A friendship set in virtual stone.

[cleverlymadeup]

There are alot of adjectives that can be used to describe me, but im not a knob IRL. Thankyou for using such a tempered tone & eloquent choice of words to make your point though

sometimes in order to gain ppl's full attention and get them to realize things you need to hit them with a sledgehammer or something like that

Ive spent about two hours on & off dwelling on my response to why I take the standpoint I do on this subject. & having written & deleted several thousand words I can simply say I dont really know how to put it in writing. The best I can come up with is that I view the "internet world" & my interactions with the people in it & the "real world" as somehow seperate plains. Consequently I do believe that someone can act one way online & that not necessarily reflect their character irl. However, being a simple soul, Im not convinced I can maintain this seperation when I know both the rl & internet personas of a person & maintain distinctions between the two. Likewise I dont like the feeling of someone knowing me irl engaging in internet dialogue with one of my internet personas, because I know that they know the person behind the name, & I dont feel comfortable with that.

now this i don't honestly know where to start, i'd almost have to call my friend who just finished doing her psychology degree. but i'll give it the good old college try

1 if you feel the need to act one way one place and another, somewhere else, you have an issue with your own personality. ie you don't like how you have to act around ppl or treat them but when you're online you have the freedom to do so

2 no matter how much you think it doesn't reflect your character irl, it DOES and the fact you try and play off you are different irl than on the net, speaks even more about your character, namely you are less than honest and probly not a very good person deep down

3 you do feel guilty about how you act on the net, ie how feel about someone irl interacting with one of your persona's

4 you aren't happy with who you are as a person or an aspect of your life so you create other persona to make up for that unhappiness

5 this really struck a chord with you if you had to mull it over for a while and try to figure out what to say

i know it can seem harsh, having to look at yourself and analyze what you're doing isn't always the easiest thing in the world. i can discern a lot by what you typed and how you said it, you may try and hide things but really the true you will come thru.

 

[Saskwach]

I have a weird thing with friends on the internet, because I'm constantly being brainwashed with 'people on the internet are bad' and I don't feel I can trust them.

funnily enough it's ppl you know in person that will cause more harm to you than anyone else, most murderers kill friends and family members, most rapists rape their gf or family members

crime stats are a wonderful thing, that's why most cops ask you "how did the victim know the person?" when stuff happens

While I don't dispute that claim I think that using such a statistic to justify befriending everyone who comes along. I suspect that stat holds true because when confronted by a guy who gives them the heebiejeebies people will run. This way they're cutting down the odds of Mr Axe Murderer in Training killing them, but the odds of friends or loved ones killing them has stayed the same. Since everyone does this the statistics get skewed towards people we know.
tl;dr: that stat works because people make it work.

Now, speaking of internet friends, I can't say I see net users as objects; I'm always wondering what motivates them, what it would belike living where they do and so on. Still, it takes a net friend a much longer time to get the same attachment I give to RL friends because I've had much greater experience with them. Words and games don't contend with words and games and talking and movies and drinking and...

 

[Fire Daemon]

Just to clarify: The people on my friends list where friends that I made during my time spent with Gears of War. Me, my mate and one of his brothers will all play Gears of War with 5 other people from our list and because of this our friendlists are nearly the same. However when I moved on from Gears of war we stopped playing toghether, I stopped remembering who they where and why I put them on my list anyway. They are strangers to me which is why I stopped seeing them as people and started seeing them as objects.

I still have around 80 friends on Xboxlive but to be honest I could take that down to ten and still not feel happy with it. Maybe I shouldn't have accepted every friend invite I have been given?

 

[mshcherbatskaya]

I don't use Facebook and Myspace, but I've had a LiveJournal for about 7 years, and there are people I met there who have become genuine friends in real life, hung out, visited, had dinner together. I'd do that with more of them, but geographical distance is a problem.

 

[cleverlymadeup]

I still have around 80 friends on Xboxlive but to be honest I could take that down to ten and still not feel happy with it. Maybe I shouldn't have accepted every friend invite I have been given?

i'd say probly not, i don't always send out friend requests cause i've played with someone once, it's usually several times or more

ppl have this habit of always adding you and such cause you played with them once, my lists are usually ppl i play with lots, clan/guild mates or ppl i know irl

@Saskwatch no don't befriend everyone but don't say one group is less trustworthy than the other. it's one of those FUD statements that gets spread around so ppl think it's true, you know cause they're brother's friend's sister's friend's cousin's nephew's uncle's former roommate got raped by some dude she met off the net or so they heard

 

[Saskwach]

@Saskwatch no don't befriend everyone but don't say one group is less trustworthy than the other. it's one of those FUD statements that gets spread around so ppl think it's true, you know cause they're brother's friend's sister's friend's cousin's nephew's uncle's former roommate got raped by some dude she met off the net or so they heard

You have a point then.

 

[cleverlymadeup]

You have a point then.

thanx, funnily enough tho sometimes misinterpret that "axe murderer" look. paul bernardo was one great example of that, he looked like a nice clean cut guy but to say he was a sick freak is an understatement and a half

so as the saying goes appearances can be decieving

 

[CodeChrono]

I've found several friends over other forums, and I talk with them via MSN on a regular basis. Although this is mostly in discussions on creating AMV's or discussing MEP coordination. Or perhaps beta testing a video. But it's still fun. :O

 

[Seldon2639]

It depends. Obviously, if you're on WoW, you're more likely to find someone who also likes the game, and with whom you thus share an interest. For me, it's less about what someone likes than the content of ones character. In addition to liking people who are different from me (since otherwise I may as well talk to myself), I get along best with people who are good (neutral good at least, though I tend to go for lawful good).

Obviously that doesn't directly help, sorry. I dislike the use of the word "friend" on Xbox live, or facebook, or most other online areas. It's not really friendship if you played a couple games with someone, or shared a class Freshman year. I'd define those as acquaintances, especially on xbox live, since the entire point of that system is to find people with whom to play. I see it as the difference between people with whom you'd hang out, and people you really care about. It's a little esoteric, I know, and not really relevant, but I digress.

 

[Cousin_IT]

There are alot of adjectives that can be used to describe me, but im not a knob IRL. Thankyou for using such a tempered tone & eloquent choice of words to make your point though

sometimes in order to gain ppl's full attention and get them to realize things you need to hit them with a sledgehammer or something like that

Ive spent about two hours on & off dwelling on my response to why I take the standpoint I do on this subject. & having written & deleted several thousand words I can simply say I dont really know how to put it in writing. The best I can come up with is that I view the "internet world" & my interactions with the people in it & the "real world" as somehow seperate plains. Consequently I do believe that someone can act one way online & that not necessarily reflect their character irl. However, being a simple soul, Im not convinced I can maintain this seperation when I know both the rl & internet personas of a person & maintain distinctions between the two. Likewise I dont like the feeling of someone knowing me irl engaging in internet dialogue with one of my internet personas, because I know that they know the person behind the name, & I dont feel comfortable with that.

now this i don't honestly know where to start, i'd almost have to call my friend who just finished doing her psychology degree. but i'll give it the good old college try

1 if you feel the need to act one way one place and another, somewhere else, you have an issue with your own personality. ie you don't like how you have to act around ppl or treat them but when you're online you have the freedom to do so

I dont act especially differently on "teh interwebz" & irl. But I do take comfort thinking that what happens in one doesnt spill out into the other. For instance, If I were to decide to rob a corp blind in EVE, perfectly within the rules of the game, I can take comfort knowing that Im not going to have some pissed off corpmate throw a brick through my window. Now I have never done this because I dont want to, but in an online environment where the rules are different I just find it better to keep anything that can drag rl into it best left outside.

2 no matter how much you think it doesn't reflect your character irl, it DOES and the fact you try and play off you are different irl than on the net, speaks even more about your character, namely you are less than honest and probly not a very good person deep down

I think you take the internet too seriously. But like I said, I dont act paticularly differently on the web & irl. But I do use them for different things which I have no desire to see merge.

3 you do feel guilty about how you act on the net, ie how feel about someone irl interacting with one of your persona's

I dont feel guilty about the consequences of my actions because I dont set out to cause any & am completely oblivious to how people respond irl to my words/actions on the net. I like it that way, its easier.

4 you aren't happy with who you are as a person or an aspect of your life so you create other persona to make up for that unhappiness

I use different pseudonym's on the web for different things so I can control the fallout from each. I use Cousin_IT for some forums, I use other screenames for other forums & other names again for games. Now, if for whatever reason I grow tired of using one forum/game for whatever reason, I can simply click the quit button & break off all connection with it like that. That simplicity is what I like about interactions with the internet. I dont want it to be as complicated as rl gets so I keep my rl out of it & ensure that as far as the other people using the forum/chat/game are concerned, I only exist relative to it.

5 this really struck a chord with you if you had to mull it over for a while and try to figure out what to say

A response was asked for & I took the time to give it in as clear & well written style as I could that I was happy with. Unfortunately, what I wrote seems to have sent you off on an unintended psychobabble tangent, so clearly I failed to get my admittedly unclear point across in a satisfactory mannor. But that is precisely why I like the internet for discussions l;ike this. I can sit back & take the time to consider something. I dont have someone sat next to me twiddling their thumbs waiting for a reply to kill the silence. I use forums for precisely that purpose, having more indepth discussions about subjects I would be unable to irl & frankly would not want to irl because of the different enviroments the two are.

i know it can seem harsh, having to look at yourself and analyze what you're doing isn't always the easiest thing in the world. i can discern a lot by what you typed and how you said it, you may try and hide things but really the true you will come thru.

I dont deny that I am more or less the same personality on the internet & irl. I do think you are reading into this far more than you need to, however. I just like the fun & the easyness of the internets detachment from reality. I like that when someone says something stupid on the web I can vent my frustration at their screenname/avatar rather than the actual person behind it & vice versa. I like that I can have long & well thought out discussions about things that I cant & probably wouldnt want to have irl. & I like that I can use MMOs as escapism & entertainment, something I can switch off without hesitation should I need to, not an extention of my reality. I like playing games with other people who like playing that game, but I have no need or desire to extend the relationship beyond the game. I like knowing that as well as I get on with someone over the web ultimately they & I are just a screenname & lines of text to eachother, & should I lose/braek contact with someone then thats the end of it, none of the messy social consequences that occur irl. Its not about split personality disorder (which I seem to have given the mistaken impression of), its just my preference for a more relaxed interaction with "the internet," where I dont feel the social pressures or moral/ethical obligations of rl pressing on my shoulders. Thats why I keep them seperate & try to maintain that seperation (even if the actual seperation only exists in my head).

& that is where my input on this topic ends. I have now layed out my position to the best of my abilities & see no need for further conribution. If cleverlymadeup or anyone else wish to rip my points apart feel free to. But I see in CMU's case even if I did make myself perfectly clear you would continue to attck both my pov & myself in the process over what is clearly just as an important subject to you as your claimed it is for me. I dont begrudge anyone for making meaningful friendships out of games/the web, frankly I dont really care. I simply choose to try & not to for my own reasons, as opaque as they may be.

 

[PurpleRain]

Apparently it's a bad thing to delet people on MSN. I have no idea why. I did it to a few people I don't talk to and they got right up me.

 

[GrowlersAtSea]

"Friends" I think is thrown around far too commonly in online settings, it seems more of a generalization for friends, acquaintances , friends of friends, and just about everyone else you might know about and are not the sworn enemy of.

I'll look at my friends list in a game like Battlefield or even Steam and see players that I play with or know I can rely on in game. But that's the thing, I see players, not people. I don't, as whole, know these people, many I don't even know their general age, sex, country, or anything at all about them, other than I like how they play and it probably compliments my own style. Usually the ones I know most about are those who use voice communication, and even then it just gives some general idea. Interestingly, when I think about it, I don't think I've ever played multiple games with a single person. When I tire of a game I usually just wander off, so the people I play with I never see/hear from again. I have had outside game contact with some people (usually on forums related to the game, then played with subsequently) but never have really talked with beyond that.

So even though they're referred to as friends, you don't really discard a real friend like that. So they're more of just acquaintances, if even that.

I don't participate in various social networking sites and such, so don't have or have any opinions really of people who do. I do love posting on forums though, and have ended conversing over instant messenger services with people I've posted with on forums after a while. Usually it's just people who on a particular forum I find myself replying to a lot and often getting into back-and-forth conversations with, it seems more efficient to talk with them in real time rather than remain on a forum.

I have trouble considering most of these people friends though as well. Since even though we usually know a fair about one another and share interests, it's much more dry than a friendship with a person I actually know. There are exceptions, I have genuinely cared about some people I've talked to, and I do feel like I know and that they are indeed good people. As a whole though, like the people in games I consider being just players, people I talk with often seem more like conversationalists. Or common thread isn't a game, it's communicating, but it often doesn't feel any more personal.

Where I am concerned though is that most people I don't really know how they feel about the whole issue. Some people put far more weight in things than others, and the thought that someone I may have played with a bunch then stopped thought we were actual friends who I just kind of discarded and moved on weighs on me at times. But I guess would venture to say most relationships of people are founded on misunderstandings, since I doubt anyone really lays out the terms and their views on various relationships before even really associating with someone.

 

[Anarchemitis]

I have in total on Youtube, Xfire, MSN and in Email like 40 friends. This is beacause I only befriend those who actually are friends. Save for Youtube, I only have like 2 real ones there.

 

[John Galt]

I seldom send out friend requests to people I don't know in real life. My xbox live friend list is an elite dozen or so of people I've either known for years or play with frequently. On social networking sites, I'm baffled as to how people can have hundreds of friends when it is logistically impossible to keep track of and communicate with them.

 

[MattyDienhoff]

I agree that the definition of the word 'friend' is used very loosely in the context of the internet. I generally only keep someone on my list if I actually talk to them on a fairly regular basis.

Also, I have about 60 contacts, on MSN, Xfire and Steam, but I only consider about one third of those to be friends. The rest are either:

1) Acquaintances, people I haven't taken the time to get to know better, yet.
or
2) Staff, forum members, modders I'm associated with in some way, etc. these are somewhat analogous to business contacts, I don't really consider them to be friends, per se, but we have some kind of common interest.

 

[Duck Sandwich]

I generally have few friends. While I have 20 ish friends on Facebook, only 5 of those I would consider to be good friends whom I've known for a while and would hang out with on a regular basis if I could. 4 or so people I don't talk to, not in real life nor on Facebook. The rest are acquaintances.

Over the internet, I've only met 1 person who I would have liked to meet in real life. However, due to shit happening (he left the forum that we went to, and he doesn't have MSN), the chances we'll ever talk to each other again are quite low.

As for the whole "keeping real life and internet seperate", I generally act and talk the same way I do in real life. Just because people are behind a computer screen, doesn't make them any less real. And anyone I know in real life would recognize me just by my user name alone.