about offending and or discriminating

[Caspertjuhh]

Sorry for the fail-title, but I can always use the excuse that english is not my home languague

Do you think it should be okay to offend people with things they, themselves can change?

Personally, I find this a hard question. I mean, is it okay to say someone is fat, just because they have it in control, or could change it?

Do you think you should be able to discriminate, for example, gingers/redheads, because they Can't change who they are.

Personally, I think you shouldn't (will still happen, but SHOULDN'T) offend redheads, but I am a bit unsure about fat people. I think they can change it, so you should be able to, at least more than redheads, to joke about them. what do you think?

^^ gingers and fat people are just examples... use any other if you want to.

 

[Lilani]

I think people who maliciously discriminate others for reasons they can't change are just as stupid and wrong as people who discriminate others for things they can't. Either way it's discrimination, and one is not more excusable than the other.

 

[Bobic]

I think it's wrong to insult fat people, regardless of whether they can change it. I do, however, find it hilarious.

 

[Jedamethis]

Well, I joke about everything, but as soon as something is offensive, you don't say it.
Though I do kind of agree, being mean to people about things they can't change is very bad, teasing them about things they can change isn't much better.

 

[Mr Montmorency]

If you're fat, yes. You're obviously a glutton and can't take care of yourself. Of course it's justified. If you can help it, I don't see the problem. If we treat everyone as if nothing is wrong, then nobody will have a reason to better themselves.

 

[seekeroftruth86]

You shouldn't judge a person based on something they can't change. Better scenario, you can judge them on something they've chosen to be.

A fat person may not have chosen to be that way, or maybe they have. A ginger, not at all, that's effectively a race, and racism is sooo last century.

So should you judge a fat person? If they want to be thin, but don't do anything to change it. Yes. If they don't want to be thin, why judge? It's their choice, no harm no foul. If it ends up killing them, Darwin was right.

So basically, judge people by their choices, not their circumstances. A certain choice doesn't make a person good or bad, or better or worse than you, but it allows you to view them on their terms, and stand a better chance at civility, if not friendship.

 

[RatRace123]

Discrimination is bad in most any form. However, joking is not the same thing as hatred.

 

[tojawi]

Well, you can't discriminate Fat people for not changing their lives any more than homeless people for not changing their lives, since, if they put the effort they could. Also, do you discriminate people for not putting the effort forwards to study for tests? I think, if youre not putting effort forward in one area in life, you pay by having to put more in other areas, ie, If youre fat, it takes effort to move, if your homeless it takes effort to find food. And if you didn't study, you have to put in mo0re effort to catch up.

 

[Lilani]

If you're fat, yes. You're obviously a glutton and can't take care of yourself. Of course it's justified. If you can help it, I don't see the problem. If we treat everyone as if nothing is wrong, then nobody will have a reason to better themselves.

There is never a "good" or "justified" reason to treat someone like crap. They're just as human as you are, and you are just as flawed as they are. The KKK think they are doing what is "right" and "just" for the world, too, you know.

 

[El Poncho]

If they are your friend you can take the piss out of them for anything unless they tell you not to.

Insulting strangers is stupid altogether to be honest.

 

[Palademon]

I see your point, but what if the person likes being fat or believes they shouldn't need to change themselves?

 

[The_root_of_all_evil]

Discrimination in general is wrong but there are some shared traits between certain groups. If you can accept that those traits won't be shared by all, but are shared by most, then it's a useful tool to donate certain people.

Obviously all ginger-haired people aren't soulless, but light-skin and freckles are shared by a high percentage. Therefore saying something like "Those with light skin (like ginger haired people)" is discriminating, but is not offensive - unless it follows up "...have no souls". That's offensive.

We are discriminatory creatures though, it's one of the first traits we develop - and one of the ones most hammered into us across childhood, and comforts us through the hell that is adolescence.

Not to mention that most of the adult world is built on discrimination of some for or another.

The thing to remember is that when you state something, that should be applicable to most of the population you are describing (including the ones you've never met). If it's not, add specifics until it is down to a point where most people are.

I mean, if I call someone a Cancerian (due to their birthday), they can still be offended if they suffer from cancer (the disease), so I'm being discrimatory and offensive - without being discriminatingly offensive.

Attacking someone with something they can change is wrong. Attacking them with something they can't change is equally wrong.

Just because you are blonde, for instance, doesn't mean you are thick or that you have more fun. You can be both, either or neither - and it doesn't relate to any percentage of blonde people.

If you're a blonde, female, model called Pamela Anderson, however...

 

[8-Bit Grin]

It's open season of fat people in my opinion.

Gingers however?

I'm dating one, and I wouldn't dare.

Just sayin'.

 

[Mr Montmorency]

If you're fat, yes. You're obviously a glutton and can't take care of yourself. Of course it's justified. If you can help it, I don't see the problem. If we treat everyone as if nothing is wrong, then nobody will have a reason to better themselves.

There is never a "good" or "justified" reason to treat someone like crap. They're just as human as you are, and you are just as flawed as they are. The KKK think they are doing what is "right" and "just" for the world, too, you know.

Comparing obesity to racism just shows that you haven't really thought about it all that much.

If I was fat, I would WANT to be treated like shit for it. Being fat is one of the biggest red flags that you're lazy, greedy and ambivalent of how you present yourself to people. It's a big problem and it's something you should absolutely avoid at all costs. I've yet to meet a fat person who didn't turn out to be a cock.

This is however, far different than unfounded racism. The fact that you compared this to the KKK makes it seem like a spin-off of Godwin's Law.

 

[Atros81]

Some things to consider about 'fat people'... there is NO scientifically proven way to take weight off and keep it off. Plus, arguably, the dieting yo-yo is worse for your health by far then being active and healthy, even if you're significantly overweight. Really, how could periods of essentially starvation be good for you?

 

[CarbonEagle]

If they can change it id say you can give them shit for it, but within reason. If your following them around harassing them, now YOU'VE got the bigger problem (and you can change that too).
If theres nothing they can do, theres little point in telling them, they probably already know.

 

[Lilani]

If you're fat, yes. You're obviously a glutton and can't take care of yourself. Of course it's justified. If you can help it, I don't see the problem. If we treat everyone as if nothing is wrong, then nobody will have a reason to better themselves.

j,
There is never a "good" or "justified" reason to treat someone like crap. They're just as human as you are, and you are just as flawed as they are. The KKK think they are doing what is "right" and "just" for the world, too, you know.

Comparing obesity to racism just shows that you haven't really thought about it all that much.

If I was fat, I would WANT to be treated like shit for it. Being fat is one of the biggest red flags that you're lazy, greedy and ambivalent of how you present yourself to people. It's a big problem and it's something you should absolutely avoid at all costs. I've yet to meet a fat person who didn't turn out to be a cock.

This is however, far different than unfounded racism. The fact that you compared this to the KKK makes it seem like a spin-off of Godwin's Law.

Well of course, your logic might apply in an ideal world. In a place where there are no such things as stress, depression, or addiction. A place that is free of things like low self-esteem, bullying, physical and mental abuse, and bad childhoods. But that isn't the world we live in. Food can be an addictive coping mechanism, just like the way alcoholics cling to their bottles and drug addicts cling to their syringes. A study that just came out earlier this month [http://guardianspress.com/2010/11/eating-junk-food-as-addictive-as-drugs/] backs that up.

To say that every fat person enjoys being fat is like saying every depressed person wants to be depressed, or every alcoholic wants to be an alcoholic. There are things at work in their mind that make recovery very hard.

You to condemn people for a problem you do not understand, and wish even less to TRY and understand. How does that make you any different from the people who so long ago refused to try and understand those with a different skin color? Sure, you can't change your skin color, but does that make it any better? Again I say there is no excuse for treating someone like shit. None. And for you to say otherwise just proves how much of a cruel, arrogant, and hateful cretin you are.

And you know what? I know there are some who enjoy being fat. And that STILL isn't an excuse. Regardless of how messed up in the head they are, they are still people, and deserve a certain level of respect for that. Because truly, every single person on this planet is messed up in the head in one way or another. And if we start to get picky about which flaws and quirks are acceptable and which aren't, we damn ourselves beyond the hope of return. There are plenty of flaws and addictions out there, but none of them are worth being dehumanized over.

 

[adakias]

My sister's overweight, but she's got some depression issues. She just lost the willpower to do much of anything lately. Sometimes fat jokes are funny, but I would never be serious or go out of my way to be mean to an overweight person just in case. I dunno. I generally don't like making fun of people for stuff like that... and I don't mock people for things they can't help unless I really can't stand them (and the only people I've ever really hated are the ones who have been just outright sociopathic) or they're really close (where we're good enough friends to understand where it's coming from).