Western game music Take 2
A few months ago when doing a Google search on western game music, I came across both the Article and Forum thread (the latter found http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.125140-Japanese-Composers-Say-Western-Game-Music-is-Dry?page=1) about how a few Japanese music computers felt that Western game music was dry and whatnot.
I stumbled on the thread itself several months after the fact and wanted to contribute my two cents, but because it was months old already and after asking for help from one of the Forum higher-ups, I decided to open a new thread forum on the topic. I felt this was necessary because I have some opinions of my own to put forth, for what they're worth. Not to mention I've noticed a few other video game music related threads as it stands, and I'm curious as to what others may say (even though curiosity has a tendency to not so much kill the cat as it to drop a GBU 43 on said feline for kicks).
So to kick this off...
I disagree with the idea to an extent that Western game music is dry, un-inspiring or un-memorable, they all sound the same, and so on (be it the past or present). Infact, I've got quote a lot of examples of music I personally enjoyed and do remember and can recall on either end.
But If there was a single reason for why as an example I would be unable to quickly recall something from the west I liked would be why I'd have a similar problem from anything of the east; because I've got far too many examples to quickly recall at once over the years. Not to mention what I may be curently focused on can make me forget something and in some cases, not come across it until much later and wonder why the hell I forgot in the first place (FEAR, Sonic Adventure 2, Omega Boost, and so forth).
One week I could like the soundtrack from Modern warfare 2, the next Ace combat Zero, Capcom vs SNK 2, Syphon Filter:Omega Strain and so forth. To give an idea of just what I like, here's a short list of game series alone that I've come across over my lifetime. If anyone asks why some entries such as Mass Effect, Zelda, Infamous (most things past 2007) and so on were not included, simply put, I've yet to play them, so I can't give a verdict in any even by listeing to the soundtrack beforehand and why is simple; I'd rather come across the music in-game than in advance. It usually helps in making the song memorable with few exceptions It is possible to have something be remembered when hearing in advance (Omega boost), but it's me to hear the music in game, as that's how I've often done it.
Those exceptions included Tekken Tag Tournament, Ace combat 4 (specifically the opening title and end, a good 7 or so years before I ever got to play the game), and Motorstorm to name a few. It's possible, but apart from being potentially spoiled (although it wasn't so bad for Ac 4 to be honest), again, the above reasons.
As for the short incomplete list, limited to series as naming (all the) titles in a series would take far too long to make the point.
The west.
Formula 1 (1995 - Playstation), Need for Speed,Price of persia, Test Drive, Grand Theft Auto, Colin McRae rally series (DiRT/DiRT2), Toca Race series (GRID), Twisted Metal (2), Vigitlate 8, Syphon Filter (Omega strain a big standout), Giants Citizen Kabuto, Half-Life, Call of Duty (MW 1, WAW, MW2), Mafia, Splinter Cell (CT), Far Cry (2 more than 1), Crysis, Crash Bandicoot, Ratchet and Clank, Spryo, F.E.A.R., Rally Cross, CART world series, Sim City (including spinoffs such as Streets of Sim City), Unreal, Halo, Ghost Recon, Kane and Lynch, Hitman, Midnight club, Colony Wars (2), Freespace (2), Destruction Derby, Max Payne, Mortal Kombat, Doom, Jersey Devil, Stuntman and Driver.
The East (mostly Japan)
Ace Combat (04, 5 and Zero so far)King of Fighters(94), Duck Tales, Soul Series, Super Mario, Kirby, Sonic (Adventure 1 and 2), Teenage Mutant Turtles(NES), Einhander , Front Mission (3), Blaster Master, Final Fantasy (VIII), Tekken, Urban Reign ,Time Crisis, Cool Boarders (2 the most, less so with 3), Resident Evil (3 and 4), Ridge Racer, Outrun, Sega Rally, Sega Touring Car, Omega Boost, Bloody Roar (1), Wangan Midnight, Streets of Rage(2), Metal Gear (Solid 2 in particular
), Street Fighter, Gunstar Hereos, and Ninja Gaiden.
If I HAD to name specific examples, well...again with the 'listen to in game first' rule, if you don't mind being spoiled or whatever, read (and listen) on.
FEAR - Garage Battle - Nathan Grigg (?)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7aZGuaHoww&feature=related
The soundtrack in general like any soundtrack from any game is one additional factor into the immersion of the game. one's millage will vary but for the first in a very long time I at times felt some legit fear, or at least felt on edge. I had to remind myself several times 'it's just a game, don't get wrapped up in it, focus', and yet oddly enough this track to me felt like a mix of both tension, fear and empowerment. I felt like I could kick ass and take names against unlikely odds as I've done several times beforehand. Not to mention by the time I got to the segment in which this track was, I felt more than ready to take on any threat. Out of many games with repetition that normally would annoy me, this was one of those few games in which I welcomed it as much as I dreaded it. Every time was a chance to see if I could do any better than before or if I'd do worse, it all depended on everything, my weapons, the enemy and their weapons, placement be it them or me, etc.
This was probably the only section I would reply largely because of the music, I'll say no more.
Metal gear solid 2 - Yell Dead Cell - Norihiko Hibino
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSBRgsT91d0
Say what you will about Metal gear solid 2, in my view, it's one of the better of Metal gear games I've played/Heard about (I've yet to play 4, so I don't know how that turns out), and I have to give it to those who worked on the soundtrack, in particular, Norihiko Hibino. Although the Boss themes from MGS 1 and 3 stick in my head, this sticks more so. Maybe it's because of the surreal mind-f--- you (and Raiden) went thru, or the boss fights I had again and again, but this sticks in my head as one of the best boss themes in any game.
Jet Moto 2 - Nebulous (AKA Heaven and Hell) - Pinnacle Music group (Lance Lenhart, Sam Cardon and Tom Hopkins)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mc7FrPVwifs
If I had to recall an 'oh S&$%!' moment, apart from 'Nightmare' from 1, this would be it. The track itself is to me one that left an impression, and the music accompanying it equally an impression. The rock/metal for the hell segments a reminder of Twisted metal, but that's no real surprise at this point given who's involved in the music (and games) at the time. I feel this is an example of one having to play thru to really get the impact and the point.
Ace Combat zero - The round table - Junichi Nakatsuru
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nizctKOaRUI&
Played during the 2nd Ace squadron encounter over B7R during mission 10, to me it sounds like a cross between something akin to a festival or a celebration and at the same time, a duel, or a showdown. Fitting to the part of the mission where 1 of the 3 possible squadrons appearing show up, and you (and Pixy) have to shoot them all down. Not sure what else to really say, except you can listen, or better play the game or dare I say watch someone's playthru (which isn't the best option IMHO although an exception with Kane and Lynch...maybe).
Syphon Filter: Omega strain - Chechen Terrorist theme - Mark Snow
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoBCYk0566U
I feel that the soundtrack to Syphon Filter Omega strain is ...under-rated. My only real complaint is that the tracks themselves are too short, maybe a trade-off given the variety of locations and regions in that specific title, or something, becuase I feel like every stage song brings something special to the table, not just as the song outright but helping to the mood of the region you're in. Adhering to something of an almost 'expected' theme per region. Although on one end I tire a bit of Orchestra music that is in many forms preavalent in a lot of movies and games, on the other there's something fitting to not just this song but several others including when the player revisits Belarus in Minisk and something I'm not quite tired of yet, infact, I enjoy and would listen to said songs more ofthen if not for the fact I try to change things around from time to time.
Capcom vs SNK 1 - SNK Stage BB - Satoshi Ise
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5DPhlCJYPY
I'm just going to say, this is one of several songs that still sticks in my head from that particular game for many a reason.
And I can keep going on... the point I'm at least trying to make is, it's possible, but then again it could all just be me. It's a matter of one may be looking for or what one is willing to give a shot, it may impress one from the get go (Splinter cell Chaos theory, Amon Tobin was rather incredible, words can't describe it well enough), or one may only find they actually did like it but it was overshadowed by some other factor (Jet Moto 2's Rollercide track, at the time, not too fun, the music, several kinds of awesome, wish I didn't stumble on Nebulous earlier) and so on.
I just don't think Western game music in general is dry.
My two cents.
To those who reply, what are your opinions?
A few months ago when doing a Google search on western game music, I came across both the Article and Forum thread (the latter found http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.125140-Japanese-Composers-Say-Western-Game-Music-is-Dry?page=1) about how a few Japanese music computers felt that Western game music was dry and whatnot.
I stumbled on the thread itself several months after the fact and wanted to contribute my two cents, but because it was months old already and after asking for help from one of the Forum higher-ups, I decided to open a new thread forum on the topic. I felt this was necessary because I have some opinions of my own to put forth, for what they're worth. Not to mention I've noticed a few other video game music related threads as it stands, and I'm curious as to what others may say (even though curiosity has a tendency to not so much kill the cat as it to drop a GBU 43 on said feline for kicks).
So to kick this off...
I disagree with the idea to an extent that Western game music is dry, un-inspiring or un-memorable, they all sound the same, and so on (be it the past or present). Infact, I've got quote a lot of examples of music I personally enjoyed and do remember and can recall on either end.
But If there was a single reason for why as an example I would be unable to quickly recall something from the west I liked would be why I'd have a similar problem from anything of the east; because I've got far too many examples to quickly recall at once over the years. Not to mention what I may be curently focused on can make me forget something and in some cases, not come across it until much later and wonder why the hell I forgot in the first place (FEAR, Sonic Adventure 2, Omega Boost, and so forth).
One week I could like the soundtrack from Modern warfare 2, the next Ace combat Zero, Capcom vs SNK 2, Syphon Filter:Omega Strain and so forth. To give an idea of just what I like, here's a short list of game series alone that I've come across over my lifetime. If anyone asks why some entries such as Mass Effect, Zelda, Infamous (most things past 2007) and so on were not included, simply put, I've yet to play them, so I can't give a verdict in any even by listeing to the soundtrack beforehand and why is simple; I'd rather come across the music in-game than in advance. It usually helps in making the song memorable with few exceptions It is possible to have something be remembered when hearing in advance (Omega boost), but it's me to hear the music in game, as that's how I've often done it.
Those exceptions included Tekken Tag Tournament, Ace combat 4 (specifically the opening title and end, a good 7 or so years before I ever got to play the game), and Motorstorm to name a few. It's possible, but apart from being potentially spoiled (although it wasn't so bad for Ac 4 to be honest), again, the above reasons.
As for the short incomplete list, limited to series as naming (all the) titles in a series would take far too long to make the point.
The west.
Formula 1 (1995 - Playstation), Need for Speed,Price of persia, Test Drive, Grand Theft Auto, Colin McRae rally series (DiRT/DiRT2), Toca Race series (GRID), Twisted Metal (2), Vigitlate 8, Syphon Filter (Omega strain a big standout), Giants Citizen Kabuto, Half-Life, Call of Duty (MW 1, WAW, MW2), Mafia, Splinter Cell (CT), Far Cry (2 more than 1), Crysis, Crash Bandicoot, Ratchet and Clank, Spryo, F.E.A.R., Rally Cross, CART world series, Sim City (including spinoffs such as Streets of Sim City), Unreal, Halo, Ghost Recon, Kane and Lynch, Hitman, Midnight club, Colony Wars (2), Freespace (2), Destruction Derby, Max Payne, Mortal Kombat, Doom, Jersey Devil, Stuntman and Driver.
The East (mostly Japan)
Ace Combat (04, 5 and Zero so far)King of Fighters(94), Duck Tales, Soul Series, Super Mario, Kirby, Sonic (Adventure 1 and 2), Teenage Mutant Turtles(NES), Einhander , Front Mission (3), Blaster Master, Final Fantasy (VIII), Tekken, Urban Reign ,Time Crisis, Cool Boarders (2 the most, less so with 3), Resident Evil (3 and 4), Ridge Racer, Outrun, Sega Rally, Sega Touring Car, Omega Boost, Bloody Roar (1), Wangan Midnight, Streets of Rage(2), Metal Gear (Solid 2 in particular
), Street Fighter, Gunstar Hereos, and Ninja Gaiden.If I HAD to name specific examples, well...again with the 'listen to in game first' rule, if you don't mind being spoiled or whatever, read (and listen) on.
FEAR - Garage Battle - Nathan Grigg (?)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t7aZGuaHoww&feature=related
The soundtrack in general like any soundtrack from any game is one additional factor into the immersion of the game. one's millage will vary but for the first in a very long time I at times felt some legit fear, or at least felt on edge. I had to remind myself several times 'it's just a game, don't get wrapped up in it, focus', and yet oddly enough this track to me felt like a mix of both tension, fear and empowerment. I felt like I could kick ass and take names against unlikely odds as I've done several times beforehand. Not to mention by the time I got to the segment in which this track was, I felt more than ready to take on any threat. Out of many games with repetition that normally would annoy me, this was one of those few games in which I welcomed it as much as I dreaded it. Every time was a chance to see if I could do any better than before or if I'd do worse, it all depended on everything, my weapons, the enemy and their weapons, placement be it them or me, etc.
This was probably the only section I would reply largely because of the music, I'll say no more.
Metal gear solid 2 - Yell Dead Cell - Norihiko Hibino
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BSBRgsT91d0
Say what you will about Metal gear solid 2, in my view, it's one of the better of Metal gear games I've played/Heard about (I've yet to play 4, so I don't know how that turns out), and I have to give it to those who worked on the soundtrack, in particular, Norihiko Hibino. Although the Boss themes from MGS 1 and 3 stick in my head, this sticks more so. Maybe it's because of the surreal mind-f--- you (and Raiden) went thru, or the boss fights I had again and again, but this sticks in my head as one of the best boss themes in any game.
Jet Moto 2 - Nebulous (AKA Heaven and Hell) - Pinnacle Music group (Lance Lenhart, Sam Cardon and Tom Hopkins)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mc7FrPVwifs
If I had to recall an 'oh S&$%!' moment, apart from 'Nightmare' from 1, this would be it. The track itself is to me one that left an impression, and the music accompanying it equally an impression. The rock/metal for the hell segments a reminder of Twisted metal, but that's no real surprise at this point given who's involved in the music (and games) at the time. I feel this is an example of one having to play thru to really get the impact and the point.
Ace Combat zero - The round table - Junichi Nakatsuru
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nizctKOaRUI&
Played during the 2nd Ace squadron encounter over B7R during mission 10, to me it sounds like a cross between something akin to a festival or a celebration and at the same time, a duel, or a showdown. Fitting to the part of the mission where 1 of the 3 possible squadrons appearing show up, and you (and Pixy) have to shoot them all down. Not sure what else to really say, except you can listen, or better play the game or dare I say watch someone's playthru (which isn't the best option IMHO although an exception with Kane and Lynch...maybe).
Syphon Filter: Omega strain - Chechen Terrorist theme - Mark Snow
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YoBCYk0566U
I feel that the soundtrack to Syphon Filter Omega strain is ...under-rated. My only real complaint is that the tracks themselves are too short, maybe a trade-off given the variety of locations and regions in that specific title, or something, becuase I feel like every stage song brings something special to the table, not just as the song outright but helping to the mood of the region you're in. Adhering to something of an almost 'expected' theme per region. Although on one end I tire a bit of Orchestra music that is in many forms preavalent in a lot of movies and games, on the other there's something fitting to not just this song but several others including when the player revisits Belarus in Minisk and something I'm not quite tired of yet, infact, I enjoy and would listen to said songs more ofthen if not for the fact I try to change things around from time to time.
Capcom vs SNK 1 - SNK Stage BB - Satoshi Ise
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5DPhlCJYPY
I'm just going to say, this is one of several songs that still sticks in my head from that particular game for many a reason.
And I can keep going on... the point I'm at least trying to make is, it's possible, but then again it could all just be me. It's a matter of one may be looking for or what one is willing to give a shot, it may impress one from the get go (Splinter cell Chaos theory, Amon Tobin was rather incredible, words can't describe it well enough), or one may only find they actually did like it but it was overshadowed by some other factor (Jet Moto 2's Rollercide track, at the time, not too fun, the music, several kinds of awesome, wish I didn't stumble on Nebulous earlier) and so on.
I just don't think Western game music in general is dry.
My two cents.
To those who reply, what are your opinions?
