A few thoughts about January 6, 2021

Recommended Videos

gorfias

Unrealistic but happy
Legacy
May 13, 2009
7,453
2,022
118
Country
USA
* * *

Meanwhile, we have a real conspiracy staring us in the face. Presenters like Hannity and Ingraham were on 6th Jan frantically contacting the White House to get Trump to go on TV and condemn the riot, or get them to ease off, because it made all of them - from Trump to his media cheerleaders - look really, really bad. And when Trump wouldn't do that, they went onto TV in the evening and told a totally different story to their viewers. This is media conspiracy and dishonesty as plain, ruthless and unethical as it gets. Shouldn't we be thinking a great deal more about that than we should about the "questions" Carlson is "asking"?
We know what Trump said. We know that what we were shown was selectively edited by the Left to look worse than it was and even then, it looked to fall far within the bounds of protected speech and far less incitement than what we see from people like Maxine Waters. So on the right, we're wondering why is anything Trump said or did still a topic?

EDIT: I just did some searching to find out what the Commission is talking about. From what I can tell, they've moved from accusing people of plotting the over-throw of the US Government, to outrage that Trump et. al. were telling people they thought the election the result of criminality and fraud.
 
Last edited:

gorfias

Unrealistic but happy
Legacy
May 13, 2009
7,453
2,022
118
Country
USA
What?
Who do you mean by 'we'? Your fellowTucker Carlson consumers?
If you're going to make claims, at least include a reference.
Well, partly. Though I am thinking I need to look into @Agema contention that Hannity did something wrong. I need links to read. Reviewing. Not a Hannity fan. Not watched his stuff but am interested.
 

Kwak

Elite Member
Sep 11, 2014
2,443
2,056
118
Country
4
Well where does the idea that Trump was "selectively edited by THE LEFT" even come from? A facebook comment?
 

bluegate

Elite Member
Legacy
Dec 28, 2010
2,424
1,033
118
Well where does the idea that Trump was "selectively edited by THE LEFT" even come from? A facebook comment?
I think they might be referring to the live footage of the insurrection as shown on tv that day.

Don't you know? It was a peaceful protest, can't focus on the few hundred breaking in and wrecking the place, gotta focus on the fat saps that couldn't carry their lard ass up the stairs that were left standing outside.
 

Agema

Overhead a rainbow appears... in black and white
Legacy
Mar 3, 2009
9,917
7,080
118
We know what Trump said. We know that what we were shown was selectively edited by the Left to look worse than it was and even then, it looked to fall far within the bounds of protected speech and far less incitement than what we see from people like Maxine Waters. So on the right, we're wondering why is anything Trump said or did still a topic?
One might reasonably question quote mining specific sentences from Trump's speech. On the other hand, from a holistic view not just of the day but the preceding weeks and months, Donald Trump had plainly been winding up and agitating supporters - many known to be physically activist. At the point you deliver a speech to such people and direct them at a target to vent their anger and fear, there will be trouble. This is the sort of thing a competent president should be expected to understand.

I could pass this off as mere incompetence. However, what is absolutely unforgivable is his refusal to assist dealing with the mob or talk them down when things went wrong. He did: but very late and very weakly. I cannot believe that a US president who wasn't malevolent could just sit there watching on TV a mob assaulting the Capitol and refuse all entreaties to intervene.
 

gorfias

Unrealistic but happy
Legacy
May 13, 2009
7,453
2,022
118
Country
USA
One might reasonably question quote mining specific sentences from Trump's speech. On the other hand, from a holistic view not just of the day but the preceding weeks and months, Donald Trump had plainly been winding up and agitating supporters - many known to be physically activist. At the point you deliver a speech to such people and direct them at a target to vent their anger and fear, there will be trouble. This is the sort of thing a competent president should be expected to understand.

I could pass this off as mere incompetence. However, what is absolutely unforgivable is his refusal to assist dealing with the mob or talk them down when things went wrong. He did: but very late and very weakly. I cannot believe that a US president who wasn't malevolent could just sit there watching on TV a mob assaulting the Capitol and refuse all entreaties to intervene.
I'll do some looking into the Hannity stuff you referenced. If you have any links, please forward them to me. While it may not lead me to think he did something illegal, it could add to my growing unease about him. You had pointed out that the great economy we had under him may have just been a house of cards he knew was about to collapse. He had plans to get us out of Afghanistan... but left them un-executed during his 1st term. Etc. Thanks.

EDIT: Reviewing https://www.thedailybeast.com/fox-n...xcuses-for-bombshell-jan-6-capitol-riot-texts
 

Hades

Elite Member
Mar 8, 2013
2,649
2,031
118
Country
The Netherlands
We know what Trump said. We know that what we were shown was selectively edited by the Left to look worse than it was and even then, it looked to fall far within the bounds of protected speech and far less incitement than what we see from people like Maxine Waters. So on the right, we're wondering why is anything Trump said or did still a topic?
Phrases like ''You don't give in when there's theft involved'' or ''fight like hell because otherwise you don't have a country anymore'' need no additional help to look as the worst things possible.

The very idea Trump speaks of ''theft'' when he loses an election is already downright unacceptable. Him then urging his supporters to never give up the fight against this election result and warning that the country will be destroyed if they give up only makes it worse. That Trump openly considers his defeat a ''theft'' already shows that he despises democracy and that he has no intention to maintain it or adhere to it. The left doesn't need to do anything for it to reflect horribly on Trump.
 

Silvanus

Elite Member
Legacy
Jan 15, 2013
13,054
6,748
118
Country
United Kingdom
I don't think so. The oligarchs of whom I write seem to despise him. Though he is accused by some of his disillusioned followers as being solicitous to them once in power. He seemed, for some, to want to dance with those that did not bring him.
Really? Big business bankrolls both parties, but it also bankrolls the Republicans to a much greater degree, including during Trump's tenure. He was in hock to ruinous fossil fuel interests throughout his time in office. Oligarchic interests sided with him every step of the way, and he returned the favour through a big-business-centric legislative agenda.

Why do you think the tax cuts went to the monied interests and the uber-wealthy? Why do you think he cut workplace protections for employees? Or gave the go-ahead for destructive and unnecessary oil and gas projects? And why do you think the massive corporations and uber-wealthy supported him over both Clinton and Biden?

The answer, as it almost always is, is money.
 

Agema

Overhead a rainbow appears... in black and white
Legacy
Mar 3, 2009
9,917
7,080
118
I'll do some looking into the Hannity stuff you referenced. If you have any links, please forward them to me. While it may not lead me to think he did something illegal, it could add to my growing unease about him. You had pointed out that the great economy we had under him may have just been a house of cards he knew was about to collapse. He had plans to get us out of Afghanistan... but left them un-executed during his 1st term. Etc. Thanks.

Hannity's text to Mark Meadows read "Can he make a statement? Ask people to leave the Capitol." Ingraham's said "Mark, the president needs to tell people in the Capitol to go home. This is hurting all of us. He is destroying his legacy."

Now, firstly, even though Hannity and Ingraham were providing good advice - not just for Trump himself but the principle of social order - I have to very seriously ask what sort of "news media" sends personal advice to the White House. At minimum, it indicates a total absence of journalistic objectivity. Next, if they are sending texts to Trump's staff begging them to get Trump to make a statement to convince those supporters to back down, it means they know he should be intervening, and those people are his supporters.

Then Hannity goes on air and makes no comment about Trump's failure to intervene, which he privately must have been concerned about. He condemns the violence, but then makes statements like "Those who truly support President Trump, those that believe they are part of the conservative movement in this country, you do not — we do not support those who commit acts of violence", and "I don't care if the radical left, radical right — I don't know who they are." Yes he does know who they are, and that they are supporters of Trump. Ingraham takes a similar line: "Now, they were likely not all Trump supporters, and there are some reports that antifa sympathizers may have been sprinkled throughout the crowd." These are weasel words. There are reports? Whose reports? Who's done any meaningful checks on whether they are remotely reliable? This is, bluntly, a lie couched in just enough plausible deniability. (That that segment was removed from Fox the day after speaks volumes.) She too does not voice any potential criticism of Trump that she held in private. They instantly moved to deflect and cover for Trump, and the texts expose a core disparity between what they must have believed and what they reported.

Hannity, Kilmeade and Ingraham have of course complained about the release of the texts. I would point out that the idea of journalists - who routinely reveal other people's private communications when they get hold of them - complaining about their privacy when they have their texts unexpectedly subjected to public exposure stinks to high heaven of a "one rule for us another for you" mentality.
 

Trunkage

Nascent Orca
Legacy
Jun 21, 2012
9,370
3,163
118
Brisbane
Gender
Cyborg
Well where does the idea that Trump was "selectively edited by THE LEFT" even come from? A facebook comment?
The MSM are the left in some people's eyes... despite the MSM being pretty anti-Left. Like CRT, anything fits into those terms

I'd point out that all of Trump's media engagements were edited. By all media companies. Its normal. This can be done to drive a narrative and it's necessary to watch for these narratives

Also, I recognize that a lot of the editing that are done by CNN and MSNBC were making look Trump look BETTER than his full speeches. Not worse. But, of course, any changes can be classed as bad
 

Trunkage

Nascent Orca
Legacy
Jun 21, 2012
9,370
3,163
118
Brisbane
Gender
Cyborg

Hannity's text to Mark Meadows read "Can he make a statement? Ask people to leave the Capitol." Ingraham's said "Mark, the president needs to tell people in the Capitol to go home. This is hurting all of us. He is destroying his legacy."

Now, firstly, even though Hannity and Ingraham were providing good advice - not just for Trump himself but the principle of social order - I have to very seriously ask what sort of "news media" sends personal advice to the White House. At minimum, it indicates a total absence of journalistic objectivity. Next, if they are sending texts to Trump's staff begging them to get Trump to make a statement to convince those supporters to back down, it means they know he should be intervening, and those people are his supporters.

Then Hannity goes on air and makes no comment about Trump's failure to intervene, which he privately must have been concerned about. He condemns the violence, but then makes statements like "Those who truly support President Trump, those that believe they are part of the conservative movement in this country, you do not — we do not support those who commit acts of violence", and "I don't care if the radical left, radical right — I don't know who they are." Yes he does know who they are, and that they are supporters of Trump. Ingraham takes a similar line: "Now, they were likely not all Trump supporters, and there are some reports that antifa sympathizers may have been sprinkled throughout the crowd." These are weasel words. There are reports? Whose reports? Who's done any meaningful checks on whether they are remotely reliable? This is, bluntly, a lie couched in just enough plausible deniability. (That that segment was removed from Fox the day after speaks volumes.) She too does not voice any potential criticism of Trump that she held in private. They instantly moved to deflect and cover for Trump, and the texts expose a core disparity between what they must have believed and what they reported.

Hannity, Kilmeade and Ingraham have of course complained about the release of the texts. I would point out that the idea of journalists - who routinely reveal other people's private communications when they get hold of them - complaining about their privacy when they have their texts unexpectedly subjected to public exposure stinks to high heaven of a "one rule for us another for you" mentality.
Remember Chris Cuomo losing his job over something similar
 
  • Like
Reactions: BrawlMan

XsjadoBlayde

~ just another dread messenger & artisanal kunt ~
Apr 29, 2020
3,702
3,824
118

Of course he would, like any guilty tosser avoiding responsibility every way they can. Maybe we all should try the same tactic with court obligations too.

What Perry's saying 👇

Rejected: Rep. Scott Perry (R-Pa.), a central figure in Donald Trump’s effort to weaponize the Justice Department in support of his false election fraud claims, is refusing to cooperate with the Jan. 6 select committee.

It was a swift move: Perry rejected an interview request from the panel on Tuesday, a day after the committee asked him to appear voluntarily. It sets up a potentially unprecedented confrontation between the committee and a fellow member of the House.

The backstory: The select panel sent Perry, the recently elected chair of the ultra-conservative House Freedom Caucus, a letter Monday evening asking for an interview and documents related to its inquiry into Jan. 6 and Trump’s efforts to pressure the Department of Justice to intervene in the 2020 election.

The evidence: Panel chair Bennie Thompson (D-Miss.) said in a letter to Perry they had uncovered evidence linking the Pennsylvania Republican to the meddling at the Department of Justice as well as texts and communications — including over the encrypted app Signal — with then-White House chief of staff Mark Meadows. The panel also said it had evidence of Perry’s communications with the White House and others involved with conspiracy theories about voting machines made by Dominion.
“I decline this entity’s request and will continue to fight the failures of the radical Left who desperately seek distraction from their abject failures of crushing inflation, a humiliating surrender in Afghanistan, and the horrendous crisis they created at our border.”
— Rep. Scott Perry (R-Pa.) in a statement
Here's Perry:


To be clear:
Despite legal challenges to the committee’s legitimacy, federal courts have repeatedly found the panel to be duly authorized and pursuing a legitimate legislative goal.

A spokesperson for the committee did not immediately respond to a request for comment.
Also, to be taken with as many pinches of salt deemed sufficient;

 
  • Like
Reactions: BrawlMan

Trunkage

Nascent Orca
Legacy
Jun 21, 2012
9,370
3,163
118
Brisbane
Gender
Cyborg
I just want to give an update. Last night I took my kids to an enchanted garden thing in the city's botanic gardens. We had to be double vaxxed but hardly anyone was wearing mask. We entered with a couple of hundred and I never saw any of them once and we mingled with the other people already there. Probably a few thousand there at a time and it went for hours.

It real bad in the most lockdowned country of the world. Please save us Fox

Edit: Just realised this was in the wrong thread
 
Last edited:

Chimpzy

Simian Abomination
Legacy
Escapist +
Apr 3, 2020
13,637
10,405
118
The game will continue so long as it remains eminently lucrative.
 

XsjadoBlayde

~ just another dread messenger & artisanal kunt ~
Apr 29, 2020
3,702
3,824
118

Hope this blatant dishonest strategy blows up in their decaying bloated faces

Michael Flynn, Donald Trump’s former national security adviser, is suing to prevent the Jan. 6 select committee from enforcing a subpoena for his testimony and documents, claiming it could violate multiple privileges, including his Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination, by forcing him to disclose evidence related to multiple ongoing criminal matters.

In a lawsuit filed Tuesday in a federal district court in Florida, Flynn indicated that he had been in extensive talks with the Jan. 6 committee to negotiate terms of testimony. He said he had hired a vendor “to collect and process General Flynn’s documents, which it did, so that they could be preserved, reviewed and produced to the Select Committee.”

But those talks broke down as Flynn attempted to narrow the topics he would discuss. “Although the Committee agreed to postpone General Flynn’s deposition to December 20, 2021, it would not agree to clarify or prioritize the Subpoena’s requests,” his attorney, Matthew Sarelson, said in the 42-page lawsuit.

Flynn ultimately informed the committee on Monday that he would sue in order to prevent the panel from enforcing its subpoena and holding him in criminal contempt.

“[T]here appeared to be no prospect these issues would be resolved absent the intervention of a court, and that General Flynn would seek the Court’s protection,” Sarelson wrote. “Committee counsel responded that the Committee’s preference would be for General Flynn to invoke his 5th Amendment privilege before the Committee, even if it was effectively the only thing he could do, and that the Committee could refer General Flynn for prosecution for contempt of Congress for not doing so.”

Sarelson also indicated that Flynn believes the committee is preparing to subpoena phone records “pertaining to General Flynn and his family.”

Flynn is a crucial target of the Jan. 6 committee’s investigation. He attended a Dec. 18, 2020, meeting in the Oval Office with Trump during which Flynn reportedly discussed deploying the military to seize voting machines in service of Trump’s effort to stave off defeat. That conversation came amid increasing indications that Trump was considering invoking the Insurrection Act amid his effort to remain in power.

Trump ultimately opted against taking that step, but many of those who violently attacked the Capitol anticipated he would, and cited this possibility as part of their calculus in participating in the riot.

Flynn’s lawsuit is the latest in a cascade of litigation by targets of the select committee’s investigation. Former White House chief of staff Mark Meadows, attorney John Eastman, attorney Cleta Mitchell, pro-Trump broadcaster Alex Jones and Stop the Steal organizer Ali Alexander have all recently filed suit in Washington to prevent the select committee from subpoenaing their testimony or phone records. Several organizers of the Jan. 6 rally that preceded the attack on the Capitol have filed suit in New Jersey to block the panel from obtaining their phone records. And a freelance photojournalist, Amy Harris, has sued to block a subpoena for phone records as well, contending the panel’s demand could expose sources.

The House has also referred Meadows for criminal contempt of Congress, awaiting a potential charge by the Justice Department for his refusal to appear for a deposition. And Steve Bannon, another longtime Trump ally, has been indicted for refusing to appear as well.

Flynn’s lawsuit echoes many of the others by claiming that the Jan. 6 committee is illegitimate because it includes no members appointed by House Minority Leader Kevin McCarthy, despite requirements that the panel consult with the minority party when making decisions like issuing subpoenas. McCarthy withdrew all GOP members from the panel after Speaker Nancy Pelosi vetoed the participation of two — Reps. Jim Banks (R-Ind.) and Jim Jordan (R-Ohio) — an unprecedented step she said reflected concerns about their willingness to conduct a serious investigation.

“[T]he Select Committee as it currently stands—and stood at the time it issued the subpoenas in question—has no authority to conduct business because it is not a duly constituted Select Committee,” Flynn’s attorneys wrote.

Flynn also contended that the panel lacks a valid “legislative purpose,” though the committee emphasizes that its goal is to produce legislation aimed at preventing future attacks against democracy, reforming election-related laws and combating domestic extremism, among other goals. A federal appeals court in Washington recently upheld the committee’s legislative purpose, though Flynn’s suit was filed in a district court outside that panel’s jurisdiction.

The former Trump national security adviser argued that his Fifth Amendment concerns arise for two reasons: the Justice Department’s ongoing investigation into the Jan. 6 attack on the Capitol and a newly reported investigation into “a political nonprofit with which General Flynn was briefly affiliated.” Prosecutors reportedly subpoenaed the nonprofit, Defending the Republic, last month. It’s run by Sidney Powell, a Trump ally who was with Flynn in the Oval Office on Dec. 18 and represented him during his effort to unravel a guilty plea for lying to federal investigators in 2017.

“The Select Committee is rushing to refer any non-cooperative witnesses for criminal prosecution by the Department of Justice for contempt of Congress,” Sarelson wrote. “Thus, General Flynn is caught between alternatives that both risk criminal prosecution by the Department of Justice, either in an ongoing criminal probe, or in a new prosecution for contempt of Congress.”
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: BrawlMan

Agema

Overhead a rainbow appears... in black and white
Legacy
Mar 3, 2009
9,917
7,080
118
The game will continue so long as it remains eminently lucrative.
And it is. See:

Those debts we thought might trouble Trump? Hey, why should he worry when he can secure huge sums for a dodgy investment portfolio? I mean, he's got an iffy career as businessman, no record whatsoever in the tech industry, but for some reason this thing has been estimated to be worth $10 billion.

Although of course we don't actually know how much Trump owns. Trump Media and Technology Group (an organisation which has so far, from what I can see, promised much but achieved nothing) is apparently being merged into a special purpose acquisitions company (SPAC). If we assume that the merged group is run by actual experts with Trump as little more than name and figurehead, it might not be a total bust: but if that's the case, it's doubtful Trump will own a huge part of it either, because the money is coming from the SPAC not TMTG.

What's not a good sign for expertise is that Devin Nunes, Congressional Trump crony, is resigning from politics to become CEO. He will therefore have achieved what many set out in politics to do: springboard themselves into a fat corporate salary. Trump does love his loyal subjects, although it's extremely unclear to me whether you'd want a guy with little significant business experience running that big a company. Nunes does have a business degree, and ran a farm or something. But, you know...

I suspect what this can do is what Trump loves doing: conning rubes. Those rubes will be his supporters. They can dutifiully pour their dollars into this corporation in the believe it will fight the good fight against the biased liberal left media. The corporation can pay its shareholders big fat dividends, and its execs big fat salaries, and with lots of investment it can rumble on for years, allowing them to strip out money into their pockets irrespective of whether it ever produces any value. If the gig looks like it will be up, they can cash out and leave the losses for the rubes.
 
  • Like
Reactions: BrawlMan