Query: Why should Democrats care about Partisanship now?

[ObsidianJones]

Sanders Confident Democrats Can Pass COVID Relief Without Republicans

"We're going to do what the American people overwhelmingly want us to do," the progressive senator from Vermont said.

www.newsweek.com

Bipartisanship wasn't apart of Trump's administration. The only time Republicans even mentioned Democrats were to blame them for something or call them out for being obstructionist.

It is documented. It is a matter of public fact that when Democrats reach over the isles and give Republicans what they requested... Republicans obstruct more or simply destroy the matter.

Obamacare Included Republican Ideas, but the G.O.P. Health Plan Has Left Democrats Out (Published 2017)

How much input did the opposing party have in shaping the Affordable Care Act versus the Republican health care plan?

www.nytimes.com

188 amendments by the Republicans on ACA. Which they got more than the Democrats ever did, neutered the bill (yet still gave coverage to Americans), and spent years using it as a platform to gain more political power by railing against how horrible what they essentially created was.

The congressional GOP has smothered a more rapid economic recovery

PBS' Frontline has an interesting piece on the GOP response to President Obama’s election in 2008, reporting that, “After three hours of strategizing, they decided they needed to fight Obama on everything.” Part of this “everything” was the efforts of the new administration to end the Great...

www.epi.org

Republicans, supposedly so bullish about having a good economy, did everything they could to destroy Obama's plans to recover and restore the economy at that point. Yet, whatever minor recovery Obama managed to eke out was largely ignored in favor for whatever Trump did... which you know, needed the house and the senate to give him whatever he asked for to make it happen.

Very politically expedient to stymie the opposition and say they did nothing good, while capitulating the very thing you were supposedly against when the opposition was in power to praise how great it was when your leaders call for it.

I full intend that the calls of Unity should be held. But those who should be unified are the American People. We do not need to continue to compromise our vision for America because these Republican Politicians never do. Bipartisanship, with the timber of the kind of Republicans we have in Office, usually means complete and total power for Republican Agenda when the Republican Political Party has the reigns of the three corners of our government, or it means ruling with a Republican leaning when the Democrats have power via the calls for Bipartisanship.

Why not Give Republican Politicans a taste of the Rule they've subjected on us for Decades?

 

[tippy2k2]

Do you want my cynical answer or my non-cynical answer? Well you can have both! Although if you've followed my comments throughout the election and whatnot, you probably know which answer is my "real" answer and which one isn't...

Non-Cynical Answer: The Democrats want to be the "Adults in the room". They want to get things done but they still have the idea that politics is "supposed" to be working together with a group that you may not always agree with. Basically The Democrats play by the "An Eye for an Eye makes the whole world go blind" set of rules. They naively believe that if they just set a good example and play by the rules, The Republicans will decide that maybe they should do the same thing and we can all work together for what's best for The American People instead of just working for what's best for the party.

Cynical Answer: Democrats and Republicans both play for the same team; Corporations and The Rich. Democrats NEED The Republicans because without The Republicans, jack shit getting done falls on their shoulders only when they have full control of everything. So they pretend to try bring The Republicans in so that they can pretend that them doing jack shit is them trying to unify everyone and get everyone working together but those mean ol Republicans just won't play ball!!! It's all nothing but Political Theater to make people think there are "good guys" and there are "bad guys" when really, they're all bad guys.

 

[Houseman]

Why can't we all just get along?

 

[Hades]

Why can't we all just get along?

One side spending eight your obstructing the other side, and then putting a corrupt demagogue in power for four years before finally setting up an insurrection at the capitol would be the reason you all just can't get along.

If one side fanatically obstructs everything the other does when not in power, completely ignores or try to destroy everything the other side achieved while in power and then send a lynch mob to murder the other side when they lose power.....well then why would the ever side even want to get along with them?

Republicans just not being allowed to have any sway and getting completely ignored for four years is kinda richly deserved at this point.

 

[Houseman]

One side spending eight your obstructing the other side, and then putting a corrupt demagogue in power for four years before finally setting up an insurrection at the capitol would be the reason you all just can't get along.

If one side fanatically obstructs everything the other does when not in power, completely ignores or try to destroy everything the other side achieved while in power and then send a lynch mob to murder the other side when they lose power.....well then why would the ever side even want to get along with them?

Republicans just not being allowed to have any sway and getting completely ignored for four years is kinda richly deserved at this point.

I am not well-educated in modern politics, but I find your characterization of "one side is always the bad guy!" to be hard to believe. The way you put it seems as if it were as simple as a good vs evil comic book plot. Real life is rarely ever that conveniently obvious.

I'm sure if we asked a republican, they'd make similarly one-sided accusations, right?
Are there not two sides to every story?

 

[Hades]

Real life is rarely ever that conveniently obvious.

Yes. Usually is rarely is so conveniently obvious. Which kinda reflects badly on the Republican party. There is always some struggle between left wing and right wing parties, the opposition and the government, conservatives and progressives. What the Republicans have been doing for over a decade now is far beyond that however.

I mean a Republican could make the accusation but I don't think they can back it up. After all I don't think there's a recent case of a Democrat leader simply refusing to let Republican bills come to the Senate/House to get voted on. There's not a case of them stealing a supreme court position by arguing that presidents can't install judges in an election years, while then at the same time rushing through their own court judge when they hold power in an election year. And there's no Democrat presidential candidate who after losing loudly insist that they actually won the election for months and then send a mob towards the capitol.

The worst they can point at is Democrats opposing Trump so fiercely but the reason for that opposition can always be traced back to Trump himself.

 

[Agema]

Why can't we all just get along?

For the answer to that, find a mirror.

 

[Houseman]

For the answer to that, find a mirror.

People have been fighting over politics for longer than I've been alive. Plus, I have never belonged to any political parties, or even voted.
Are you saying that those who are neutral are causing the problems?

Or were you just trying to make a sick burn?

 

[tstorm823]

Republicans, supposedly so bullish about having a good economy, did everything they could to destroy Obama's plans to recover and restore the economy at that point.

That isn't what happened. Or if it is, it's because "everything the could do" was literally nothing.

In 2009, Democrats controlled everything. The House, the Senate, the Presidency, and the courts. The Obama stimulus wasn't really the Obama stimulus, it was a wish-list put together by House Democrats before Obama took office and signed 28 days into his first term on a complete partisan split. Democrats had absolute power to do whatever they want, and they did. No compromises needed, so no compromises made. The ACA was a mess not because of Republicans, but because of Democrats. They didn't need a single Republican vote to pass that legislature. But the Democrats weren't united on it, and they needed a scapegoat in case it was a catastrophic failure, so they chose to involve Republicans so they could sell the scapegoating to you. You mention the number of GOP amendments in the ACA, but can you name what any of those amendments do? They aren't terribly exciting literature

You're reciting a history that never happened and calling for revenge over the slights that didn't exist.

 

[Worgen]

That isn't what happened. Or if it is, it's because "everything the could do" was literally nothing.

In 2009, Democrats controlled everything. The House, the Senate, the Presidency, and the courts. The Obama stimulus wasn't really the Obama stimulus, it was a wish-list put together by House Democrats before Obama took office and signed 28 days into his first term on a complete partisan split. Democrats had absolute power to do whatever they want, and they did. No compromises needed, so no compromises made. The ACA was a mess not because of Republicans, but because of Democrats. They didn't need a single Republican vote to pass that legislature. But the Democrats weren't united on it, and they needed a scapegoat in case it was a catastrophic failure, so they chose to involve Republicans so they could sell the scapegoating to you. You mention the number of GOP amendments in the ACA, but can you name what any of those amendments do? They aren't terribly exciting literature

You're reciting a history that never happened and calling for revenge over the slights that didn't exist.

Well don't forget they also had to deal with people like Joe Lieberman who ended up switching to the republican party and they needed his vote to avoid a filibuster, which is something the republicans are really good at using. This is one reason democrats are considering the nuclear option of just removing it, but they also like to look ahead when they won't be the majority party in the senate and the filibuster is the only real power the minority party has to interrupt legislation.

 

[XsjadoBlayde]

Not trying to shill, but ok maybe kinda a little

 

[Revnak]

Who cares

 

[happyninja42]

Well don't forget they also had to deal with people like Joe Lieberman who ended up switching to the republican party and they needed his vote to avoid a filibuster, which is something the republicans are really good at using. This is one reason democrats are considering the nuclear option of just removing it, but they also like to look ahead when they won't be the majority party in the senate and the filibuster is the only real power the minority party has to interrupt legislation.

The problem though, is that when your system has a feature that is the legal equivalent of crossing your arms, stomping your feet, and holding your breath until the other side can't do whatever it is they want to do, that's not a Unity or Bipartisanship method. It's already basically just one side versus the other, with no real benefit to them to compromise. I mean if either side can just block actions, and get the thing they don't want to not go through, what benefit is it to them, to actually negotiate and try and compromise? They can just refuse to participate, and if they are stubborn long enough, they get what they want. There's no real down side to them. So then the other side comes into power and you get the same thing again.

The republicans don't give a shit about any of us, and the democrats are only marginally better in some categories. So no, I don't think bipartisanship is something the dems should aim for, as it's clearly never really worked on important shit in the past.

 

[tstorm823]

Well don't forget they also had to deal with people like Joe Lieberman who ended up switching to the republican party and they needed his vote to avoid a filibuster, which is something the republicans are really good at using. This is one reason democrats are considering the nuclear option of just removing it, but they also like to look ahead when they won't be the majority party in the senate and the filibuster is the only real power the minority party has to interrupt legislation.

The Democrats had just come off a string of months where they filibustered all of Bush's judicial appointments, and then they got rid of the filibuster for judicial appointments. And Lieberman switched to Independent, not Republican, but I guess that's splitting hairs.

Regardless, yes, they definitely didn't have Democratic unity over the ACA the way they did over the stimulus, that doesn't mean they needed Republicans for anything. They factually passed the bill without Republican support. And nowadays, the common claim is that Republicans somehow gutted the bill essentially because they helped proofread it.

 

[Hades]

Oh yeah, another reason why they can't all get along is because now the Republican party provide shelter to Qanon freaks. Dangerous and probably insane individuals who think Democrats rape and eat children now represent Republicans in the House.

 

[Revnak]

Oh yeah, another reason why they can't all get along is because now the Republican party provide shelter to Qanon freaks. Dangerous and probably insane individuals who think Democrats rape and eat children now represent Republicans in the House.

Yeah but AOC is justifiably upset Ted Cruise supported the dudes who were trying to lynch her so isn’t it all even stevens?

 

[XsjadoBlayde]

Oh yeah, another reason why they can't all get along is because now the Republican party provide shelter to Qanon freaks. Dangerous and probably insane individuals who think Democrats rape and eat children now represent Republicans in the House.

Mate, it's adrenochrome being extracted from lil baby kids that democrats take to maintain their (totally visible) youth. You know not the scriptures!

 

[Adam Jensen]

I am not well-educated in modern politics, but I find your characterization of "one side is always the bad guy!" to be hard to believe.

Well, that's because you're not well-educated in modern politics.

The way you put it seems as if it were as simple as a good vs evil comic book plot. Real life is rarely ever that conveniently obvious.

While the Democrats are far from perfect, Republicans are most definitely, literally like comic book villains at this point.

I'm sure if we asked a republican, they'd make similarly one-sided accusations, right?
Are there not two sides to every story?

Sure. But one side (Republicans) consists of a bunch of literal sociopaths. At times it seems as if though their goal is to destroy humanity. There's a reason why Noam Chomsky called the Republican party the most dangerous organization in human history. They are.

 

[Houseman]

While the Democrats are far from perfect, Republicans are most definitely, literally like comic book villains at this point.


Sure. But one side (Republicans) consists of a bunch of literal sociopaths. At times it seems as if though their goal is to destroy humanity. There's a reason why Noam Chomsky called the Republican party the most dangerous organization in human history. They are.

You come across as someone blinded by partisanship, so I don't believe you.

 

[Xprimentyl]

The problem with partisan politics is simply that rarely (if ever) are the interests of the betterment of the general people in consideration. It’s the perpetual cycle of pandering to the demographics that will keep people elected and in power to make the decisions that will keep you elected and in power, and yes, it’s that stupid. If the people you choose to represent think eating babies is the path of the future, well, by God, you’d better get up there and advocate eating babies lest they find someone else to do the job. Problem is “the people” don’t know shit. They THINK a metric fuck-ton, but they don’t KNOW shit. Republican people think “smaller government” (ironically,) so the soap box of a Republican representatives is built upon “the guh’ment will stay out of your business!!!” A Democratic idea might involve an increase in taxes; if that’s even a penny a year, “THEY’RE RAISING YOUR TAXES, AND I’M NOT STANDING FOR IT!!!”

So yeah, partisan politics is the rich, powerful people playing the game of pretending to stand for the ideals of the common man who couldn’t spell “ideals” if you gave him all 6 letters, in order, and told them that’s how you spell “ideals.”