When are spoilers no longer spoilers?

[Vudu]

Everyone hates spoilers but there are some spoilers that aren't considered spoilers. Like "Soylent green is made of people!" or that it was earth the whole time. (You monsters! You blew it up!Damn you! Damn you all to hell!). I know those are old popular movies and have been seen by everyone but something I realized is that I (we) are getting old. And stuff like 'Lost', 'Star Trek (TNG, DS9, etc...)', 'Star Wars', and 'Battle star Galactica' is now old, too. Even Harry Potter's got some crow's feet, especially when you consider how old the books actually are. So obviously I'm not talking about stuff that's currently on the air like The Walking Dead and Game of Thrones. I'm talking about the stuff that's come and gone. When is it okay to say Snape kills Dumbledore without being an asshole?

 

[Vudu]

When enough time has passed to the point where everyone knows about the spoilers in question.

Even so, sometimes they discover the spoiler before they got a chance to see the movie. I haven't seen soylent green yet and the ending was spoiled for me long ago. But I'm not going to get upset with the person who spoiled it for me because it's a movie that's old that most everyone has seen. Well, technically, so are Harry Potter and Lord of the rings. 'Everyone' knows about them but some still haven't seen or read either. I watched Harry Potter before I read it and found out about Snape online before I saw the movie. Was the person who spoiled it a jerk?

 

[Marter]

They are spoilers forever and should always be accompanied with a warning.

With that said, if a property is "ruined" by you knowing a spoiler before experiencing it, it's probably not particularly good in the first place.

 

[tippy2k2]

In real life: When the item in question is considered a normal pop culture reference (He was dead THE WHOLE TIME!!!, I am your father, It was Earth all along!, etc.), it's fair game. Otherwise I will ask the person I am talking with if they've experienced whatever we are discussion (and if not, I request the right of spoilage if they are so inclined).

Online: I feel that everything should be spoiler-tagged for at least a year after the item in question has come out for the "last" time (as in, movies/TV it's one year from DVD/Blu-Ray, video games one year from it's initial release date; books one year from paper back).

However, like real life, I feel the proper etiquette is a spoiler warning/tag no matter what unless it is a normal pop culture reference. I just finished Breaking Bad a few days ago and it would have completely killed the show for me if I had known what went down on that last episode is how the cards were going to fall.

NOTE: This does NOT count forums/topics that are SPECIFICALLY stated as Spoiler Warning in the Title or if it's reasonable to expect spoilers in the discussion. If you see "What did you think of Breaking Bad?" and you click into that topic, you have zero right to ***** when someone tells you what happened.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

Bar some contextual exceptions, spoilers are always tag/warning worthy. Say if you're in your final year of film school and the guys are talking about Citizen Kane's ending, don't cover your ears and say SPOILER! You should've watched it by now. But in a pretty broad geek website like Escapist where there's no rule of thumb regarding users you shouldn't take for granted EVERYBODY has seen or read or played that one thing you totally just spoiled.

 

[Vudu]

Bar some contextual exceptions, spoilers are always tag/warning worthy. Say if you're in your final year of film school and the guys are talking about Citizen Kane's ending, don't cover your ears and say SPOILER! You should've watched it by now. But in a pretty broad geek website like Escapist where there's no rule of thumb regarding users you shouldn't take for granted EVERYBODY has seen or read or played that one thing you totally just spoiled.

Well I'm not talking about overtly spoiling something. I'm talking about saying something in passing that your'e not even thinking about that you're sure everyone knows about. Like comparing your friend to a character that turns out to be a traitor in a show or movie they haven't seen. And then when they say "huh?", you clarify, thinking your joke just went over their head, only to realize you've spoiled it for them when they get upset.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

Bar some contextual exceptions, spoilers are always tag/warning worthy. Say if you're in your final year of film school and the guys are talking about Citizen Kane's ending, don't cover your ears and say SPOILER! You should've watched it by now. But in a pretty broad geek website like Escapist where there's no rule of thumb regarding users you shouldn't take for granted EVERYBODY has seen or read or played that one thing you totally just spoiled.

Well I'm not talking about overtly spoiling something. I'm talking about saying something in passing that your'e not even thinking about that you're sure everyone knows about. Like comparing your friend to a character that turns out to be a traitor in a show or movie they haven't seen. And then when they say "huh?", you clarify, thinking your joke just went over their head, only to realize you've spoiled it for them when they get upset.

Well I guess if you compare them to Judas then they don't have much claim to being pissed off. But if you go with a Game of Thrones character then you obviously should be treading carefully.

 

[Vudu]

Bar some contextual exceptions, spoilers are always tag/warning worthy. Say if you're in your final year of film school and the guys are talking about Citizen Kane's ending, don't cover your ears and say SPOILER! You should've watched it by now. But in a pretty broad geek website like Escapist where there's no rule of thumb regarding users you shouldn't take for granted EVERYBODY has seen or read or played that one thing you totally just spoiled.

Well I'm not talking about overtly spoiling something. I'm talking about saying something in passing that your'e not even thinking about that you're sure everyone knows about. Like comparing your friend to a character that turns out to be a traitor in a show or movie they haven't seen. And then when they say "huh?", you clarify, thinking your joke just went over their head, only to realize you've spoiled it for them when they get upset.

Well I guess if you compare them to Judas then they don't have much claim to being pissed off. But if you go with a Game of Thrones character then you obviously should be treading carefully.

I was thinking more Snape or Lando Calrizian. Old characters from movies that are popular but still haven't been seen by everyone. I already said something that's currently on the air like Game of Thrones is obviously off limits.

 

[senordesol]

You have 1 year. Either see it/play it/listen to it or don't. The world can't stop for you.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

Bar some contextual exceptions, spoilers are always tag/warning worthy. Say if you're in your final year of film school and the guys are talking about Citizen Kane's ending, don't cover your ears and say SPOILER! You should've watched it by now. But in a pretty broad geek website like Escapist where there's no rule of thumb regarding users you shouldn't take for granted EVERYBODY has seen or read or played that one thing you totally just spoiled.

Well I'm not talking about overtly spoiling something. I'm talking about saying something in passing that your'e not even thinking about that you're sure everyone knows about. Like comparing your friend to a character that turns out to be a traitor in a show or movie they haven't seen. And then when they say "huh?", you clarify, thinking your joke just went over their head, only to realize you've spoiled it for them when they get upset.

Well I guess if you compare them to Judas then they don't have much claim to being pissed off. But if you go with a Game of Thrones character then you obviously should be treading carefully.

I was thinking more Snape or Lando Calrizian. Old characters from movies that are popular but still haven't been seen by everyone. I already said something that's currently on the air like Game of Thrones is obviously off limits.

I don't think Lando would matter very much, he turns out to be a traitor like 20 minutes after he's been introduced (but he's still a good guy and bla bla bla). Hardly a big deal.

About Snape (a character that has been built and developed over the course of 10 years and several books/movies), my sister hasn't seen or read Harry Potter since the 5th book but keeps telling me she would be pissed off to spoil herself about what happens later.

 

[DoPo]

Bar some contextual exceptions, spoilers are always tag/warning worthy. Say if you're in your final year of film school and the guys are talking about Citizen Kane's ending, don't cover your ears and say SPOILER! You should've watched it by now. But in a pretty broad geek website like Escapist where there's no rule of thumb regarding users you shouldn't take for granted EVERYBODY has seen or read or played that one thing you totally just spoiled.

Well I'm not talking about overtly spoiling something. I'm talking about saying something in passing that your'e not even thinking about that you're sure everyone knows about. Like comparing your friend to a character that turns out to be a traitor in a show or movie they haven't seen. And then when they say "huh?", you clarify, thinking your joke just went over their head, only to realize you've spoiled it for them when they get upset.

Ah, yes - talking, the act in which mentioning "hey, have you seen X" is, just so much hard work that you can't be bothered to do it. Especially if you clearly know somebody else might not have seen/heard/read/whatever the work you are talking about.

Let's face it - asking is not only a courtesy - you can even mention something that is not a spoiler and you can have people going "huh?" because you did not know whether they'd catch the reference or not. And you clearly were not aware of that because you clearly haven't asked before or you have and you've forgotten the answer. And "well, everybody knows it" is also clearly wrong if you encounter somebody who doesn't. It is really not such a big problem to establish a common frame of reference when talking with somebody. It is part of "communication" as a concept, anyway, so I don't see why you should be complaining about others when the fault lies equally with you. If you are incorrect about your claim of what others know and do not know - please do not blame them.

 

[Vudu]

Bar some contextual exceptions, spoilers are always tag/warning worthy. Say if you're in your final year of film school and the guys are talking about Citizen Kane's ending, don't cover your ears and say SPOILER! You should've watched it by now. But in a pretty broad geek website like Escapist where there's no rule of thumb regarding users you shouldn't take for granted EVERYBODY has seen or read or played that one thing you totally just spoiled.

Well I'm not talking about overtly spoiling something. I'm talking about saying something in passing that your'e not even thinking about that you're sure everyone knows about. Like comparing your friend to a character that turns out to be a traitor in a show or movie they haven't seen. And then when they say "huh?", you clarify, thinking your joke just went over their head, only to realize you've spoiled it for them when they get upset.

Well I guess if you compare them to Judas then they don't have much claim to being pissed off. But if you go with a Game of Thrones character then you obviously should be treading carefully.

I was thinking more Snape or Lando Calrizian. Old characters from movies that are popular but still haven't been seen by everyone. I already said something that's currently on the air like Game of Thrones is obviously off limits.

I don't think Lando would matter very much, he turns out to be a traitor like 20 minutes after he's been introduced (but he's still a good guy and bla bla bla). Hardly a big deal.

About Snape (a character that has been built and developed over the course of 10 years and several books/movies), my sister hasn't seen or read Harry Potter since the 5th book but keeps telling me she would be pissed off to spoil herself about what happens later.

Well my point was just about referencing a key plot point in something 'everyone' has seen without thinking (So it's not like I can say 'spoiler warning' like you suggested). Am I a jerk for doing so?

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

Bar some contextual exceptions, spoilers are always tag/warning worthy. Say if you're in your final year of film school and the guys are talking about Citizen Kane's ending, don't cover your ears and say SPOILER! You should've watched it by now. But in a pretty broad geek website like Escapist where there's no rule of thumb regarding users you shouldn't take for granted EVERYBODY has seen or read or played that one thing you totally just spoiled.

Well I'm not talking about overtly spoiling something. I'm talking about saying something in passing that your'e not even thinking about that you're sure everyone knows about. Like comparing your friend to a character that turns out to be a traitor in a show or movie they haven't seen. And then when they say "huh?", you clarify, thinking your joke just went over their head, only to realize you've spoiled it for them when they get upset.

Well I guess if you compare them to Judas then they don't have much claim to being pissed off. But if you go with a Game of Thrones character then you obviously should be treading carefully.

I was thinking more Snape or Lando Calrizian. Old characters from movies that are popular but still haven't been seen by everyone. I already said something that's currently on the air like Game of Thrones is obviously off limits.

I don't think Lando would matter very much, he turns out to be a traitor like 20 minutes after he's been introduced (but he's still a good guy and bla bla bla). Hardly a big deal.

About Snape (a character that has been built and developed over the course of 10 years and several books/movies), my sister hasn't seen or read Harry Potter since the 5th book but keeps telling me she would be pissed off to spoil herself about what happens later.

Well my point was just about referencing a key plot point in something 'everyone' has seen without thinking (So it's not like I can say 'spoiler warning' like you suggested). Am I a jerk for doing so?

Not really but being polite and asking first is nice.

 

[DoPo]

With that said, if a property is "ruined" by you knowing a spoiler before experiencing it, it's probably not particularly good in the first place.

Like murder mysteries? Or just mysteries in general?

 

[The Wykydtron]

Eh some things are just so well known that it's not really worthwhile spoiler warning them. Just the other day I spoiled the ending of School Days openly on a thread here and nobody even cared. It's years old by now and it's almost universally hated and the ending is the only good thing about it. Basically if you're in the anime scene for a decent amount of time you already know and even if you don't it's not the kind of anime you would flip out over if spoiled because it's not even notable in any meaningful way (the animation is average at best, characters are woeful etc etc) aside from it has a twist ending that was totally easy to see coming.

I guess since nobody really cares about the journey up to the ending and the ending is the only thing worth knowing in the series it doesn't matter if you got spoiled? Like you care about the characters and plot in something good like say, Kill la Kill so if I spoiled some of the shit that happens there you would be pissed because you're invested in the story. Nobody but the most easy to please people who wouldn't know decent anime if it slapped them in face would be annoyed if you spoiled SD's ending because it's impossible to care about such boring characters and nonsensical plot to begin with.

Sekai murders Makoto in last ten minutes of the anime accompanied by really sad sounding music by the way. Just checking.

EDIT: Just a note but if an anime is current and there's only a few episodes out at the moment you can't really complain about spoilers. Take 25 minutes a week for the next episode it's not that hard. This season actually has some really good anime, Mahouka and No Game No Life are awesome so it's more 50 minutes. Mystery type stories are always an exception though, I go out of my way to avoid spoiling a mystery, see Persona 4. I suppose shows based around convoluted plans like Death Note kind of count because the reveal of how he pulled off the cool escape is the main draw of the show but that's really old as well by now.

 

[ScrabbitRabbit]

plot twists that used to be a big thing back in the day but not anymore due to at least 10-15 years passing

Even then, though, you can't guarantee that everyone who is interested will have seen/read/played it yet. I played Planescape: Torment and Half-Life 2 for the first time about two years ago, and PS:T wouldn't have been nearly as engaging if I'd known what was going to happen. I still would have enjoyed it but not as much.

Similarly, I just read A Cavern of Black Ice, published in 1999, mere days ago. Again, if I'd know what was gonna happen it wouldn't have been as good.

Even really, really famous twists like The Crying Game or The Usual Suspects are sometimes best put into tags; I didn't know the twists until I saw them. I suppose in some of those cases it's the most famous part of the work (what "Rosebud" is, Vader's reveal, etc) so I can see someone arguing it doesn't need spoilering then, but putting stuff into a tag or asking if someone has seen it takes so little time and effort. I think it's worth it for those who haven't yet had the joy of experiencing these things, for those too young to be familiar with it yet.

Of course if the topic is specifically about a work, then spoilering it is pointless.

 

[tilmoph]

Since I'm not one who cares about spoilers (I like the journey in a story, knowing the end or a twist won't ruin it for me since I'm mainly interested in how the story gets there), my opinion may not be wholly valid.

Having said that, I'd say 6 months to 1 year. Given how quickly information spreads on the net, any longer is asking people to know what counts as a spoiler for something they've possibly seen referenced plenty of times. Also, as pertains to threads and wikis and TVTropes and the like, if you care about spoilers, you probably shouldn't look them up, read threads specifically about parts of the series you haven;t gotten to. For audio, a general spoiler warning is more necessary, since unless you know in advance, you can't really skip over hearing such information.