A conundrum if you will.

[PurpleSky]

Fellow Escapists, while doing nothing, I usually have moments of very deep thought, and while in one of these deep thoughts, I suddenly had an epiphany. Infinity dosen't exist.

You may be thinking that I'm high, but hear me out. What do we believe to be infinite? Lets go with a common example, the universe. It is common belief that the universe expands at such a fast rate that it is infinite, however if it expands then it has an edge and therefore can't be infinite. Infinte is simply a placeholder for numbers that we can't concieve.

Want another example? How about placing two mirrors infront of each other, one mirror reflects the reflection of the other mirror in an infinite loop. However, when we try to view this loop, we can't. Why? Because whatever it is you are using to try to view this, be it yourself or a camera, will block the continueous reflection.

So does what I have written have any merit? Or is there something that exists that is truly infinte?

-Edit-
I'm not sure if it's my wording or if people are misunderstanding what i said, but I never said it wasn't true, just that as far we can experience, it dosen't exist.
(P.S. If I seem to be getting incoherent, it's because I seem to have developed insomnia as I have not slept for two days, which in turn is making me all phylosophical)

Before reading edit :Hurr Durr I live on one measly planet but I know that there's an end to the Universe.

After reading edit I feel that -OMG my next post is my 1000th- wooot

 

[Adrian3670]

YOu didn't come to the conclusion that the universe isn't expanding?

MAYBE INFINITY IS GETTING LARGER.

But Infinity by definition is endless, So it can't get larger.

Ugh, you just killed the joke. Thanks.

OT: I don't think we should assume anything yet. Do we actually know for a fact that the universe is expanding at all? Because if we don't know that for sure, then it could be infinite.

Also, if it isn't, then my next logical question is: What's outside of it? If it has limits, that means that there has to be something outside the limits, otherwise, there wouldn't be limits. It can't just end. Here, let me try to explain this better:

There is a field. It, of course, has limits. The limit could be wall, or simply dirt instead of grass. Either way, there is something outside the field that is different from the field. Otherwise, there would just be more grass, making the field infinite. So, in order for the universe to be finite, there would have to be something outside it.....right? Otherwise, there would just be more space, and it would be infinite, right?

(If I'm wrong, don't blame me. It's 12:59am here. Whoops, now it's 1am even. I should probably go to bed.)

I have to disagree with you here, just because the universe conceivably could have a limit does not mean that it is bound by the same rules as earth... it is entirely possible that there is a bubble of existence that is our entire universe and that there is in fact nothing beyond it. Just because we lack the knowledge and experience to describe it doesn't mean its not possible, it just means we haven't figured it out yet.

 

[not_the_dm]

Maybe the universe is infinite but the stuff in it isn't...

 

[crudus]

Black holes have infinite gravity.

You may be thinking that I'm high, but hear me out. What do we believe to be infinite? Lets go with a common example, the universe. It is common belief that the universe expands at such a fast rate that it is infinite, however if it expands then it has an edge and therefore can't be infinite.

"Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the the universe." -Albert Einstein

Want another example? How about placing two mirrors infront of each other, one mirror reflects the reflection of the other mirror in an infinite loop. However, when we try to view this loop, we can't. Why? Because whatever it is you are using to try to view this, be it yourself or a camera, will block the continueous reflection.

That is one of those "theoretical infinities". If the circumstances were right it would be infinite.

 

[Offworlder_v1legacy]

With your examples about the mirrors, you may not see the reflection, but, it does continue forever, you don't have to see something to make it there.

 

['Aredor]

You're confusing the perception of something with its concept. Of course you can't perceive infinity, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Someone else explained already about the universe, time and mathematics, but keep in mind that the former two are only theories. But you're right about mirrors in a way, but the reason is different:

As you know, the picture that's reflected in the mirror gets smaller from time to time because of the distance between the mirrors. Sooner or later, there comes a point where the picture would be so small that it's not big enough to be reflected by the material of the mirror.

But there's an example for infinity that is way simpler: Take a circle.

 

[Glademaster_v1legacy]

There are examples of infinity like time has no really begin or end that we can discern. Things can be infinite and I do have some example of describing infiting but I am just after getting up. You may of heard of it and eagle earth is a giant ball of steel?

 

[Popadomus Ohio]

that is a really good observation. i never really thought about it.

 

[Thaius]

If you mean that the human mind cannot fully comprehend infinity, than yes. If you mean it actually doesn't exist, than you're absolutely wrong.

If the universe is expanding, to use your same example, then there must be infinite space out there in which it can expand. In your mirror example, it still reflects infinitely, we just can't see that far. But infinity does exist, regardless of our ability to fully understand it.

 

[Trivun]

Basic mathematics makes your idea irrelevant. For most of what we know to be true in maths, not least the very basis of the entire field of calculus (vital in so many ways), infinity must exit. Even if it's only as an idea, it still exists. Without infinity, the very basis of most of our science and maths, and the basic laws of the universe, would be false.

 

[xdgt]

How about human stupidity? Every time you think you saw the stupidest thing ever, some idiot comes and proves you wrong. Also wrong on the account of mirror reflection - you can look from an angle that isn't blocked by your body, not that you would actually see infinity seeing as how human eyesight is quite limited.
(And no infinity is not a big number, it is something without an end, like terran marine's ammo - he keeps shooting zerg but he never runs out of ammo...(if he survives that long) thus he has infinite ammo, and its quite easy to see that)

 

[xdgt]

But Infinity by definition is endless, So it can't get larger.

Something that never ends cant get bigger, can it? There is nothing bigger than infinite. Its like saying something nonexistent is getting nonexistenter... Thats a word, right?

Actually you're both wrong, there are many orders of infinity, the first of which is called Aleph0 - the amount of integers, the next infinity which is infinitely larger than Aleph0 is Aleph (or Aleph1) - the amount of real numbers, and there are infact infinite orders of infinite, so there are infinite infinities... bottom line even infinity can get bigger.

 

[Aiden_the-Joker1]

Concerning adumb24's and larsirus' comments time did have a beginning. The big Bang that is when time started so nothing happened before the big bang but this also means that if the universe ends time will stop so nothing will happen after it that truly will be the end. Nothing can happen without time so. Now I believe in infinity non time wise as in numbers and such.

 

[Lineoutt]

But Infinity by definition is endless, So it can't get larger.

Something that never ends cant get bigger, can it? There is nothing bigger than infinite. Its like saying something nonexistent is getting nonexistenter... Thats a word, right?

Actually you're both wrong, there are many orders of infinity, the first of which is called Aleph0 - the amount of integers, the next infinity which is infinitely larger than Aleph0 is Aleph (or Aleph1) - the amount of real numbers, and there are infact infinite orders of infinite, so there are infinite infinities... bottom line even infinity can get bigger.

Interesting. So there is no word that really means never ending. That cannot get bigger because it is the definition of all that exists and does not exist.

Yeah I hope that made sense.

 

[TheDoctorsCompanion.]

Love is infinite!♥

 

[Rarhnor]

Do give feedback, when you find out.

 

[Rusty pumpkin]

time it has no true beginning and no true end

bah, time is relative. i highly doubt any other earth bound species looks at a clock and says "its 6 pm! i must be going to get nuts!" the only reason time may be infinite is because a lot of people want to believe that every moment in time still exists so we can time travel.

 

[Dapsen]

Philosophy is awesome. I think that's nuff' said.

As with most big philosophical questions, I have to both agree and disagree with you. You see, in the event of the mirror scenario, infinity did exist before we stuck our big stupid heads into the loop.

Now to start a flame war: One could believe that a higher power has disabled humanity to ever see infinity, as it would probably blow our minds. Literally.

Note: I'm not a religious person, and I am in no way trying to preach the idea I stated before.

 

[Jaywebbs]

What do we believe to be infinite? Lets go with a common example, the universe. It is common belief that the universe expands at such a fast rate that it is infinite, however if it expands then it has an edge and therefore can't be infinite. Infinte is simply a placeholder for numbers that we can't concieve.

That depeneds on you definition of 'the Universe' if you say the universe is:The sphere or realm in which something exists or takes place. The yes, your example is true because all that exists is constantly expanding. But if your talking about the total space, which is the space currently containing matter and the space currently not containing matter. The no this example is not true.