Whats so bad about the Star Wars Prequels?

[Elfgore]

So let me start by saying I'm a younger gent and my first Star Wars movie was The Phantom Menace. Which I loved at the time.

So onto the question. What makes the prequels bad? I really wanna know. I can understand Attack of the Clones because that movie suffered plot dragging like no tomorrow and I understand Jar Jar in the Phantom Menace being despised so much, but then again he is a children's character. But can someone explain to me why they are so bad. I loved the Revenge of the Sith, in fact it is tied with Return of the Jedi (holy shit just noticed the similar title) for my favorite. But the main question is what make the prequels bad in so many people's eyes.

Note:If all you are going to say is opinions, I understand that I want answers though, I fail to see what makes them so terrible to some people.

 

[shrekfan246]

inb4 RedLetterMedia

I liked the prequels. Looking back on them, the writing for Anakin was pretty atrocious all throughout and dat love arc couldn't have been more forced if a giant sign suddenly popped up saying "You are in love now!"

But they were really good for action, and honestly it's not like the pacing or structuring was any worse than episodes V and VI. They weren't exactly high-class entertainment, and were always intended for younger audiences. It just so happens to be a huge coincidence that they accrued a massive older fan-base that only got older as time went on, and then went and saw the prequels without the filter of nostalgia to help cloud their judgement.

Maybe I'm simplifying it, because I was incredibly young when I saw the original trilogy and only slightly older when I saw the prequels. The originals had more carrying from the actors, what with Harrison Ford, James Earl Jones, Mark Hammil, and Billy Dee Williams destroying it as opposed to Ewan McGregor trying to pull everything together by himself as Sam Jackson hams it all up to try and stay at a PG rating because he knows he's out of his element, but other than that...

 

[Shadowstar38]

Star Wars is the scared holy grail of Sci-Fi movies beloved by all of its fans. Nothing that came out after the original trilogy was ever going to match the high standards set by fans. So if you put out something mediocre, people go nuts.

Add to that the fact that, if your the kind of person that gets really analytical when you watch movies, the prequels have some bad scripts, pacing, characterizations, and all that other fluff.

 

[DaSmart1]

They're just straight up bad movies. Not the worst movies ever, but...yeah they're pretty bad. The story is boring and uninteresting, the characters are all dumb and do things that make no sense, they're all basically CGI overload,they're just not good movies. Now, when you take a slightly below average movie and attach it to a series that's typically held to a much higher quality, people tend to get pissed.

 

[lechat]

if jar jar was a real person i'm pretty sure i would be up on murder charges by now so while i agree the plots did drag abit and there was far too much politics and not enough pew pew i didn't think they were overly terrible

 

[Revnak_v1legacy]

They just aren't good. They fail in virtually every way a movie can. They're rather poorly acted and written, the characters make little sense, everybody does crazy shit, and the action honestly isn't that good.

 

[DoPo]

Here, you go. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.391765-Seriously-WHY-Do-People-Consider-The-Star-Wars-Prequels-to-be-Horrendous] You might need to comb a bit but people do delve into it.

Off-topic, do we need a new monthly column "So what was X about?" - we seem to get many of these questions, roughly monthly - why did people like this, why they hated that. It seems more structured to just have a central repository of explanations.

 

[piinyouri]

I didn't care for all the hokey CG throughout them, and I did find the first two boring, but I really legitimately enjoy the third.

 

[aba1]

I think it was a huge disappointment that they took all the sub-themes and philosophical insights from the first three movies and flushed them down the toilet.

 

[Professor Lupin Madblood]

RedLetterMedia actually has a pretty good-

inb4 RedLetterMedia

GOD FUCKING PIECE OF SHEOFIHSOIEHAF;LDKHASDOIHFAPOSIDHFSDF

Yeah, there are some Mr. Plinkett reviews on RedLetterMedia that do a great job of explaining all the myriad faults the prequels have. They're long (movie length, in fact), but thorough. Go watch 'em.

But they were really good for action, and honestly it's not like the pacing or structuring was any worse than the original three films.

The action was certainly more intense, but it lacked emotional connection. Luke vs Vader in Episode VI is really tense because it's a clash of their entire characters - the ten-minute lightsaber fight between Anakin and Obi-Wan in Episode III is lacking because it's insanely long and because they just do so much crap that we forget they're characters instead of people doing cool things onscreen.

Also, sorry, but no, the prequels have far worse pacing and structure. Episode IV remains a testament to how to structure a narrative: every scene either serves to ramp the stakes up higher or to let the audience recover from said ramp-up, and they occur in beautiful alternation. Something exciting happens, you get a slow character moment to recover from it that leads into something exciting happening, etc.

Conversely, the Phantom Menace doesn't even have a protagonist.[footnote]Not that having a protagonist is a requirement, but it unless the focus of a move is examining things like protagonists and such in relation to structure and narrative role, it is not something that should be lightly eschewed.[/footnote]

They weren't exactly high-class entertainment, and were always intended for younger audiences. It just so happens to be a huge coincidence that they accrued a massive older fan-base that only got older as time went on, and then went and saw the prequels without the filter of nostalgia to help cloud their judgement.

Well, there's a difference between aiming a movie at younger people/teens (original trilogy) and making it for children (prequels), especially if they're allegedly part of the same series.

 

[Accel]

When I was a kid, my dad took me to see the original trilogy when it was re-released in theaters in the 90s and I remember loving the hell out of them.

When the Phantom Menace came, it was during a time when I wasn't into Star Wars so I didn't to go see it until I rented the DVD form Blockbuster. And the movie was just plain boring. I didn't understand what was supposed to be going on with the politics, Jar Jar was absolutely ridiculous, none of the characters were all that likeable, and even certain action sequences like the pod race were boring/too long. And the idea that C-3P0 and R2-D2 were around since the beginning confused the crap out of me. The only thing I really enjoyed watching was the light-saber duel between Darth Maul and Qui Gon and Obi Wan.

At the time, I thought the problem was me rather than the movie; that I just didn't "get" Star Wars any more because I grew out of it.

Then I eventually watched a marathon of the original trilogy with a few friends and was pleasantly surprised that I still enjoyed them all the same. And I didn't feel it was due to nostalgia.

I wouldn't ever have been able to do a RLM-style analysis of the prequels, but I could tell that the problem wasn't me; the Phantom Menace is just plain bad.

 

[ShinyCharizard]

Well the first two were pretty crap. I really enjoyed the third movie though, I thought it was quite good.

 

[shrekfan246]

The action was certainly more intense, but it lacked emotional connection. Luke vs Vader in Episode VI is really tense because it's a clash of their entire characters - the ten-minute lightsaber fight between Anakin and Obi-Wan in Episode III is lacking because it's insanely long and because they just do so much crap that we forget they're characters instead of people doing cool things onscreen.

I suppose I didn't care about the emotional connection when I was younger.

Also, sorry, but no, the prequels have far worse pacing and structure. Episode IV remains a testament to how to structure a narrative: every scene either serves to ramp the stakes up higher or to let the audience recover from said ramp-up, and they occur in beautiful alternation. Something exciting happens, you get a slow character moment to recover from it that leads into something exciting happening, etc.

I'm going to edit my original post to exclude Episode IV. The first one may have had decent pacing, but the two following it fell apart pretty quickly.

Well, there's a difference between aiming a movie at younger people/teens (original trilogy) and making it for children (prequels), especially if they're allegedly part of the same series.

And they should be judged and treated accordingly, which people haven't done. Instead they've held the original trilogy up on a massive pedestal and since the prequels couldn't reach that lofty goal and were aimed at a different demographic to boot, they got unfairly lambasted.

I'm not saying the prequels don't have problems. The writing in particular is absolutely abysmal. But people gloss over the issues that are present in both trilogies, ignoring them in the original while highlighting them as problems in the prequels.

 

[Keoul]

Expositions are long and boring
So here's a song instead!
And now you get an explanation and a song!

 

[Lilani]

I liked the prequels. Looking back on them, the writing for Anakin was pretty atrocious all throughout and dat love arc couldn't have been more forced if a giant sign suddenly popped up saying "You are in love now!"

God yes. I saw a clip from one of the scenes with teenaged Anakin and Padme recently and it was some of the most stilted banter between two people in love I've ever seen. It's like they did an homage to every single bad soap opera romance with two actors that tried to make the best of it but just couldn't commit.

But apart from that, I haven't seen the prequel movies recently enough to give them a good critique. I remember Jar Jar annoying the shit out of me, and the painful stereotypes him and a few of the other alien characters were saddled with (the flying peddler guy that kid-Anakin worked for on Tatooine is the closest thing to the Shylock the popular media has seen since the probably 40s or 50s, and I don't even feel comfortable mentioning the stereotype Jar Jar fits). I remember them looking pretty cool, there was a lizard thing Obiwan rode in one of the movies I thought was neat. And I know a lot of people didn't like fighting Yoda but I thought he was awesome.

 

[Accel]

I'm not saying the prequels don't have problems. The writing in particular is absolutely abysmal. But people gloss over the issues that are present in both trilogies, ignoring them in the original while highlighting them as problems in the prequels.

The writing being abysmal is in itself a huge problem with the prequels, since it's present throughout all of them.

I won't deny there's flaws in the original trilogy (especially once you get to RotJ, where you can really see the cracks showing), but they're mainly nitpicks and everything else about the trilogy as a whole is so good that those flaws can easily be forgiven.

A lot of the stuff people complain about in the prequels can also be considered nitpicks (even RedLetterMedia admitted a lot of the problems they pointed out in the prequels were nitpicks) and these could ALSO be forgiven if at least the basic stuff was done right. But all the big stuff is terrible too.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

But the main question is what make the prequels bad in so many people's eyes.

The original movies were about a series of increasingly daring escapes. First movie, escape both Mos Eisley and the Death Star. Second movie, escape the Wampa/Hoth/giant asteroid slug/Cloud City. Third movie, escape Jabba's skiff/Death Star again. The movies were daring, fun, not too serious about themselves, but above all entertaining escapism - literally and figuratively.

Then the beloved adventure series became about political dribble, "trade federations" (Trade Federations! Compare to "the evil empire" from the original movies), loooong senatorial debates and loooong council meetings and loooong dissertations about love and midichlorians. On a more personal note, I'm not a big fan of CGI and prefer good old puppetty FX. And Hayden C's acting sucks wood. And Jar Jar... etc, etc, etc.

Long story short, George took Star Wars too seriously. He should've stuck with good old fashioned gung ho close escapes rather than re-invent the series as a political drama. Not that political dramas are a bad thing, but SW was never meant to be one, and the try was less than good.

 

[BloatedGuppy]

Long story short, George took Star Wars too seriously.

Yeah, that was the impression I got, too.

Somewhere in-between the poo-poo jokes, the little kid, the cartoonish/racist alien caricatures, the appalling and blatant retreading of original trilogy icons, the slap dash script and the comically inept direction I stopped to think "Lucas is taking all of this way too seriously".

Here's a different scenario. George Lucas became encumbered by his own success. Instead of being surrounded with talented friends and co-workers (Spielberg, Kasdan, Kershner), and instead of being surrounded with people who had power and influence and a willingness to say "no" to him (changing his dialogue ad lib, ala Harrison Ford, or questioning his original intention to make Han Solo a gilled alien), Lucas was surrounded by yes-men and sycophants. He funded the films himself, so he had no studio to answer to, he could make whatever his whims declared. And his whims declared he create a soulless, badly acted, poorly directed debacle that seriously damaged the reputation of one of the most successful IPs of all time. It's quite possible the man was simply never that talented to begin with. Or that his talent peaked in his early 20's, as it can often do with creative types, and the older Lucas was too plump with success to realize he didn't really have it any more. The man hadn't directed a film since "A New Hope". That's 22 years spent NOT refining your trade.

He's a good guy, and I respect his donations to charity tremendously. I wish him well, I really do. But the guy demonstrated an Ed Wood level talent with the Star Wars prequels. Whatever he had...if he ever really had anything...is gone now.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

Long story short, George took Star Wars too seriously.

Yeah, that was the impression I got, too.

Somewhere in-between the poo-poo jokes, the little kid, the cartoonish/racist alien caricatures, the appalling and blatant retreading of original trilogy icons, the slap dash script and the comically inept direction I stopped to think "Lucas is taking all of this way too seriously".

Here's a different scenario. George Lucas became encumbered by his own success. Instead of being surrounded with talented friends and co-workers (Spielberg, Kasdan, Kershner), and instead of being surrounded with people who had power and influence and a willingness to say "no" to him (changing his dialogue ad lib, ala Harrison Ford, or questioning his original intention to make Han Solo a gilled alien), Lucas was surrounded by yes-men and sycophants. He funded the films himself, so he had no studio to answer to, he could make whatever his whims declared. And his whims declared he create a soulless, badly acted, poorly directed debacle that seriously damaged the reputation of one of the most successful IPs of all time. It's quite possible the man was simply never that talented to begin with. Or that his talent peaked in his early 20's, as it can often do with creative types, and the older Lucas was too plump with success to realize he didn't really have it any more. The man hadn't directed a film since "A New Hope". That's 22 years spent NOT refining your trade.

He's a good guy, and I respect his donations to charity tremendously. I wish him well, I really do. But the guy demonstrated an Ed Wood level talent with the Star Wars prequels. Whatever he had...if he ever really had anything...is gone now.

That was a very witty comeback but I think you misunderstood where I was going. Just because Lucas takes himself too seriously doesn't mean his movies are serious. Just inept.

 

[Basement Cat]

George Lucas targeted a young audience for both the original trilogy and the prequels. He even went so far as to consult with a child psychologist (on Ep IV) about whether the Stormtroopers being killed was too much for young kids (the shrink said that since all the Stormtroopers were masked/faceless nobodies it was okay).

I remember when the OT came out. It hooked kids, sure, but it SWALLOWED teenagers and adults.

Then the years passed and Lucas decided to make the Prequels. The technology had advanced enough for him to do it.

And he aimed for the same young crowd that he did before. And the VERY young kids he was demographically targeting LOVED the new Star Wars movies. They LOVED Jar Jar Binks. They were utterly THRILLED at the pod race.

But the older fans underwent a nuclear meltdown.

To be sure Lucas is no writer of romance, and the scenes between Anakin and Padme are cringe-worthy (I remember literally leaning my head back and closing my eyes in the theater during the "love scenes" in Clones) but the action is solid and people were really just showing up to find out how sweet little Ani became Darth Vader.

The posters above have mentioned some critical analyses of the prequels and the one about the Phantom Menace is quite good. The second is adequate. The third is nothing more than a guy griping and moaning and groaning. Literally.

It took years for people to start getting past their fanboy gripes, and there are many who live for condemning the prequels. You've probably noticed that already.

Others, like Movie Bob, have started to reassess their opinions on the prequels, like Bob did with The Phantom Menace 13 Years Later [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/videos/view/escape-to-the-movies/5357-The-Phantom-Menace-13-Years-Later].

Watch that Escape to the Movies episode. It's worth a look if you want to grok.

P.S. I enjoyed the first and 3rd movies immensely. I also enjoyed the second movie except for the romance scenes and the very beginning where they make Anakin act like an over the top douche (to set the scene for the future romance--ugh!) when he meets Padme.