Proud boys are done with the pretense. Going full Nazi

[Houseman]

Is a right-wing internet campaigner with a huge track record of posting misleading, inaccurate and downright false information a good source?

I mean, it's a video. It speaks for itself. 6 Are you suggesting that it was edited or is otherwise deceiving?

I didn't post the shortened video which only shows the guy getting punched in the head, I showed the video that shows him running up from offscreen and the whole confrontation before that point.

If anything, I'd say that the shortened video is deceptive, because it lacks context.

I don't believe in attacking the messenger, or otherwise refusing to believe the message because of who the messenger is.

 

[Godzillarich(aka tf2godz)]

On the contrary, the fascists and the commies thought art was very important - so important they legislated against the stuff they viewed as degenerate. Both of them loved classical art - they were in ways quite similar, although the Nazis were more for heroic romanticism, where the Soviets preferred realism.

I think the term I would describe either is deadly dull. Give me a Kandinsky or a Beckmann any day.

I think the similarities come in the fact that they're both authoritarian regimes (USSR at least) that sees Unity as something to not be question and to Purge the world of their enemies and bring about a new world order. They are vastly different in political beliefs, I'm not saying Communists are nearly as bad as Nazis, but with those similarities mentioned above it makes sense that you can see similarities in their art.

 

[Iron]

I think the similarities come in the fact that they're both authoritarian regimes (USSR at least) that sees Unity as something to not be question and to Purge the world of their enemies and bring about a new world order. They are vastly different in political beliefs, I'm not saying Communists are nearly as bad as Nazis, but with those similarities mentioned above it makes sense that you can see similarities in their art.

Communists are worse than Nazis.

 

[Revnak]

I mean, it's a video. It speaks for itself. 6 Are you suggesting that it was edited or is otherwise deceiving?

I didn't post the shortened video which only shows the guy getting punched in the head, I showed the video that shows him running up from offscreen and the whole confrontation before that point.

If anything, I'd say that the shortened video is deceptive, because it lacks context.

I don't believe in attacking the messenger, or otherwise refusing to believe the message because of who the messenger is.

Wait... so you are talking about the guy who spent half a minute attacking people but because the one guy was not one of the (several) people he attacked him clocking him was unjustified?

 

[Revnak]

Communists are worse than Nazis.

You only say this because you’re mad that you keep getting owned.

 

[Iron]

You only say this because you’re mad that you keep getting owned.

I keep getting called a protestant. If you keep this up I may need to call up the ADL on you.

 

[Revnak]

I keep getting called a protestant. If you keep this up I may need to call up the ADL on you.

You should stop being so Protestant. Also, I genuinely do not care what liberal institutions you want to bring up as authorities on anything.

 

[Iron]

You should stop being so Protestant. Also, I genuinely do not care what liberal institutions you want to bring up as authorities on anything.

I'm not a protestant! XD

 

[Revnak]

I'm not a protestant! XD

And neither is the Queen

 

[Houseman]

Wait... so you are talking about the guy who spent half a minute attacking people but because the one guy was not one of the (several) people he attacked him clocking him was unjustified?

Yes, and I also think everyone shown in the video is unjustified. I just see a big riot where nobody is right.

 

[Agema]

I mean, it's a video. It speaks for itself.

Just as the context supplied by a longer video is better than a shorter video, so context can extend beyond a longer video, too.

I don't believe in attacking the messenger, or otherwise refusing to believe the message because of who the messenger is.

Given a lot of comments you've made about the mainstream media over the last couple of months, this plainly is not true.

I think the similarities come in the fact that they're both authoritarian regimes (USSR at least) that sees Unity as something to not be question and to Purge the world of their enemies and bring about a new world order. They are vastly different in political beliefs, I'm not saying Communists are nearly as bad as Nazis, but with those similarities mentioned above it makes sense that you can see similarities in their art.

It certainly has something to do with their authoritarianism. Well, it's more totalitarianism.

They wanted to bend art to achieve the political aims of the state. Much as I like Kandinsky's paintings, they really do look like a load of colourful squiggles that are hard to interpret as meaning anything at all if you don't have an art degree. The Communists wanted straightforward statues making workers feel proud of being workers on obvious ways. The Nazis wanted straightforward statues inspiring the populace to strive for the greater glory of Germany in obvious ways. It occurs to me I'm maybe being a little harsh on the Communists because they were very interested in progress and the future, which comes across (some of their futuristic modernist architecture is fascinating). The Nazis however were relentlessly, tediously conservative.

We get this even today in public art. A lot of public art is not done by great artists, it's done by graphic designers, whose art perhaps is more tailored to producing something commercially pleasing than the individual perspective of a fine artist. See also the current kerfuffle over the statute of Mary Wollestonecraft, which has left many looking at the artist's vision and saying to themselves "Mm, that's not what I'd have done" at the polite end, and considerably more caustic stuff at the harsh end.

 

[Revnak]

Yes, and I also think everyone shown in the video is unjustified. I just see a big riot where nobody is right.

Lol.

 

[Iron]

Lol.

I don't get the fetishistic approach to revolution. This is evident with the Bolivia and Peru thread, and the way you view collectives like antifa and blm. It's apparent you search for this, yearn for it, and cheer for it from the backline simply because it's revolutionary.

 

[Revnak]

I don't get the fetishistic approach to revolution. This is evident with the Bolivia and Peru thread, and the way you view collectives like antifa and blm. It's apparent you search for this, yearn for it, and cheer for it from the backline simply because it's revolutionary.

My only disagreement lies in the words “backline” and “fetishistic.”
Edit: also, isn’t my only post in the Peru thread me insulting a dude’s limerick?

 

[Houseman]

Just as the context supplied by a longer video is better than a shorter video, so context can extend beyond a longer video, too.

Of course.
Do you have any reason to believe that context is missing?

Given a lot of comments you've made about the mainstream media over the last couple of months, this plainly is not true.

I think you just misunderstood me.

 

[Agema]

Of course.
Do you have any reason to believe that context is missing?

No idea either way. But a man with a long history of showing information without appropriate context does not deserve the assumption that his information has appropriate context.

I think you just misunderstood me.

Mmm.

 

[Houseman]

No idea either way. But a man with a long history of showing information without appropriate context does not deserve the assumption that his information has appropriate context.

You don't have to, and shouldn't assume it. You should watch the video and make up your own mind. You can see he comes charging off from off-screen, pushes a bunch of people around for "half a minute", then gets hit from behind as he turns and walks away.

There's no context that can make this justified. Even if he had beating up the assailant off-camera before he entered the shot, there would be no justification in chasing him down and hitting him from behind. I remember we had a big long discussion about deescalation, provocation, and self-defense in the other topic.

 

[Trunkage]

My only disagreement lies in the words “backline” and “fetishistic.”
Edit: also, isn’t my only post in the Peru thread me insulting a dude’s limerick?

That insult was uncalled for and unfair. Banhammer

 

[Agema]

You don't have to, and shouldn't assume it. You should watch the video and make up your own mind.

I'm not going to.

It's a near-irrelevance. An anecdote in a world of data. It exists to make the complex simple and trivialised by emotiveness. The world has violence. Debate is an endless series of videos of incidents of violence selectively shown to inflame outrage about good guys and bad guys. It's no different from wartime propaganda: a million Germans die and a million Soviets, and to watch the Soviet newsreels you'd think it were 1 million - nil and to watch the German news nil - 1 million.

People like Andy Ngo are the death of reason and our ability to understand the world and people around us. I'm not granting him so much as a page view.

 

[Houseman]

I'm not going to.

It's a near-irrelevance. An anecdote in a world of data. It exists to make the complex simple and trivialised by emotiveness. The world has violence. Debate is an endless series of videos of incidents of violence selectively shown to inflame outrage about good guys and bad guys. It's no different from wartime propaganda: a million Germans die and a million Soviets, and to watch the Soviet newsreels you'd think it were 1 million - nil and to watch the German news nil - 1 million.

People like Andy Ngo are the death of reason and our ability to understand the world and people around us. I'm not granting him so much as a page view.

I agree, and shame on Revnac for bringing it up