What are the great Wrpgs of this generation?

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krazykidd

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So this gen is coming to a close . I for one am a big Jrpg fan . I have dabbled in a few Wrpgs but have liked even fewer. I am curious to what people consider " the greats" when it comes to Wrpgs of this console generation . As it stands the only ones i liked were oblivion ( and to a leser extent Skyrim ) and Dragon age origins ( and to a lesser extent DA2).

So i'm seeking the opinions of people who are knowledgable of Wrpgs . What are the great Wrpgs of this generation?
 

scorptatious

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Fallout: New Vegas

Oblivion

Skyrim

Mass Effect series

From what I've heard The Witcher series is pretty good as well.

I LOVE New Vegas.
 

Eduku

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Unfortunately there haven't been all that many quality WRPGs this gen, though that's up to you to decide:

Witcher 2 - Great game, medieval fantasy RPG set in a dark, gritty world. Think Game of Thrones. Features a good moral choice system as well as decent storytelling and characters. Also has a good real-time action combat system which leans towards the difficult side.

Fallout New Vegas - Wasn't able to play that much of this one, but I liked what I saw. Post apocalyptic based RPG that has good characters, good character customisation/progression. Like all Bethesda games, there's a metric fuckton of mods available for this. Also like all Bethesda games, it's on the buggy side, although most of those will have been fixed by patches and the aforementioned mods.

Deus Ex: Human Revolution - Good stealth orientated RPG, also has a decent storyline and character progression in the form of augmentations. Also has some nice dialogue sections, where you try and talk your way through situations by guessing how people will react to what you choose to say.

Mass Effect series - Ehhh...it's decent, I guess. I enjoyed the first one, but personally I think the series went downhill from there. Still, the other two games are...okay. Third person shooter based RPG which suffers from Bioware syndrome. That is: recruit party members, talk to them, make them happy, have sex with them, then go to 3 or 4 predetermined destinations, do the quests, go to your final destination and defeat the final boss. If you go in expecting a third person shooter with some RPG elements and not the other way around though, you probably won't be disappointed.

Alpha Protocol - An espionage/shooter RPG. I haven't played this one, but I've heard a hell of a lot about it. It seems to have developed a cult following, despite poor critic reception. Might be worth checking out.

Dark Souls - I know, it was developed in Japan. But it has the trappings of a WRPG, so I like to think of it as a Japanese take on a WRPG. A medieval fantasy RPG that features a high difficulty level that could be argued to be 'artificial', as well as a real time combat system that revolves around skill and timing.

Legend of Grimrock - Haven't played this one myself. Medieval fantasy, first person action RPG. You control a party of 4 as you move through a grid based dungeon in a very old-school fashion.

Now here are a few hybrid genre games that might stretch the definition of a 'WRPG' a little:

Borderlands 2 - A first person shooter based RPG that has a lot of focus on humour. Don't let the first person shooter perspective fool you: this is an ARPG at its core. The main focus of the game, is loot, loot, loot. You should not be going in expecting a stellar storyline or incredible character development, but to upgrade your stats and get better gear.

Shadowrun Returns - A turn based strategy RPG set in a mixed universe of high fantasy and cyberpunk. Haven't played this one personally but it seems unique, at least, and seems to be getting favourable reviews.
 

Foolery

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Dragon's Dogma. Also developed in Japan. I know people had some issues with it, but I've had a good time with the game. I'd recommend getting Dark Arisen and give it a go. It fixes a lot of the problems. I'll also vouch for The Witcher 2.
 

Foolery

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yesbag said:
I don't even think WRPG and JRPG are really genres in and of themselves. All they show is where the game was developed.
Well, that's exactly the point. Western RPGs and Japanese RPGs evolved almost completely independent of each other. They are very different at their core because of where they were created. Sometimes the lines blur, but there are distinctions between the two. Most JRPGs developers that are still around today got their start, creating Eroge novels, where as Western developers started out with games like Rogue and Wizardry. Bug difference in roots and influence.
 

Maximum Bert

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I would say Oblivion and Skyrim are the two I enjoyed the most although I havent played a hell of a lot of Skyrim (as I really dont have the time atm but I played the hell out of Oblivion and Skyrim felt better) wasnt a huge fan of Fallout though it just felt like a worse Oblivion game still fun though just not great.

Other than that not a lot I finished Dragons Age Origins it was ok same goes for Mass Effect 1 and 2 personally I found one good but hardly amazing and 2 was fun but I was done after that and never bothered with 3 I just didnt care anymore.

There is the witcher series I thought one was pretty bad gameplay wise though and havent played the second but its on my to do list.

I think Japan still makes the best and worst RPGS to be fair. The only great RPG this gen I have played is Xenoblade Chronicles unless you count Valkyria Chronicles as an RPG (I dont its a strategy game with a minor leveling up element) in which case add that as well. Demons Souls was fun but not in the same league but I loved the world they created.

To be honest though I would just grab a few there arent that many WRPGS and depending on the quality of JRPGS you are playing you will find them all great or absolute shit. I do think the Witcher series could be great though.
 

Eduku

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yesbag said:
Eduku said:
Dark Souls - I know, it was developed in Japan. But it has the trappings of a WRPG, so I like to think of it as a Japanese take on a WRPG.
The spiritual successor, to the spiritual successor of King's Field is clearly Eastern in influence and design. It is not a "WRPG". The "J" stands for Japanese - and as such Dark Souls is a JRPG. Just because a game is and ARPG does not make it Western influenced. There have been plenty of ARPGs from Japan.


Dead Century said:
Dragon's Dogma. Also developed in Japan.
And the same goes for Dragon's Dogma.
What is it people getting ARPG and WRPG confused as being a synonym? Protip: They aren't.

I don't even think WRPG and JRPG are really genres in and of themselves. All they show is where the game was developed.
Basically what Dead Century said, they've basically evolved into genres by now.
 

eimatshya

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If we set "This Generation" as being roughly 2006-Present, I'd say my top five would be:

1-Alpha Protocol (2010): I really love this game. There are plenty of criticisms I could throw at it, but when all's said and done, it has provided me with an incredibly fun and immersive experience on every playthrough (and I've played through the whole thing eight or nine times and enjoyed each time). Also, it's wonderfully refreshing to get an RPG set in something other than D&D style medieval fantasy. There are so many great settings for an RPG, yet 98% of the CRPGs we get cluster in the same D&D paradigm. It's great to see a triple A level RPG actually take a risk and do something new.

2-Mass Effect 2 (2010): While the nuclear powered trainwreck that was ME3 has killed off most of my interest in the series, Mass Effect 2 was a game that I really loved. Like Alpha Protocol, it has its short-comings, but they are all eclipsed by the way the game made me feel like I was living in this rich, intriguing Sci-Fi universe. Running through the smoky, dingy, crime-infused, hell-hole of Omega; wandering across the starkly luxurious corporate hub of Illium, every inch whispering of sinister intrigues; Seeing the blasted, post-apocalyptic nightmare-land that the Krogan had made out of Tuchanka; fighting mercenaries on remote, barely charted worlds; Fighting Geth under the shield-frying radiation of a dying sun; all of these locales were so wonderfully evocative, and crafted so expertly, that I became completely immersed in the game. Also, its large cast of characters insured that we got to learn about this universe through many diverse viewpoints. All-in-all, it's the kind of game I would really like to see more of. Unfortunately, playing it now just makes me think about ME3, which makes it hard to enjoy myself, but hopefully that will pass with time.

3-Mask of the Betrayer (2007): I'm not sure if this really counts as "Of this generation" as it stylistically is most similar to the previous generation (e.g. the KotOR games, Jade Empire, Neverwinter Nights), but as it is chronologically part of this generation, I'm counting it. While I did greatly enjoy Neverwinter Nights 2, MotB is on a whole other level. Even with the anticlimactic ending, it still managed to drag me into an immersive and thought provoking experience. As clunky as the spirit-eater mechanic was, it really brought the "being cursed" sensation to life (unlike, say, the Bhaalspawn thing in the BG games). Rarely have I been as connected to my character's experience as when I finally arrived for the final siege, our mage out of spells, all of us exhausted since no one in party had slept in days, but pumped for the battle that would end this. That was the most epic battle I've ever fought. I've seen battles in games that were presented as more epic, but this one actually was epic due to the way the game had led up to it. While overall, MotB is a clunky game, there are enough brilliant aspects to it, that it deserves a spot on the list.

4-Deus Ex: Human Revolution (2011): It took me a while to get into this game. The first time through, I was playing as a non-lethal, stealth expert. As such, I got steam-rolled in the first boss fight. I un-installed the game, and didn't pick it up again for at least a year. When I finally tried it again a few months back, I rolled a combat-spec character, and ended up loving the game. I loved the way the game actually made me grapple intellectually with the issue of human augmentation. My initial stance was, "I wouldn't do it, but it's other people's right to do what they want to their bodies". As such, I thought the controversy of it was stupid. But as the game progressed, it did a great job of showing all the complications that could arise a result of the technology. People being unable to get a job unless they cut their arms off and replace them with fake ones, which will mean that they will then become dependent on expensive pharmaceuticals, and their inability to pay for these drugs will leave them as virtual slaves to the corporations that forced them to get the augs. I love it when a story can change my preconceptions about an issue, and this game did so. I also liked the level design. The devs did a great job of recreating the original game's non-linear levels. Too bad the shitty boss fights are completely incongruous with the rest of the design.

5-Fallout: New Vegas (2010): While I enjoyed Fallout 3, it never felt very Fallout-y to me, and after my first play-through, I've never really had the urge to play it again. Fallout: New Vegas fixes this. It feels so much like a Fallout game that it actually made Fallout 3 look bad in comparison. While the main plot is a bit underwhelming, that's pretty much par for the course for Fallout games. Where the series shines is the freedom it gives you to wander around doing random quests and interacting with the inhabitants of the post-nuclear world, and Fallout:NV is no exception.

Games That Didn't Make the Cut:

Dragon Age: Origins - The origin stories and the political intrigue were cool. The multiple ways the ending could go down were really well done and are a great example of how to end an RPG right. Unfortunately, everything between the good bits was a tedious slog through mind-numbingly boring battle after mind-numbingly boring battle, and none of the companions particularly interested me, except maybe Allister. As such, I find it difficult to replay the game, despite its merits, as the bad parts are just too long. I feel like I'm wasting my life slogging through dull combat after dull combat trying to get to the good parts.

Dragon Age: Awakening - similar to DA:O. Boring combat, too many encounters to slog through between plot moments. Still, the moments of political intrigue were engaging enough to make the game worthwhile, and the companions were more interesting than in DA:O.

Dragon Age II - My favorite of the series. Combat still blows, but at least you get it over with a bit faster. Where the game shines is in making the world feel interesting. The first two games felt bland and generic, but DAII's world actually has vibrancy and character. I really enjoyed the city of Kirkwall, and I liked all of the party members in the game. The game really goes downhill in the third act, though, and there's still the disconnect from the earlier games where the templars don't seem to notice if you run around the city with a party full of apostate mages who are blatantly throwing magic everywhere.

Mass Effect: Has some great moments, but gets dull after several play throughs. Its world isn't nearly as immersive as ME2's, nor are the companions as interesting.

Mass Effect 3: The short comings of this game have been discussed to death, no need to dredge that up here. Suffice to say, I did not care for 80% of it, and the 20% that I did like wasn't enough to make up for the crippling deficiencies in the other 80.

The Witcher - I enjoyed the combat, and some of the political intrigue was actually pretty engaging. For a while, the game had me feeling like I really was getting caught up in these political machinations that I desperately wanted to avoid but couldn't, which was great. That said, I didn't give a shit about any of the characters, including Geralt, and towards the end, they kept interrupting the action every 30 seconds with a completely unnecessary cut scene of some bad-guys showing up or rocks falling or whatever, which murdered the pacing. Overall, a decent game but not one I want to replay.

The Witcher II - Like the Witcher, there was some interesting political stuff going on. Unlike the Witcher, the combat sucked, which combined with the unlikeable characters, meant that I never finished the game.

*EDIT* Fixed some typos and added ME1 and 3 to the list at the end
 

GoaThief

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yesbag said:
[
I don't even think WRPG and JRPG are really genres in and of themselves. All they show is where the game developed.
Disagree entirely.

They are subgenres and the naming convention was brought about to describe their roots and styles. It never was or will be just about their country of origin. If you really believe it was, ask yourself why no other gaming genre uses a similar method of defining subgenres.
 

The Madman

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Honestly, in terms of overall quality and scope, probably the Mass Effect series. I have the feeling we're going to be remembering it as the beginning of something for a very long time, and while the series as a whole definitely has it's faults and mistakes, as an overall experience Mass Effect is definitely something that people should definitely be giving a try. As corny as it sounds it really is the closest thing gaming has to a Star Wars blockbuster extravaganza right now.

With that said however if you were to ask me my personal favourites of late aside from the Mass Effect trilogy they'd probably have to be as follows:

Witcher 2: Which boasts a fantastic story, great characters, fun combat, and is probably the best looking game I've seen to date as well which certainly helps. It's also one of the few rpg in recent years that does a good job with the concept of choice/consequences, with certain decisions you make having the potential to change entire portions of the game. Very well done and if the developers over at CDProjekt RED continue to improve as much between Witcher 2 and 3 as they did between 1 and 2, we're in for a real treat.

Neverwinter Nights 2: Mask of the Betrayer. This one is often overlooked but the NWN series has always been one of my favourites and with Mask of the Betrayer, Obsidian delivered one of the most unique takes on the fantasy genre since Planescape: Torment. But even dismissing that the sheer volume of fantastic fan created campaign out there for this game makes it a must-own in my mind for any fan of the rpg genre. There is some supremely high quality stuff out there for NWN2 and it saddens me it's such a niche as a few modules really do deserve more press than they get, which is next to none aside from the small community already gathered around this series.

Other than those however there are few major titles that really come to mind which have been released in the last console cycle. There's some niche stuff such as Spiderwebs library and a few others, but really the 'western' rpg genre has mostly been dominated by mediocre Mass Effect clones and Skyrim style stuff, which I'm not really into unfortunately.

Future however looks supremely bright with Banner Saga, Wasteland 2, Torment: Tides of Numenera, Project Eternity, and Chaos Chronicles on the horizon. Shadowrun Returns is the first in this wave of old-school rpg's rebirth to be released, and although I haven't played it yet myself I've heard good things.
 

DSK-

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SecretNegative said:
If you want a list, here you go. I don't like all these games, but you might like some of them:

Mass Effect 1, 2 & 3
Witcher 2 (the first one really sucks ass though)
Bioshock 1 & Infinite
Deus Ex: HR
Dragon Age: Origins
Alpha Protocol
Fallout 3

And I can't really name any more on the top of my head because I suck at listing things. But those are some generally considered good.
OT: I'd agree with this, OP, although playing The Witcher 2 was, for me, a ball-numbingly boring chore. However it seems I an in the minority in that regard, so check it out!.
 

BloatedGuppy

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Hmm. Tough one.

1. Mass Effect 2. In all honesty, this was pretty close to a perfect game for me. Take out the execrable planet scanning and beef up the central narrative a bit with less fetch/companion soothing quests, and I'd never stop singing its praises.

2. Skyrim. Haters like to hate, but Skyrim was a fantastic overall experience. There's a litany of complaints about its depth and reactivity, and all of them are valid, but it's an incredibly beautiful and vibrant world you can get completely lost in. Production values are through the roof.

3. Witcher 2. Dense and cerebral, aimed at a more "adult" audience (with its politics at least, if not its profanity and titties). Fantastic shades of grey throughout.

4. Fallout: New Vegas. Like Skyrim, a huge world...this one even more stuffed with things to do or see, and interesting factions to rub elbows with. Held back by an embarrassing litany of bugs and technical issues.

5. Dragon Age: Origins. Old school trappings with some "new school" conveniences. A lot of warts, but lots to love underneath it. Series has since lost its way.

6. Mass Effect. Great storytelling, fantastic cinematic flair, fun new universe to explore...all held back to some degree by clunky combat and appalling enemy AI.

7. Fallout 3. Fantastic beginning, and a vast and haunting wasteland to explore. Lacked New Vegas' storytelling verve, or Skyrim's wow factor, but a solid (and lengthy) RPG experience.

8. Mask of the Betrayer. Arguably the best narrative in CRPGs since Planescape Torment. Let down a bit by the abysmal NWN2 engine and general plonkiness of the game play.

9. Alpha Protocol. Does a lot of really original things so right, that the mess of things done wrong are particularly depressing. A bit of a diamond in the rough, but you have to swallow a lot of rough.

10. Tough one, and we're moving into "generally undeserving of honors" territory here. I'll say DA2, because there were some things it did really well in amidst all the grandiose fuck ups, and because my selection of it will ruffle feathers.

HONORABLE MENTIONS FOR HYBRIDS MENTIONED IN THIS THREAD THAT ARE NOT RPGS BUT HAVE A SMATTERING OF RPG ELEMENTS:

Borderlands 2
Deus Ex: Human Revolution
And the Bioshocks, although they have so few RPG elements it takes some balls to call them RPGs.

Eduku said:
Shadowrun Returns - A turn based strategy RPG set in a mixed universe of high fantasy and cyberpunk. Haven't played this one personally but it seems unique, at least, and seems to be getting favourable reviews.
Lol no.

I enjoyed it well enough, but by any critical standard it's a generally bad game with a host of serious flaws. Skates by on the strength of the IP and a general community nostalgia for isometric Golden Age RPGS.
 

DarkhoIlow

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I will list my favorite RPG's this generation:

Dragon Age Origins

Witcher 1&2

Deus Ex Human Revolution

Shadowrun Returns

Fallout 3

Alpha Protocol

Mass Effect trilogy

Neverwinter Nights 2
 

Ihateregistering1

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Witcher 2: Awesome game, though I would recommend reading the plot assessment of the first game on Wikipedia or whatever, because otherwise it can be quite confusing, as the game throws a lot of lore at you with little explanation. Earlier posts hit the nail on the head: if you like your RPGs with a simple "good vs. evil" set up, stay away, everything is shades of grey in the Witcher universe.

Dragon Age: Pretty much the closest we've come to replicating Baldur's Gate 1+2 this generation.

Fallout 3 and New Vegas: Everyone has their own opinion, but I personally preferred New Vegas. I thought it did a better job feeling like the old Fallout games and had a much better plot.

Skyrim: This game is just so ridiculously huge that you could play it for months and probably not find everything. It did a better job than any game I've played of dropping you into a living world and just letting you do what you want. Strongly recommend the PC version as the game's modding community is absolutely insane.

If you're also counting ARPGs, I'd recommend Torchlight 2. To me, this is what Diablo 3 should have been.

If you're willing to go back a generation or two, obviously I'd recommend Baldur's Gate 1+2, but the "big one" to me is Planescape: Torment. To this day, it still has the best story and dialogue of not just any video game I've ever encountered, but any form of entertainment (books, movies, etc.) I've ever encountered. It's seriously that memorable and incredible.
 

AuronFtw

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yesbag said:
GoaThief said:
yesbag said:
I don't even think WRPG and JRPG are really genres in and of themselves. All they show is where the game developed.
Disagree entirely.

They are subgenres
No they aren't.
Definitely; they aren't sub-genres because they're completely different genres. Different themes, different mechanics, different reasons for playing = completely different game genre.

and the naming convention was brought about to describe their roots and styles.
We already have those:

- ARPG (action)
- SRPG (TRPG) (strategy / tactical)
- CRPG (classical / turn based)
- MMORPG (Massive Multiplayer Online)
- Roguelike (like Rogue)
Yes, those are some sub-genres. If you looked hard enough around, you could actually find examples of each subgenre in both W and J RPGs - which are more like parent genres than sub ones. Keep in mind the reason why subgenres exist; they separate games based on core mechanics, reasons to play, differences in input or control, etc. "RPG" is a hilariously broad term that covers everything from tabletop D&D to pokemon on handheld. Categorizing games based on purpose and feel is one of the easiest ways to sort them out, especially since, if you like a particular "sub" genre, it's easy to look into other games with the same title and find more of what you like. This is why J and WRPG have always been kept separate; they are *not* the same kinds of games, they don't have the same purpose or feel, and gamers play them for completely different reasons.

It never was or will be just about their country of origin.
Yes, it is. We already have subgenres that defined every type of RPG. Recently (this gen actually) someone decided to coin a distinction between the two as a continuation of the old (and tired) console RPG vs PC RPG debates of the 1990s. Since many console RPGs were from Japan, and many PC RPGs were from the West, the terms were coined to accentuate the geographic difference.
Wrong. The development history for each took place independent of each other, creating two distinct "genres" that have nothing to do with each other; aside from the overly-broad term of RPG.
But they aren't true subgenres. The true subgenres are above.
Right, but for the wrong reasons. They aren't subgenres; they're *entirely different* genres. For the same reason that Fallout 3 is not considered a "first person shooter" despite being a game where you go around shooting in first person, JRPGs and WRPGs are made to fill different roles. They look the same on the surface, but the content of the game and the feelings they evoke and the reasons you play them are completely, entirely different. Thus, different genres.
Dead Century said:
Most JRPGs developers that are still around today got their start, creating Eroge novels, where as Western developers started out with games like Rogue and Wizardry. Bug difference in roots and influence.
That's weird since most JRPG devs got their influence from Dragon Quest.
Dragon Quest was heavily influenced by Wizardry (Wizardry is still very popular in Japan).

You were saying something about roots and influences being different?
Guess what - they aren't.
Except completely wrong again. Japan already had a string of RPG titles out before Wizardry even became a thing; both Western and Asian developers started building RPG games in completely different styles inspired by tabletop RPGs. Japan didn't wait until Wizardry came out to start developing and thus become influenced by; they had started years earlier, about the time Western developers got into RPGs. Thus the two styles of games *are* completely different; different takes on the same idea of porting tabletop RPG experiences into video games. They evolved differently because the countries of origin had focuses on different things - the western crowd was already more used to actiony titles so their combat even in RPGs tended to mirror this, whereas combat in JRPGs was very often menu-driven turn based. Everything from the development to the core of the game was unique to their country of origin. It wasn't until years later that the genres started feeding off each other and swapping ideas. Both W and JRPGs had been firmly established at that point.
Eduku said:
Basically what Dead Century said, they've basically evolved into genres by now.
That's not saying much, since what Dead Century was just plain wrong.

Bottom line, they aren't true subgenres and never have been. Those were established many years ago and still cover the entire spectrum of RPGs.
Again, they aren't subgenres, they're completely separate genres. Neither one was influenced by the other until
years after both had been firmly established - and that's why they're named differently. Nobody calls a shooter made in japan a "jfps" or a western one "wfps" because they aren't different genres; they don't have different purposes, drives or central mechanics. It's a clear case of a Japanese company making a westernized shooter game. RPGs evolved in both areas simultaneously without interference or influence from the other group, and thus evolved into two literally separate game ideas.

To help you out a little, since you seem to have the wrong notion about genres and no clue how the timeline worked, I'll link you some videos.

Part 1 [http://www.penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/western-japanese-rpgs-part-1]

Part 2 [http://www.penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/western-japanese-rpgs-part-2]

Part 3 [http://www.penny-arcade.com/patv/episode/western-japanese-rpgs-part-3]

Hopefully you'll be more enlightened on this topic in the future.