Am I just at fault?

[NSGrendel]

This thread is palpably insane.

You are deceiving a third party with no benefit to them. Ethically, it's clearly a zero sum game.

I don't know of any moral frameworks that allow you to cheat on someone either. And any polygamous/open relationships require trust and openness between all parties, which you aren't doing.

But you're a sentient biped with your own agenda. Do whatever the **** you want. Just be aware that there are consequences. Don't listen to these *****s who will push their own moral code on you whilst throwing away food that cost more fuel to transport than the farmer who grew it can afford to buy in a week.

Every person in a developed nation is walking through life across the backs of 3/4 of the planet. Don't sweat it.

 

[Frission]

This thread is palpably insane.

You are deceiving a third party with no benefit to them. Ethically, it's clearly a zero sum game.

I don't know of any moral frameworks that allow you to cheat on someone either. And any polygamous/open relationships require trust and openness between all parties, which you aren't doing.

But you're a sentient biped with your own agenda. Do whatever the **** you want. Just be aware that there are consequences. Don't listen to these *****s who will push their own moral code on you whilst throwing away food that cost more fuel to transport than the farmer who grew it can afford to buy in a week.

Every person in a developed nation is walking through life across the backs of 3/4 of the planet. Don't sweat it.

What does the last part have to do with anything?

 

[Strazdas]

DAMN THIS FORUM. i click on empty space and it redirects me to other page and i loose the wal of text i wrote. FUCK.
im 100% i will not manage to write it as good as i did in this angered state so forgive my bluntness....
i was typing for 20 minutes and bam its gone.... and thats actually 3rd time today, so stop making invisible links.
(i actually got linked to rules of conduit, ironic isnt it?)

Let me start my asking you: How do you define an exclusive relationship? What does that mean to you?

Exclusive relationship is when you decide to have a relationship with one person or a group of people excluding yourself from others. In my opinion it is unnecessary limitation and i really dont want to write the full explanation again due to this forums random jokes.

With this, I define cheating as being involved with anyone else in a non platonic fashion after you have already established an exclusive relationship with someone before. If you're gonna let yourself be claimed as a boyfriend or girlfriend AND go around claiming someone as YOUR boyfriend/girlfriend, then that's exclusivity. And no one had better be going around acting like a boyfriend or girlfriend with anyone else. Or more generally, if you both decide to be each other's lovers, you can't have any others. Otherwise, what's the point? People should just be single for the rest of their lives so they get all the lovers they want and no attachments.

The question is, whats the point of having an exclusive relationship? Its a needless limitation of oneself with no benefits. relationship is more than just sex. It is entirely possible to live your whole life in a relationship that is good while not having sex. if sex is the only part of relationship that is lacking, what is so bad about getting that need filled elsewhere while leaving the relationship otherwise intact? Thats pretty much what friends with benefits was made for.
And i do believe there is nothing wrong with being single your whole life. Do you think people who chose to be single are somehow worse?

We'll agree to disagree on the first point. I'm of the thought that the boyfriend could be involved with another woman instead of with her. And that he's wasted all his time dealing with her and her bullshit.

what is stopping him from being involved with another woman? what makes you sure he isnt already? Sure, it could be that it was the girl in question trying to keep him under leash while going out with another, it could be a different situation, we really dont know enough to judge anyone in this case.

And who says he has to punch people? I agree with everyone deeming this triangle in the workplace is a bad idea. If I were him and I'd find out, I'd get HR involved. If they don't lose their jobs, the work grapevine oughta start spreading and that's gonna be a blow to reputations. Everyone knows about people deeming someone as the "work slut." And that's just only a couple possibilities I know can happen. There's probably more I don't know.

I could have misread you. I was under the impression you mean that by boyfriend reacting you justified him beating up the OP.
Deeming this as a "Awful thing", getting HR involved and creating artificial titles like "work slut" is exactly what i am opposed against. That is the truly bad thing - people like... say... in this thread.... judging other people for their personal choices and acting all high claiming "this is a slut, now hate her please". Sure it could happen, due to such people, but it shoun't happen.

 

[game-lover]

DAMN THIS FORUM. i click on empty space and it redirects me to other page and i loose the wal of text i wrote. FUCK.
im 100% i will not manage to write it as good as i did in this angered state so forgive my bluntness....
i was typing for 20 minutes and bam its gone.... and thats actually 3rd time today, so stop making invisible links.
(i actually got linked to rules of conduit, ironic isnt it?)

Exclusive relationship is when you decide to have a relationship with one person or a group of people excluding yourself from others. In my opinion it is unnecessary limitation and i really dont want to write the full explanation again due to this forums random jokes.

Aww, that sucks. Sorry you lost your post. I hate when that happens. Anyway, you're entitled to that opinion about exclusive relationships. I imagine you make it a point not to engage in any. And if everyone who thought like you or similar stayed out of exclusive relationships, this wouldn't be an issue. But some people who think in the same vein get into one anyway. And then they act all shocked that someone is hurt and they no longer get to sleep with do whatever they were doing with the person who they'd been with before.

The question is, whats the point of having an exclusive relationship? Its a needless limitation of oneself with no benefits. relationship is more than just sex. It is entirely possible to live your whole life in a relationship that is good while not having sex. if sex is the only part of relationship that is lacking, what is so bad about getting that need filled elsewhere while leaving the relationship otherwise intact? Thats pretty much what friends with benefits was made for.
And i do believe there is nothing wrong with being single your whole life. Do you think people who chose to be single are somehow worse?

Not at all! I see no issues with a single life. My point is that if you wanna be single, stay single. Don't be getting in relationships that will have people considering you taken and still go around acting like you're single. You don't have to ever have a meaningful romantic or sexual relationship with anyone. That's fine. Just don't go pursuing that lifestyle at the expense of others.

If friends with benefits is what people want, then people should just pursue friends with benefits and nothing else. Problem is, people aren't just doing friends with benefits. They're going for the exclusivity. And there are rules when you're exclusive. I think the general consensus is if you're going to go somewhere else to get what seems lacking in your current relationship, then the relationship isn't intact anymore. It's not just you and another person as a couple. You brought a 3rd element in with another person.

There are rules for other arrangements too. The open marriages and even friends with benefits. Mostly letting your lover know when you wanna sleep with someone else. But we've already established the hiding and lying issue which is a big factor in what makes cheating... cheating.

what is stopping him from being involved with another woman? what makes you sure he isnt already? Sure, it could be that it was the girl in question trying to keep him under leash while going out with another, it could be a different situation, we really dont know enough to judge anyone in this case.

You're right. No one here really knows for certain. We're going off what the OP said. And since he mentioned in later posts that the boyfriend cheated on an ex girlfriend before his current girlfriend, he certainly has the capability emotionally to be a cheating bastard. But the OP also said that boyfriend doesn't know. At least as far as he and the chick he's screwing knows. So he's already got this victim card just by the notion of being blatantly deceived.

Regardless if he did happen to be cheating at the same time, what's going on is still deemed wrong or at least messed up. As for what's stopping him from being with another girl? Well, I imagine his feelings on exclusivity if we assume that he's been faithful.

I could have misread you. I was under the impression you mean that by boyfriend reacting you justified him beating up the OP.
Deeming this as a "Awful thing", getting HR involved and creating artificial titles like "work slut" is exactly what i am opposed against. That is the truly bad thing - people like... say... in this thread.... judging other people for their personal choices and acting all high claiming "this is a slut, now hate her please". Sure it could happen, due to such people, but it shouldn't happen.

No, you didn't entirely. I believe boyfriend is entirely justified. But I was just mentioning other consequences that could be made to exist that didn't necessarily have to risk going to jail.

If a person is gonna sleep with someone else's exclusive lover, then they shouldn't be surprised if that person wants to kick their ass. Or otherwise make their life a living hell. I mean, hey, why didn't give a shit about the one being cheated on while they were helping it happen. So why should the cheater give a damn about them in turn?

No, it probably shouldn't happen. But people shouldn't lie or betray or break promises. Life sucks that way.

 

[EightGaugeHippo]

I've nothing to really add to this that hasn't been said before.
I find cheating despicable and would probably go out of my way to end your life in the most horrible way if I was the guy and found out you where cheating with my girlfriend.

All that aside, do you mind if I pull up a chair and some popcorn if shit hits the fan?

 

[Johnny Impact]

If you know you are "the other man" and you keep on with it, you are an accomplice to one of the most despicable crimes a person can commit. Simple as that.

Wait, wut?

Hyperbole much? Let's keep some perspective here. Yes, letting one's partner think they are in an exclusive relationship while seeing other people is extremely poor, but "one of the most despicable crimes a person can commit"? No. Not even close.

Aside from issues of morality, you should worry about personal safety. People get hurt all the time doing shit like that. I'm not talking about emotional scarring, either. I'm talking about broken bones, smashed teeth, stab wounds, etc. People are universally insane. You don't know how far this guy might be willing to go to get revenge.

For example, this right here? That's way more despicable. You're talking about assault, which unlike having sex with someone else, is an actual crime.

OP didn't ask whether it was legal. OP is looking for opinions on the morality of his situation. My opinion is cheating IS despicable. It ranks right up there with any other kind of serious deception, theft, or assault. It's equivalent to defrauding a person of everything they own, then kicking them in the balls. Call it aggravated assault of the heart. It's serious enough to destroy lives, create lifelong hatred, and drive people to all sorts of psychotic acts of retaliation. My opinion is that is pretty bad. My opinion is if you don't think that's pretty bad, your morals are loose. You just. Don't. Cheat.

 

[Strazdas]

Anyway, you're entitled to that opinion about exclusive relationships. I imagine you make it a point not to engage in any. And if everyone who thought like you or similar stayed out of exclusive relationships, this wouldn't be an issue. But some people who think in the same vein get into one anyway. And then they act all shocked that someone is hurt and they no longer get to sleep with do whatever they were doing with the person who they'd been with before.

Yep, double standards and not leading by example is big problems in the world. if you want to change the world - start with yourself. only when you act the way you think others should, you should consider advising others.
I have stopped doing exclusive relationships after my first one.

Not at all! I see no issues with a single life. My point is that if you wanna be single, stay single. Don't be getting in relationships that will have people considering you taken and still go around acting like you're single. You don't have to ever have a meaningful romantic or sexual relationship with anyone. That's fine. Just don't go pursuing that lifestyle at the expense of others.

except that there are cases of simple misunderstandings that escalate. i know people who went berserk after they had a one night stand and somehow imagined that they now own the girl and they must be together forever. granted at first i though the girl gave the wrong signals, but when the situation got more detailed turned out the guy was just.... the medical term for IQ 20-40. I agree that one should not pretend to be in exclusive relationship when one is not.

If friends with benefits is what people want, then people should just pursue friends with benefits and nothing else. Problem is, people aren't just doing friends with benefits. They're going for the exclusivity. And there are rules when you're exclusive. I think the general consensus is if you're going to go somewhere else to get what seems lacking in your current relationship, then the relationship isn't intact anymore. It's not just you and another person as a couple. You brought a 3rd element in with another person.

problems arrise when one person wants friends with benefits and another one wants more, but does not tell. Rellationships dont need to be intact. they are dinamic things that change over time and from variuos factors. its not some stone tablet that is going to stay there for 100 years. If the one part of your relationship that is causing trouble is "outsourced" to 3rd party, then the rest of relationship can go on, without the hindrance. However often in real life that 3rd party starts to claim ownership of the whole subject. ergo we have this situation. And people encourage that, which is why i said i am dissapointed by posts here.

No, you didn't entirely. I believe boyfriend is entirely justified. But I was just mentioning other consequences that could be made to exist that didn't necessarily have to risk going to jail.

i do not believe anyone is ever justified in punching people. violence is never an answer, unless your a tyrant. but i guess im too pacifistic for the world.

If a person is gonna sleep with someone else's exclusive lover, then they shouldn't be surprised if that person wants to kick their ass. Or otherwise make their life a living hell. I mean, hey, why didn't give a shit about the one being cheated on while they were helping it happen. So why should the cheater give a damn about them in turn?

yes they should. it was her choice, she broke the exclusivity. she is at fault for breaking her promise (if she made any, and no saying "im your girfriend" is not an exclusivity arrangement) and possibly lieing (as in this case). He has a right to be angry at her (no violence, as explained above) but the guy have done nothing to him. guilty by association does not work here. Cheated one should not give a damn. going to kick his ass is giving a damn.

No, it probably shouldn't happen. But people shouldn't lie or betray or break promises. Life sucks that way.

yep. And i think we must all do our part in trying to make world a better place. one has to admit it is (altrough very slowly) getting there. maybe our pro pro children will see the world we envision as the right one. but that does not come without actually working towards it. and if i can change an opinion of one person in here its already a start.

I find cheating despicable and would probably go out of my way to end your life in the most horrible way if I was the guy and found out you where cheating with my girlfriend.

and you, sir, is why we have mental institutions for.

My opinion is if you don't think that's pretty bad, your morals are loose.

morals are persona and subjective. there is no "mass morals". we have a concession of morals due to majority's personal morals being similar and indoctrination from youth of societal norms "this is how you should act". morality is never a justification.

 

[Whateveralot]

Her current boyfriend is basically worst off. He doesn't know and has no means to stop her from doing it.

You play along. You know you'll very likely be fired when this all comes out, so you'll get your punishment.

Then there's her. I think she's the worst doing this. She knows what she's doing, she doesn't stop it...bad, bad bad. I think she's a slut and you shouldn't be into her in the first place. But you are, so that's your problem.


For a fact, being this ignorant actually makes me hope you will suffer the honest consequences of your actios. I know what I would do if I were him..

 

[X10J]

You are facilitating and benefiting from someone's doing something you think is wrong. If this was theft or murder, the answer would be clear.

 

[Abomination]

For a fact, being this ignorant actually makes me hope you will suffer the honest consequences of your actios. I know what I would do if I were him..

It's awesome to know that implied assault or the act of assault is apparently "acceptable" recompense towards infidelity of a workplace romance.

People have made posts about how depressed they are with humanity because of those who would view the OP as not having done much wrong. I find the idea that violence is a suitable punishment for a moral slight to be the true measure as to how deranged our society has become.

 

[kalakashi]

EDIT: Double post.

 

[kalakashi]

Well, you've received a vast amount of negativity for all this, but judging solely from the way you type and the fact that you're asking this question, you don't strike me as a twat in any way. I think the morality of it depends on a few things:
Your relationship with the boyfriend (are you close enough that he would consider it a personal insult as opposed to just thinking of you as some bastard?)
Your relationship with her (is there any level of emotional connection? Not necessarily to the level where you might consider dating, but are you a bit more than just friends who also have sex?)
As far as I see it, she has made the choice to not uphold the monogamy of her relationship, and if there are not implied rules between you and the guy, then you get a tick on that box. However, if you suspect that her cheating is possibly diminishing an otherwise healthy relationship, then you should stop (unless it's a scenario where if it wasn't you, it would just be someone else). Also, whichever way you look at it, you should probably suggest she break up with him, as it is the fairest course of action.

We keep telling ourselves we're different, but we've all had the desire to pay back vengeance in spades at some point.
You may pretend to be righteous, but let's see how you feel when this happens to you.

The world would be a lot more honest with a little less laws and a little more violence.

You seem to be saying that is if it were a good thing. More violence may be more honest to our nature as animals, but isn't that somewhat the idea of humanity, that we're a bit better than the rest of them?

 

[Happiness Assassin]

If it wasn't wrong, why are you hiding it at all? And if he is a d-bag to her, she shouldn't be in a relationship with him any more. Quit trying to moralize your own wrongdoings and be a man.

 

[Sparrow]

Well, put it this way; if that were my girlfriend, I would probably knock yer bloody lights out.

You're both at fault. Maybe she's more to blame than you or whatever, but there's no doubting that you've screwed the pooch too.

 

[Abomination]

It's awesome to know that implied assault or the act of assault is apparently "acceptable" recompense towards infidelity of a workplace romance.

People have made posts about how depressed they are with humanity because of those who would view the OP as not having done much wrong. I find the idea that violence is a suitable punishment for a moral slight to be the true measure as to how deranged our society has become.

"Has become", implying it was ever any different?

We're all animals, don't you forget that.
Underneath that thin layer of fear for the law, there's a beast in every one of us.

We keep telling ourselves we're different, but we've all had the desire to pay back vengeance in spades at some point.
You may pretend to be righteous, but let's see how you feel when this happens to you.

The world would be a lot more honest with a little less laws and a little more violence.

I like to believe that as our society has grown more and more enlightened in that many a person can contemplate the philosophical nature of their actions and that we can reflect upon just what the cause for our decisions are - we can identify not just the what but also the why.

The OP has caused no harm, he has simply been an agent of the girlfriend's infidelity ? it was she who has done any real potential harm. But for damage to pride only to be responded with damage of a physical nature when we are BETTER than this is saddening. It is not that I do not believe us to be subject to animal instincts but the fact we can identify them but allow them to rule us still shows just how little sentience some of us truly have.

Temporary satisfaction or vindication taken in spite of long-term consequence... vengeance directed at the wrong party and applied in excess of the slight.

Or maybe it's just because I've slept with a few women who have been in relationships at the time - some I knew about and some I didn't. I, however, was never in one during those forays. I have had the same done against me (before I engaged in being an agent of infidelity, so no claims of karma backlash) and even at the ripe age of 17 I knew who the true guilty party was - the one who claimed to be my romantic partner exclusively. Not the agent.