An Interesting Illegal Immigrant Case

[RJ 17]

Or at least I think it is, the story can be found here:

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/04/24/11369925-can-an-illegal-immigrant-become-a-lawyer?lite

The short version: an illegal immigrant in the US has - at least according to this story - been a law abiding member of society and just in general a decent person. He took the Bar exam in Florida, passed it, but now the state supreme court is looking into whether or not an illegal immigrant can become a legally licensed lawyer.

As I've found that putting my own opinions into OPs in the off-topic section more often than not leads to my inbox being filled with quotes from different people all saying the same thing, I'll withhold my own thoughts on the matter for now and just leave it open to discussion.

So, my fellow Escapists, should an illegal immigrant who - as far as we can tell - has done nothing wrong (other than having been brought to the US when he was a child) be eligible to obtain a license to practice law?

UPDATE: Kinda on a side-note, but I felt like updating my OP with it. But according to the way the oral arguments went in regards to the controversial Arizona immigration law, the supreme court seems to be siding with the state on the most controversial part: police being able to ask to see someone's documents if the police have good reason to believe that the person is in the country illegally.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/25/sb-1070-supreme-court-arizona-immigration-law_n_1451622.html

 

[OneCatch]

No, I don't think he should be allowed to practice. You have to draw the line somewhere, and it's kind of irrelevant whether he's licensed or not. since he'll presumably be deported anyway.

It seems harsh, but he could have applied for citizenship in the intervening years, could he not?

 

[GrandmaFunk]

very interesting case/article.

I like how cases like these will help redefine a few of the stickier points of immigration law, especially the process of naturalizing children of undocumented immigrants.

For Godinez-Samperio specifically, I'm curious about what requirements/steps are missing to get his green card...he seems to have more than enough sponsors and a great support structure in place.

 

[Dags90]

It doesn't seem particularly interesting to me. At this point, stories of people brought here as children and struggling with their parent's decision are so common to be a bit boring.

It seems harsh, but he could have applied for citizenship in the intervening years, could he not?

It depends. If he doesn't have any family member or an employer willing to sponsor him (and good luck finding legitimate employment as an undocumented immigrant), it's pretty much impossible to become a permanent resident, much less a citizen. Especially as a Mexican citizen, his chance of getting in under the "diversity lottery" are pretty much zero. The only other path to permanent residency is to first show 10 years of living here (as an adult) and "good moral character", and also to argue why it would cause undue hardship to go back to your home country.

So really...no.

 

[DoPo]

So, my fellow Escapists, should an illegal immigrant who - as far as we can tell - has done nothing wrong (other than having been brought to the US when he was a child) be eligible to obtain a license to practice law?

BOOM. Inbox. >

Anyway, no, an illegal immigrant shouldn't be allowed to practice law. And what I mean by this, is that as far as we know, he should be able to be legalised (or whatever you call the term). At least it seems entirely reasonable to me that if the dude has lived in the States all his life and has done nothing really wrong, he should be allowed citizenship.

now complications may arise with taxes and such but if he wants to become a contributing US citizen, then it shouldn't be a huge deal.

 

[OneCatch]

It doesn't seem particularly interesting to me. At this point, stories of people brought here as children and struggling with their parent's decision is a bit passe.

It seems harsh, but he could have applied for citizenship in the intervening years, could he not?

It depends. If he doesn't have any family member or an employer willing to sponsor him, it's pretty much impossible to become a permanent resident, much less a citizen. Especially as a Mexican citizen, his chance of getting in under the "diversity lottery" are pretty much zero. The only other path to permanent residency is to first show 10 years of living here (as an adult) and "good moral character", and also to argue why it would cause undue hardship to go back to your home country.

So really...no.

Well that seems unduly harsh... though I should have known from anti-immigrant rhetoric in US politics.

But it doesn't change the fact that this individual is illegal and has to follow the rules, otherwise it'll set all kinds of unintended precedents.

Though I will say that, from the sound of it, immigration legislation needs to be massively overhauled if there isn't some kind of exemption for a highly trained professional who is already fully integrated. It seems unfair.
If there's a petition to change it to a more flexible system, let me know and I'll sign!

Aaand now I feel like this guy:


(The bit at about 2:00)

 

[Arsen]

"Decent person".

Sounds opinionated.

 

[Dags90]

If there's a petition to change it to a more flexible system, let me know and I'll sign!

It actually made it to Congress and...failed to pass.

Anyway, no, an illegal immigrant shouldn't be allowed to practice law. And what I mean by this, is that as far as we know, he should be able to be legalised (or whatever you call the term). At least it seems entirely reasonable to me that if the dude has lived in the States all his life and has done nothing really wrong, he should be allowed citizenship.

As I mentioned earlier. Unless you have preexisting ties to the U.S. (and employer or U.S. citizen first degree family member), it's very tough to get permanent residence, much less citizenship. His parents are illegal so he obviously has no first degree relatives who are citizens. It's illegal to hire undocumented immigrants, so no one is going to come forth and sponsor someone who's here illegally. The main use of the employer sponsorship is to extend limited work visas into permanent residence.

While the DREAM Act (which would've allowed undocumented immigrants to be put on a path to citizen ship after graduating college or military service) failed, similar bills are already being discussed.

 

[RJ 17]

As I mentioned earlier. Unless you have preexisting ties to the U.S. (and employer or U.S. citizen first degree family member), it's very tough to get permanent residence, much less citizenship. His parents are illegal so he obviously has no first degree relatives who are citizens. It's illegal to hire undocumented immigrants, so no one is going to come forth and sponsor someone who's here illegally. The main use of the employer sponsorship is to extend limited work visas into permanent residence.

And that actually brings up a good point in itself...even if he is allowed to become a lawyer, since he's still an illegal immigrant, wouldn't that mean it'd be illegal for any law firms to hire him?

 

[Lucem712]

That's a pretty tough question. Growing up in a Mexican family, I know how difficult it can be to optain citizenship. I'm not sure if he should be able to practice law, because who would hire him? But, I can understand his reluctancy to try for citizenship because if it falls through and he gets deported, he's going to be sent back to a country he maybe doesn't even recognize as his homeplace.

 

[Dags90]

@The two posters above.

According to the U.S. government, a little over 1-in-5 lawyers are self employed. [footnote]http://www.bls.gov/ooh/Legal/Lawyers.htm[/footnote]

 

[JoesshittyOs]

I think the whole idea of illegal immigration is morally despicable enough as it is, so definitely give it to him.

 

[ElPatron]

It seems harsh, but he could have applied for citizenship in the intervening years, could he not?

It would take years for that.

Yeap. Applying for North American citizenship isn't easy at all.

I think the whole idea of illegal immigration is morally despicable enough as it is, so definitely give it to him.

You mean allow him to stay?

Illegal immigration only increases crime and the number of people being explored, while people actively seeking citizenship are set back by illegals.

 

[370999]

I think the law applies to everyone. Yeah I can understand why someone who become an illegal alien but unfortunately the United states is not in a position to become a charity, it's a nations state and as such it kind of has to enforce it's on rules. Again it sucks IMHO but unfortunately them the breaks.

 

[Agayek]

Anyway, no, an illegal immigrant shouldn't be allowed to practice law. And what I mean by this, is that as far as we know, he should be able to be legalised (or whatever you call the term). At least it seems entirely reasonable to me that if the dude has lived in the States all his life and has done nothing really wrong, he should be allowed citizenship.

now complications may arise with taxes and such but if he wants to become a contributing US citizen, then it shouldn't be a huge deal.

I'm with this guy. As long as he's not a legal citizen, he should not be able to practice law.

That said, citizenry should certainly be a reasonable option for him to get IMO. I'm not sure what the current laws are, so I can't comment there, but I feel that he should be able to apply, and get, citizenship within a reasonable timeframe/price.

 

[DevilWithaHalo]

So, my fellow Escapists, should an illegal immigrant who - as far as we can tell - has done nothing wrong (other than having been brought to the US when he was a child) be eligible to obtain a license to practice law?

Didn't you just answer your own question? Let's ask him directly...

?I decided to come out with my story because I?m undocumented, unapologetic and unafraid,? he said. ?In telling the truth, I am risking my liberty, but that?s what a lawyer is about, is about telling the truth ? so I?m being as honest as I can possibly get, even to the point of risking my liberty.?

Admits to breaking the law. Problem solved.

Pyromaniacs shouldn't become FireFighters.
Kleptomaniacs shouldn't become Cops.
Bail Jumpers shouldn't become Bounty Hunters.
Tax Dodgers shouldn't become IRS auditors.
Criminals shouldn't become Lawyers.
Smokers shouldn't become Doctors.
Obese people shouldn't become Dietitians.

However, this is America, and reality works a little differently. So if we have draft dodgers commanding our military in political office, we can have a criminal practice law!

 

[triggrhappy94]

I think we should be easier on imigrants and all that [/disclaimer], but...
How the hell did he get this far without anyone noticing that he's not here legally?
I'm not sure if Florida has any kind of Dream law, so he's probably going to get sent back. He will be going back as a lawyer, so it's not all bad.

 

[Atmos Duality]

I'm sure if he went through the proper channels, he could prove to be a worthwhile lawyer and legal citizen.

As a matter of ethics, I promote attracting creative and intelligent people to my country.
It certainly beats some of the alternatives...