, if properly rehabilitated, can still return and function in society after serving a fitting sentence.
Exactly, many people think that jail is a way for the state to get revenge on it's criminals, I for one think it's first objective should be to rehabilitate and transform criminals into working members of society again.
 

Mr. Blond

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wow...well i'm for it simply for the fact that if you're gonna sentence someone for life or to consecutive life terms you might as well kill them and be done with it...do we really have to wait for a supervirus to start thinning out the ranks of humanity a little
 

Tehpwnsauce

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Good morning blues said:
2. A common argument for the death penalty is that it is an effective deterrent, because nobody wants to get executed. This is bullshit, because nobody commits a crime if they expect to get caught. The psychological evidence here is pretty clear - nobody is going to say "maybe I shouldn't shoot this guy" because they might get executed for it in fifteen years.
Look up the statistics. In places with the death penalty murderers are far more common.
 

Madshaw

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Jun 18, 2008
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although im not sure what the alternitive should be, i do not agree with capital punishment
 

Overlord Moo

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Against it. I agree completely with the last point. If they kill you and then find out your innocent, what are they going to do, say,"Oops.Sorry, here's your life back"?
 

Dragon_of_red

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Wow, 3 times my internet crashed after i had written up an argument, and it wasnt protected so i lost it...

So im putting this simply

1- Over Crowding.

2- How many people had been killed for real and a good reason.

I cant remebver the rest, so i hate my internet.

If anyone wants me to put up my proper argument, qoute me.
 

jasoncyrus

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Sep 11, 2008
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Three really good reasons to KEEP the death penalty:

1) Murder (you kill someone, we'll kill you back)
2) Rapists/Child abusers/molestors
3) Chavs.

All three above reasons are why we INTRODUCED it to begin with. Plus prison doesn't work for these idiots. Every person who murders in cold blood WILL re-offend, so far I've yet to hear about either a 1/2/3 who HASN'T re-offended.

As for 2, currently we only have the Death penalty for serial murderers and possible other extreme crimes. Not like a couple centuries ago where you got hanged for far less.

And as for number 3, thats why they have YEARS on death row. YEARS. To appeal and PROVE they are innocent with new evidence etc etc etc.

Personally, I'm all in favor of the death penalty, especially if theres a mountain of evidence against you and 3 or more credible witnesses.
 
Mar 17, 2009
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dragon_of_red said:
Wow, 3 times my internet crashed after i had written up an argument, and it wasnt protected so i lost it...

So im putting this simply

1- Over Crowding.

2- How many people had been killed for real and a good reason.

I cant remebver the rest, so i hate my internet.

If anyone wants me to put up my proper argument, qoute me.
Overcrowding? What are you, some kind of nazi nut?

And it doesn't matter, as long as one innocent man dies, it means capital punishment doesn't work.
 

Dragon_of_red

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The infamous SCAMola said:
Overcrowding? What are you, some kind of nazi nut?

And it doesn't matter, as long as one innocent man dies, it means capital punishment doesn't work.

Weeeeeelllllll....... I had a proper argument written about it, but it crashed, and im pissed off about it but here it goes.

I dont mean over crowding as kill of everyone, I mean as the ones who have zero chance of leaving that prison outside of a box.

Think about it, it would be cheaper to do, as they would dont have to feed them, if they use the lethal injection, its Humane and painless for them, no nasty consciounce on the executioners head, it was safe, and reletevley painless.

There, im not pro death, just defending my topics, and keeping peoples perspectives open.
 

Naeberius

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Aug 13, 2008
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SharPhoe said:
The infamous SCAMola said:
I'm very much against the death penalty in any circumstance.
This. Call me stupid, but I think that anyone, if properly rehabilitated, can still return and function in society after serving a fitting sentence.
Ok ill call you stupid. (maybe not stupid per se more misled or optimistic) In a prison population there are 4 main groups of convicts.
1. Innocents - These people are not guilty and had faulty trials.
2. The remorseful guilty - they did commit their crimes but feel guilty and wish to make amends.
3 The crazies - they did it but were not in control of their actions. (may include mentally ill)
4. Sociopaths - They commit crimes because they like them and are generally beyond help because they either don't want to be helped or its just their nature.

Only the last group "deserve" the death penalty but the major problem is sorting out them from the rest. If a solution to that can be found then they should be removed from society for the greater good.
 

Xvito

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Aug 16, 2008
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The infamous SCAMola said:
SharPhoe said:
The infamous SCAMola said:
I'm very much against the death penalty in any circumstance.
This. Call me stupid, but I think that anyone, if properly rehabilitated, can still return and function in society after serving a fitting sentence.
Exactly, many people think that jail is a way for the state to get revenge on it's criminals, I for one think it's first objective should be to rehabilitate and transform criminals into working members of society again.
The only problem is that the government actually uses it as a way to get revenge on people... Which sucks.

I mean, if you're going to destroy their lives anyway, then you might as well kill them (not that I think that you should kill them).

If you live in the US of A: I feel bad for you. That whole system is pretty messed up, to quote Rage Against the Machine- "Some of those that work forces, are the same that burnt crosses."
 

Frequen-Z

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Apr 22, 2009
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The infamous SCAMola said:
dragon_of_red said:
Wow, 3 times my internet crashed after i had written up an argument, and it wasnt protected so i lost it...

So im putting this simply

1- Over Crowding.

2- How many people had been killed for real and a good reason.

I cant remebver the rest, so i hate my internet.

If anyone wants me to put up my proper argument, qoute me.
Overcrowding? What are you, some kind of nazi nut?

And it doesn't matter, as long as one innocent man dies, it means capital punishment doesn't work.
Surely using that mentality, all it takes is one wrongly accused innocent person to be sent to jail to render the whole law as broken?

I'm pro capital punishment. It sends a message, loud and clear;
"Do not fuck with us"

I'm very much an eye-for-an-eye person, unfortunately here in England, troublemakers on any scale have more rights than those they victimise. And as such, I hate our government, it is weak and pathetic. And I'd very much rather I feared my governments threats of death then laugh at how they struggle to regulate such a tiny little country.