A Mass Effect 3 thread with some good news.

[boag]

That's cool, to bad they can't retroactively add that to ME1 and ME2.

Especially because high charm/renegade is the only way to get the non-depressing outcomes in both games. I'd argue that Mr Weekes is talking tales;

We intended many of those Charms to be fun Easter eggs, but many players felt like they had to play pure Paragon to avoid being penalized by the loss of a dialog option.

Then why couldn't I stop Miranda and Jack or Legion and Tali from fighting otherwise?!? Why couldn't I save Wrex any other way!? (actually, if memory serves, there was another way...)

If you get his family heirloom as part of his loyalty mission, or if you don't recruit Garrus.

If you don't recruit Garrus? How does that work? To be honest, I've never not recruited one of them before.

You dont look for him to learn about Fist, you use Varla Bon, and when he eventually asks you if he can join, you just say "No"

 

[Zydrate]

Well, well thats the consequence of being a filthy Neutral

Uh. Being in-between with some choices isn't exactly "neutral" :/

 

[RedEyesBlackGamer]

That's cool, to bad they can't retroactively add that to ME1 and ME2.

Especially because high charm/renegade is the only way to get the non-depressing outcomes in both games. I'd argue that Mr Weekes is talking tales;

We intended many of those Charms to be fun Easter eggs, but many players felt like they had to play pure Paragon to avoid being penalized by the loss of a dialog option.

Then why couldn't I stop Miranda and Jack or Legion and Tali from fighting otherwise?!? Why couldn't I save Wrex any other way!? (actually, if memory serves, there was another way...)

If you get his family heirloom as part of his loyalty mission, or if you don't recruit Garrus.

If you don't recruit Garrus? How does that work? To be honest, I've never not recruited one of them before.

From the wiki:

The conversation shifts to Shepard, Ashley, and Kaidan where they discuss Wrex and Ashley says that she is always ready for anything. Go over and talk to Wrex and if you keep the conversation going for too long either Shepard or Ashley kills Wrex. If you have completed Wrex: Family Armor, you can use that to get Wrex to listen because he can trust that Shepard is acting in the best interests of the galaxy. You can also use Paragon or Renegade options to persuade the krogan. However if you have less than four squadmates, no Garrus or Liara, then Wrex will submit without argument. It is better to keep him alive because he is a powerful ally.

The easiest non-persuade option way is to do his loyalty mission.

 

[boag]

Well, well thats the consequence of being a filthy Neutral

Uh. Being in-between with some choices isn't exactly "neutral" :/

Thats what filthy neutral would say

 

[Shock and Awe]

Excellent, that was definitely one of my issues with the last one, it really broke the immersion when a man who literally saved the galaxy and killed thousands of geth and other baddies can't intimidate one stupid merc.

 

[Bara_no_Hime]

That's cool, to bad they can't retroactively add that to ME1 and ME2.

I thought that as well. It is going to make playing the first two a bit unsatisfying after having this luxury in 3.

Actually, this is sort of how I always played my Paragon Shep.

If there was a Paragon and a Renegade option, she'd (almost) always go Paragon. If the dialogue didn't move on after that, I'd sometimes also choose Renegade (usually just for a couple of points).

If there was only a Renegade option... she's go Renegade.

In ME2, I'd always take all interrupts, both Paragon and Renegade.

Generally, I'd still max out my paragon side before the end, and have a fair amount of Renegade as well.

My Shep came off as Paragon with a temper (ie she's go by the rules until she got bored or frustrated, at which point she'd get grumpy).

This was particularly hilarious when talking to Miranda about her loyalty mission. There was no paragon option - only a neutral option to accept the quest, and a renegade option to tell her to fuck off. Watching her react to me basically saying that she and her sister could go die in a fire for all I cared was fucking hilarious. ^^

I don't much like Miranda, if you couldn't guess.

 

[RedEyesBlackGamer]

That's cool, to bad they can't retroactively add that to ME1 and ME2.

I thought that as well. It is going to make playing the first two a bit unsatisfying after having this luxury in 3.

Actually, this is sort of how I always played my Paragon Shep.

If there was a Paragon and a Renegade option, she'd (almost) always go Paragon. If the dialogue didn't move on after that, I'd sometimes also choose Renegade (usually just for a couple of points).

If there was only a Renegade option... she's go Renegade.

In ME2, I'd always take all interrupts, both Paragon and Renegade.

Generally, I'd still max out my paragon side before the end, and have a fair amount of Renegade as well.

My Shep came off as Paragon with a temper (ie she's go by the rules until she got bored or frustrated, at which point she'd get grumpy).

This was particularly hilarious when talking to Miranda about her loyalty mission. There was no paragon option - only a neutral option to accept the quest, and a renegade option to tell her to fuck off. Watching her react to me basically saying that she and her sister could go die in a fire for all I cared was fucking hilarious. ^^

I don't much like Miranda, if you couldn't guess.

Oh, I hate her too. When she and Jack got into a fight, even though I had enough Paragon to talk them both down, I told Miranda to fuck off. Seriously, she was even more insufferable than usual during that exchange.

 

[ABLb0y]

I think it's impossible to complete Samara's loyalty mission unless you're fully renegade. One thing I don't understand, though: Why didn't Samara just cap her in the head whilst I kept her talking? Or, better yet, why couldn't I do it?

 

[boag]

I think it's impossible to complete Samara's loyalty mission unless you're fully renegade. One thing I don't understand, though: Why didn't Samara just cap her in the head whilst I kept her talking? Or, better yet, why couldn't I do it?

Sexy lust Field was in effect.

 

[Bara_no_Hime]

Oh, I hate her too. When she and Jack got into a fight, even though I had enough Paragon to talk them both down, I told Miranda to fuck off. Seriously, she was even more insufferable than usual during that exchange.

Heh.

Actually, I'm doing a speed replay of ME2 right now, because I needed to adjust some stuff (so that Wrex and the Rachnai Queen were alive) since, when I first played this character, I hadn't yet played ME1 and both Wrex and Rachnai Queen were vague concepts mentioned in a comic book rather than characters I actually cared about.

Anyway, because I need to get a 'perfect' playthrough starting at level 29 (I'm already level 30) in just a few days, I've decided not to bother with anything not absolutely necessary. No non-plot missions, no hammerhead, no Arrival, and I'm not even sure I'm going to bother with Shadow Broker (since isn't it auto canon anyway?).

I've already decided to skip Miranda's loyalty mission. If she dies - fuck her. If she lives, meh. The same goes for Zaiheed. Not sure about Jacob yet... I'll see if I have time.

Mordin, Grunt, and Jack are all already loyal, and I'm just about to do Garrus' loyalty mission. Then Tali's. And then I'll pick up Samara and Thrane and do theirs. Need to make sure Samara's loyal before doing the great Bug Walk at the end.

 

[The Pinray]

I love this. I hated the whole "I don't have enough asshole points so I can't say something." It was so stupid.

Also, this is a bit off topic, but have any of you seen the launch trailer yet? It's great.

[youtube=Y24JEqIMG-0

 

[Beryl77]

This is great news. I tend to be more Paragon but I still want to tell some idiot to fuck off or I shoot him or punch an annoying journalist but this always limited me and I ended up being the biggest saint the galaxy has ever seen.

I love this. I hated the whole "I don't have enough asshole points so I can't say something." It was so stupid.

Also, this is a bit off topic, but have any of you seen the launch trailer yet? It's great.

That's a really well made trailer. Got me excited for next week.

 

[Callate]

"Many" may have been easter eggs, but some were allegiance issues that could contribute to crew members dying,

Meh. The only good news I really want to hear is that they've come to their senses and offered a version sans Origin.

 

[ABLb0y]

I think it's impossible to complete Samara's loyalty mission unless you're fully renegade. One thing I don't understand, though: Why didn't Samara just cap her in the head whilst I kept her talking? Or, better yet, why couldn't I do it?

Sexy lust Field was in effect.

Oh, yeah, she's a succubus, isn't she?

 

[Vivace-Vivian]

This sort of sucks for me. I play as pure paragon, no deviation and like it that way. Might be harder to make sure I'm getting all the Para points.

 

[Knight Templar]

Sooo.... If you're just going to add the scores together, what the hell is the point? Whether you pick renegade or paragon, you-re going to have the same outcome. This is giving you less choice, not more.

You're going to have the same points, but obviously a renagade action and a paragon action are not the same. The only difference between this and the old system is that you don't have to play all blue or all red to persuade at higher levels.

Ok, then I have to ask, what is the point of the Morality system at all? In Kotor it affected what branches of the force you could get into, in ME it just seems tacked on and useless. Getting to punch some random lady in the mouth is nice and all (stay classy shep), but what the hell is the point if there aren't any consequences?

I'm, not sure you fully understand what the choices were supposed to be about in ME1/2.

You seem to be undere to false impression that the reason to make a paragon or renagade choice was not because you agreeed with the choice or thought it would cause certain consquences, but so that a little bar of red or blue would go up. This is not the case, you have fundamentaly missunderstood the system.
ME2 screwed up by forcing you to go all blue or all read, there wasn't any choice if you wanted to get a decent ending. Yet to you being forced into one line of choices is better than be able to role play.

The change in paragon or renagade point should be the least important thing in your mind when making a choice, not the sole reason you make any.

The choices have copnsquences, but they are meaningless if the meata system forces you to only ever be one side.

 

[bojac6]

Sooo.... If you're just going to add the scores together, what the hell is the point? Whether you pick renegade or paragon, you-re going to have the same outcome. This is giving you less choice, not more.

You're going to have the same points, but obviously a renagade action and a paragon action are not the same. The only difference between this and the old system is that you don't have to play all blue or all red to persuade at higher levels.

Ok, then I have to ask, what is the point of the Morality system at all? In Kotor it affected what branches of the force you could get into, in ME it just seems tacked on and useless. Getting to punch some random lady in the mouth is nice and all (stay classy shep), but what the hell is the point if there aren't any consequences?

Because the RP in RPG stands for role playing. Now people can create the Shepard with the personality that they always wanted without being punished.

So Role Playing means my character can do whatever she wants without there being any consequences? Frankly, I hate this change, because it removes the role play element. If your character has a reputation for breaking promises, why should you still have the dialogue option "You can trust me, I always keep my promises"? That should never work, because you're known as untrustworthy. That's why going on one path opened some options, and picking a different one opened up different options. How is that being punished? That's called a game mechanic that actually makes you think about what you're doing a make decisions.

Now it's all meaningless. I don't understand why so many people want to play games with conversations where they have to make decisions, but then get angry when the decisions they make actually have consequences in the playthrough of the game.

This isn't "Good vs. Evil" where it's the difference between kicking puppies and petting them

The Paragon and Renegade options in mass effect are more along the lines of "Idealism vs. Pragmatism"

Take the ending of ME2 for example. Paragon had you destroy it, since Reaper tech is bad. Renegade had you save it, since it would be useful to use against the Reapers.


These emotions can be mixed, and change depending on the situation.

Yes, I know all that. But I also know that just about every Renegade option in ME2 involved pulling a gun or punching somebody while every Paragon option involved preventing somebody else from committing an act of violence or a hug. My point still stands. If you've got a reputation for being the kind of person that pulls a gun on shop keepers, you're going to have a hard time convincing people that you're going to play nice this time.

These results cannot really be mixed. The point of the system is to establish how you've rolled played. Are you a Paragon of virtue, known everywhere as idealistic and just? Or are you known as a Renegade, somebody who does whatever it takes to get what they need? Yes, you, as a player, are allowed to mix it up, but the person known for being nonviolent and going out of their way to save innocents is going to have a lot harder time bluffing that they will kill everybody this time.

 

[NinjaDeathSlap]

It took them long enough.

My thoughts precisely, but I am happy all the same.

You see now EA, all the gratitude you can receive when you allow you developers to respond to feedback from players? I'm not saying you should turn to the fans for every single thing. God no, that would be disastrous, but a little bit of co-operation goes a long way.