America vs EU?

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Stephanos132

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Sep 7, 2009
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Lot of pro-EU types here...

Also
The Austin said:
TheRightToArmBears said:
EU>US

Do you want to know why?

Proper beer.
You call warm beer proper? We laugh at you! Ha-ha-ha!
Where have you been drinking to get a warm beer? In my experiences, you can get either lagers, which are served cold (or close to freezing if you want) and then ales which aren't exactly room temperature either. Perhaps I've just been lucky...
 

Stephanos132

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Shycte said:
Germany and Great Britain basicly running the whole thing. You get seats based on your population number you know.
We are? That's not the impression we've been getting at home. More just funding it and getting the finger back in return...

Edit: Whoops, doubled up there...
 

acosn

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Sep 11, 2008
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Metalhandkerchief said:
Mcface said:
Metalhandkerchief said:
I have a reason for saying EU > USA.

EU is home to Scandinavia (Canada-is-America's-hat-translation: Norway, Sweden and Denmark) the countries with the most well functioning society models on the planet.

USA has also the highest annual murder rate in the world with about 11,000 deaths. In comparison, the 2nd highest annual murder rate is Germany, with 60 to 80. This alone is reason enough to never set foot in that hell hole.
Germany population: 82,110,097
America population: 307,006,550

Gee I wonder why there are more murders.
So you're saying 3.4 times larger population warrants 130 times more murders?

Actually, if you add up all of EU's countries, there are under 1000 murders. EU has twice the population of America, yet America still has over 10 times as many murders.

Your logic scares me, or your math. One of those anyway.
The statistics are always padded.

Badly.

I don't even believe any stats posted on the subject unless there's a source given that divulges how they reached such numbers.
 

TurboPanda

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Apr 19, 2010
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Ethnocentrism: belief in the superiority of one's own ethnic group

Nobody is going to admit the other side is better so this entire thread is pointless.
 

The Long Road

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Sep 3, 2010
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As odd as this next statement will sound, I have an explanation for it.

Comparing the United States to Europe/the EU is really comparing apples to oranges.

What? Comparisons of similar countries are invalid? Why do I say these crazy things? Well, it has mostly to do with the origins of the countries.

European history is a much longer story than American history, and much of it is filled with monarchies arising during or immediately after the Dark Ages. With the feudal system so rigidly organized, it became accepted that governments had the final say in what happened, and the lowest classes (mostly serfs of the royalty) grouped together to exist as a commune rather than individuals. This helped them feed themselves more efficiently and allowed for some form of contact with equals, rather than constantly being ordered around by their many levels of social superiors. This mindset outlived the monarchies from which they formed and gave Europe the left-winged slant it has today. Quite often, the group is seen as more important than the individual, and that is reflected in the Socialist or pseudo-Socialist nature of most European governments. These governments have a long, powerful reach, and the general consensus of the populace is that they are the sheltering protectors. Trying to include an American-style limited government would leave people hopelessly wondering where their big brother went when it was such a big part of the country.

The United States, however, was formed by English malcontents, who were followed by malcontents from all countries of Europe, and eventually the world. These people saw their governments as power-hungry and dominating, and simply wanted to be left alone. They formed a new, limited government in the New World, and built a country around it. The mindset of the people was that their government should not have such an influence on the people, and they lived according to it. This is seen in the center-right nature of the American populace. Recent swings to the left notwithstanding, the US government is usually kept small(ish) and out of the way, at least comparatively. The American people prefer to sacrifice the safety of a powerful, protective government for the freedom to do most anything they like. The implementation of a European-style Socialist government would be met with outrage at best. The worst-case scenario is a military mutiny at the highest level. and a popular uprising from everywhere that is not the East Coast and southern California.

So Europe is more community- or group-oriented, and the United States is more individual-centric. Trying to compare the two comes down to a matter of personal preference. All other concerns are secondary to this.

Personally, I like the option of choosing my medical care, retirement plans, financial options, etc. But I can easily see how a state-run entity for any of these would be lucrative to some people.
 

darth gditch

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Jun 3, 2009
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Metalhandkerchief said:
Mcface said:
Metalhandkerchief said:
I have a reason for saying EU > USA.

EU is home to Scandinavia (Canada-is-America's-hat-translation: Norway, Sweden and Denmark) the countries with the most well functioning society models on the planet.

USA has also the highest annual murder rate in the world with about 11,000 deaths. In comparison, the 2nd highest annual murder rate is Germany, with 60 to 80. This alone is reason enough to never set foot in that hell hole.
Germany population: 82,110,097
America population: 307,006,550

Gee I wonder why there are more murders.
So you're saying 3.4 times larger population warrants 130 times more murders?

Actually, if you add up all of EU's countries, there are under 1000 murders. EU has twice the population of America, yet America still has over 10 times as many murders.

Your logic scares me, or your math. One of those anyway.
Um, guys? El Salvador has the world's highest murder rate per 100,000 people at 71.

And murders per 100,000 people is the way you properly compare murder rates, not raw number of deaths, because that skews towards smaller countries being "safer." However, Germany does have a much lower murder rate than the United States, 0.86 per 100,000 versus 5.0 per 100,000.

EDIT: Sorry, wrote 10,000 the first time and I meant 100,000.
 

demoman_chaos

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May 25, 2009
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France saved the US in our Revolutionary War, but we saved France from the Germans twice.
France owes us a save in WWIII. We are about even with England, killed each other twice but saved each other twice (The RAF saved England, which saved us from fighting the Nazi's alone but we showed up and tag-teamed them Germans).

But Europe does have Rome and Greece, the 2 best historical places.
 

Giest4life

The Saucepan Man
Feb 13, 2010
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Damn right, dude. Though I have to say, I think American writers aren't worth jack. Just an opinion, of course.
 

Talshere

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I hate it when then lump Britain with the EU. I like the concept and all, but I really dont support our continued presence. I think we would be better of it we were towed slightly further away.
 

Giest4life

The Saucepan Man
Feb 13, 2010
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demoman_chaos said:
France saved the US in our Revolutionary War, but we saved France from the Germans twice.
France owes us a save in WWIII. We are about even with England, killed each other twice but saved each other twice (The RAF saved England, which saved us from fighting the Nazi's alone but we showed up and tag-teamed them Germans).

But Europe does have Rome and Greece, the 2 best historical places.
France also gave your precious "constitution." Ever heard of a little book called The Spirit of Laws ?
 

mr_rubino

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Sep 19, 2010
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Giest4life said:
demoman_chaos said:
France saved the US in our Revolutionary War, but we saved France from the Germans twice.
France owes us a save in WWIII. We are about even with England, killed each other twice but saved each other twice (The RAF saved England, which saved us from fighting the Nazi's alone but we showed up and tag-teamed them Germans).

But Europe does have Rome and Greece, the 2 best historical places.
France also gave your precious "constitution." Ever heard of a little book called The Spirit of Laws ?
Not even France has.
 

Cat Cloud

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Aug 12, 2010
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JaymesFogarty said:
What a good response! I still don't understand how Americans can find the English, (sophisticated, obviously) accent in any way amusing. Does it show a lack of confidence in yourself, to find a well-pronounced speaker amusing?
It's not so much amusing as it is interesting. We are surrounded by American accents in every day life, TV, etc. so hearing something different sounds cool and somewhat amusing. We're just not use to your accents.

OT:Why is the single country of the US being compared to the continent of Europe? Really. And it's not like we don't know how this will end. Europeans will tell us how we're all fat, rude, arrogant, gun obsesed losers who can't spell, have a horrible accent, and live in a war zone, and Americans wil attempt to defend themselves while probably offending several countries and proving to a certian degree that they are very patriotic. Comments about how stupid this all is will be made.

One thing I always wonder about is how no one ever seems to comment on how we all have different cultures. Things and actions that are acceptible in one country are repulsive in anouther. We all also have completly different governments. Shouldn't that make fairly judging countries against one anouther harder and basically useless? Not that it matters, since it's more interesting to just bash each other.
 

Jester00

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Sep 22, 2010
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Metalhandkerchief said:
EU is home to Scandinavia (Canada-is-America's-hat-translation: Norway, Sweden and Denmark) the countries with the most well functioning society models on the planet.
/agree.

Metalhandkerchief said:
USA has also the highest annual murder rate in the world with about 11,000 deaths. In comparison, the 2nd highest annual murder rate is Germany, with 60 to 80. This alone is reason enough to never set foot in that hell hole.
i didn't get killed yet.

i live in europe and i really like it. but i also like america. hm.
 

Dr. Whiggs

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Jan 12, 2008
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Metalhandkerchief said:
I have a reason for saying EU > USA.

EU is home to Scandinavia (Canada-is-America's-hat-translation: Norway, Sweden and Denmark) the countries with the most well functioning society models on the planet.

USA has also the highest annual murder rate in the world with about 11,000 deaths. In comparison, the 2nd highest annual murder rate is Germany, with 60 to 80. This alone is reason enough to never set foot in that hell hole.
How's your suicide rate going?
 

Nickolai77

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Shycte said:
Don't really know how much political influence they could get though, with Germany and Great Britain basicly running the whole thing. You get seats based on your population number you know.
Your correct, but Iceland will have some power in the EU rather than none at all. The latter option is still more preferable.

fishman279 said:
I get into international pissing contests almost every time I see my friends. I am English. I live in France. It's quite problematic at times, the best being the time me and my best friend were shouting (at the top of our voices) at each other about France's impact on WWII... In the middle of a history lesson. The teacher was not best pleased. Good times...
Sounds like it :)

But out of interest, how do the French view the English? Is the tongue in cheek rivalry mutually shared?

Also, judging by the complete lack of French people on the Escapist...do the French not like speaking English?
 

Razgovory

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Sep 27, 2010
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The Long Road said:
As odd as this next statement will sound, I have an explanation for it.

Comparing the United States to Europe/the EU is really comparing apples to oranges.


The United States, however, was formed by English malcontents, who were followed by malcontents from all countries of Europe, and eventually the world. These people saw their governments as power-hungry and dominating, and simply wanted to be left alone. They formed a new, limited government in the New World, and built a country around it. The mindset of the people was that their government should not have such an influence on the people, and they lived according to it. This is seen in the center-right nature of the American populace. Recent swings to the left notwithstanding, the US government is usually kept small(ish) and out of the way, at least comparatively. The American people prefer to sacrifice the safety of a powerful, protective government for the freedom to do most anything they like. The implementation of a European-style Socialist government would be met with outrage at best. The worst-case scenario is a military mutiny at the highest level. and a popular uprising from everywhere that is not the East Coast and southern California.
This is a common misconception of American history. The Early American government (and people) were not against government influence in people's daily lives. The major argument in those days over government was not the government vs the individual, but the Federal Government vs the State Governments. The early governments of the United States had no problem interfering in the lives of it's citizens. The difference was that it was normally local government that did so. State, county, and municipal governments developed a byzantine systems of regulations and laws to govern their citizens. Those who were the proponents of strong state powers and weak Federal powers were known as Democratic Republicans and were led by the likes of James Monroe and Thomas Jefferson. Those in favor of a strong Federal Government were known as Federalist and were led by John Adams and Alexander Hamilton.
 

Therumancer

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Nov 28, 2007
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I think a lot of this comes from economic rivalry that is gradually tearing what solidarity the US and Europe have had apart at a crucial time. I think we should be spending less time bickering with each other, and fighting over where world finance is going to be situated (Wall Street, or the European Common Market) and spending more time focusing on dealing with common problems like the rising power of eastern nations like China and Russia.

I mean honestly, instead of throwing bile at the US, I'd expect the EU to be focusing more attention on Russia given that they invaded a nation right on it's border (Georgia), threatened to nuke Poland over hosting defensive missle bases (and Poland is an EU member), and then cut off the gas/oil coming into the EU. That's where I'd expect the belligerance and one upsmanship to be directed.

This is all just my opinion of course.
 

demoman_chaos

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May 25, 2009
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Giest4life said:
France also gave your precious "constitution." Ever heard of a little book called The Spirit of Laws ?
Nope. You expect me to have considering I went through US schooling which is more about making sure everyone feels special and passes instead of trying to at least get people to use real words and proper grammer?

US eductation is non-existent. But what rulers would want their citizens to know their rights? If they know their rights, how can they take them away?