Anyone else bothered by the increased blurring of gender roles?

[SinisterGehe]

If I act like a man, I am a sexist and brute.
If I act like a society thinks I should, I am sissy and prude.
If act like I act now (Absolutist + asexual + speak for equality of both genders, sexualities and all people)
I am considered to be hypocrite and rather odd.

I can not attend military because of my nerve damage hand, I am considered to be a weakling who will never become a man...

Woah, clearly my worth as human is defined rock hard standards that clearly take account realistic factors instead of ideals...

 

[Denamic]

There are no gender roles.
Just retarded sexism.

 

[Eldarion]

Why would you not just teach everyone to be confident, assertive and productive as well as to have compassion and empathy?

Cause they are all good traits to have and not exclusive to either gender.

Because, on a fundamental, biological level, the genders are wired differently.

I definitely wouldn't stop someone from teaching the lot to any particular person, but I know that for men to reach a psychologically mature state, they need to learn certain traits, chief among them being confidence and responsibility. Thus, I would stress these traits to male children.

I'm not overly familiar with female mental states (they confuse me enough without delving into the psychology behind it) so I just guessed in that regard. It could be something completely different, but from what I do understand, it is a logical conclusion.

I'm not gonna deny that men and women are wired differently, but whatever differences there are biologically does not stop women from doing anything a man can do and vice versa.

I think we have to agree to disagree, but I don't believe you need to teach women and men to think differently.

 

[Tdc2182]

Until it becomes the norm for guys to start wearing dresses and make up, there will be unblurred roles of gender secularization.

Though the way you go about it is absolutely retarded.

 

[sumanoskae]

Well considering your opinion on the subject, wouldn't it make sense that you tend to befriend people who agree with you or fit that criteria?, and that's why you go to your female friends/relatives for help?.

Short answer, no. I don't think there's anything wrong with the destruction of stereotypes.

All they accomplish is making people who don't fit them feel alone miserable.

It is on the grounds of these obligatory roles that bigotry, suicide and self hatred are born, because as long as one side of an equation is seen as inherently different, people will continue to pick favorites and blame all their problems on the other side.

Further more, I don't think that gender roles are being eliminated at all, just broadened and replaced. Now instead of "All men are like this" we have "There are three, und precisely three!, kind of men"

If gender roles didn't exist then how could all the boys you met have the same problems?.

 

[Addendum_Forthcoming]

At its most base level, an opinion will always be considered a form of discrimination.
Most people are sensible enough to recognize that, but there will always be some asshole who wants to stir up controversy for whatever reason; by taking that opinion and blowing it way WAY out of proportion.

As an example: Resident Evil 5 has you killing African Zombies in Africa! THATS SO RACIST, DISCRIMINATING AND EVIL!
...Yeah. And Resident Evil 4 had you killing Spanish Zombies in Spain, Resident Evil 3 had you killing American Zombies (mostly white) in America...
So, what makes that any more or less discriminating again? Oh right, someone wanted to stir the shit pot because it's "topical".

Out of curiosity ... let's say if zombies stopped being zombies (human flesh eating, almost 0 higher brain function) by achieving a return to old human behaviourisms ... would you still be considered 'Spanish' in undeath as you were in life? Feels kinda weird to think about it ... like if someone is buried in the ground and to still think of them as (insert nationality here) rather than just as a person, you know? o.o

As for the subject matter: I don't think gender personas (moreso than roles) have changed too much, I just think there is greater acceptance of people who are outside common perceptions of what it is to be masculine and feminine.

And I don't think that's a bad thing.

After all, I think any society is healthiest when it's individuals can act in accordance to how they feel (as long as it is causes no harm) rather than feel constrained by archetypal gender considerations.

 

[Svenparty]

I'm glad sports culture and all the MAN bullshit is being replaced and I hope that everyone takes up mincing and sharing emotions

lol I don't want to take this bait, however tempting it is.

You'll have to pluck the bait from my tights while I mince through this daisy field knitting a cardigan and reading Dorian Grey.Of course it'll be hard to pay attention to the THROBBING melodrama while singing Tiny Tim and equally hard finding the Mattel shop to purchase the latest Barbie

 

[JanatUrlich]

I think it's a good thing to be honest. Gender is fluid and should remain so.

How are these boys going to grow up to be leaders of men and protectors of women?

Wtf dude. If a man tried to 'protect me' I'd punch him in the face. Women do not need to be protected my men. We are equally as capable in everyday life.

 

[Acidwell]

Spoiler: snip

But what this modern world takes for granted time and time again that these low-reputation physical jobs are crucial to allowing the rest of us to be programmers and stock brokers.

That's kind of a flawed argument. Every job is important otherwise it would not exist. The problem with the "physical" jobs is that they can be done by everyone. Sure some people will be less efficient at them than others, but basically anyone who is a programmer could become a mechanic.
Not vice versa.

The only reason the discirbed gender roles ever existed is war.
War is a simply, physical task that was of mayor importance during some peroids of time. It allowed men to feel important, even if they lacked any ablity that went beyond being strong and shouting loud.

But today war has almost disappeared fro mthe western world, leaving the "physical" men with the feeling of being underrated.

That first statement is completely false, if anybody who has studied programming can be a mechanic then why don't they? They are both very technical, unrelated jobs.


As for gender roles. War is not the only reason for the definations, women can fight just as well as men. Its childbirth that created gender roles. How easy do you think it is to do any kind of manual labour with another person growing inside you? Not very, and someone then has to take care of said child something that in the past was easier for a woman to do because they didn't have such thing as maternity leave. Also war is not a simply physical task considering the amount of roles involved in war for at least 150 years.

Ot: I don't really see the problem of changing gender roles, if you don't want to change then don't nobody is forcing you to.

 

[Eldarion]

Well, since women don't need men to protect them anymore let's hope we are never invaded because very few men today were taught to fight. I am sure women can hold their own though against an invading army.

It has been mentioned that masculinity is not needed in todays world. Well, there are still alot of professions that most women don't want. Dangerous and dirty jobs are predominately male. Don't see alot of women mining or working in the sewers. Even in everyday jobs where heavy lifting is required, men are required to the lifting. I have seen more than a few female clerks at Wal Mart call for a man to lift something heavy.

I wonder, would society collapse if men just stopped working, maybe moved to an island and left the running of society to women? After all, masculinity isn't needed in todays world.

This only makes sense if masculinity and feminine behavior is exclusive to men or women. It isn't, the women you see asking for a man to lift something aren't incapable of lifting heavy things because they are women, its because they as individuals just happen to not be very strong.

Ah, so it would ok for a weak man to call a strong woman to do the heavy lifting? You know as well as I how socially unacceptable that would be.

So what do you think, if men just moved to an island and left everything to the women to run, how would it go?

It would go fine because men and women are equally capable in society. Masculine and feminine traits develop at the individual level regardless of gender.

I work at wal mart, I can't lift pallets. I usually get a female coworker I work with to get them for me or help me with the heavy loads. No one belittles me about this, because most people have moved on from pre convinced gender notions.

LOL, yeah ok. The double standards are all gone and men and women are treated as if they have the exact same strengths and weaknesses. I have never seen that world.

You blind? Cause I'm finding it very hard to believe you.

No I am not blind there are loads of double standards in regards to this topic. Heavy lifting just being one of them. Did you know that men still have to register for the draft but women do not? Is that a double standard or am I blind?

Men are still tied to the porvider/protector gender role while women were freed from theirs. Ever talked to stay at home dads about how they are treated?

Are you going on about how its not fair to some of these double standards to exist? Or do you still think that only men can display masculine traits and that women need you to do the "men work". Cause I've already explained that masculine traits are not exclusive to men and vise versa.

Just cause some unfair double standards exist does not make them right, but I'm a compassionate sensitive male and most everyone I know has no problem with it.

No one would have a problem with you being a sensitive male (that is what society wants you to be until they need soldiers), if you were a macho male you would be demonized and called immature. However, when a woman needs protecting, your feminine traits won't serve you well.

The double standards exist and they will remain if no one talks about them.

Well its not black and white. Feminine does not mean weak either.

You are spending too much time playing with terminology. Masculine and feminine mean different things to different people.

Let's drop the terminology and say that when a woman wants someone to protect her, your sensitive side won't serve you well.

I can't fight because I'm sensitive? Am I incapable of defending myself or others because I tend to shy away from confrontation? I was taught to avoid conflict whenever necessary, I was taught this in my martial arts class. Unless to you feminine equates to a pushover, to weakness perhaps? I don't think it does.

 

[Agayek]

I'm not gonna deny that men and women are wired differently, but whatever differences there are biologically does not stop women from doing anything a man can do and vice versa.

I think we have to agree to disagree, but I don't believe you need to teach women and men to think differently.

I have never once said that men can do anything a woman can't. Matter of fact, I'm a firm believer in the opposite. Anyone is perfectly capable of anything, if they're willing to work hard enough ("enough" being subject to innate skill, accidents of birth, and opportunities).

That said, they are different, on a fundamental level. Women need different things from men to mature properly, just like a cow needs different food than a lion. It's a biological imperative. It's been shown time and again in various psychological studies.

 

[megapenguinx]

No, I'm not bothered by it at all.
Gender roles fluctuate with time. It's just something that happens.

 

[tharglet]

I don't necessarily think the loss of gender roles means a generation of sissies - it's more the "cotton wool" culture, and the "ooh err someone might sue" attitude to things.

It shouldn't matter if one follows a path that is regarded as matching their gender or not. If people aren't permitted to have life experiences, then that does cause repercussions in the long run.
There are times kids should be left to their own devices in certain situations - let them overcome the issues that face them. If they're not left alone, chances are they'll choose not to learn.

 

[Eldarion]

I'm not gonna deny that men and women are wired differently, but whatever differences there are biologically does not stop women from doing anything a man can do and vice versa.

I think we have to agree to disagree, but I don't believe you need to teach women and men to think differently.

I have never once said that men can do anything a woman can't. Matter of fact, I'm a firm believer in the opposite. Anyone is perfectly capable of anything, if they're willing to work hard enough ("enough" being subject to innate skill, accidents of birth, and opportunities).

That said, they are different, on a fundamental level. Women need different things from men to mature properly, just like a cow needs different food than a lion. It's a biological imperative. It's been shown time and again in various psychological studies.

Ok, so according you (and just for the sake of this discussion) is a boy growing up to be softer, more sensitive a bad thing? Can a male grow up with feminine traits and mature healthily?

In fact, define a healthy male. I'm interested to see what you come up with.

 

[William Dickbringer]

Say you have a son. What would you rather him to be, a programmer or a lumberjack?

that's really an unfair comparison it's saying "do I want my son to be financially better off or more of a man?" what about do whatever he feels is the best for him

 

[SilverUchiha]

After reading the first page of responses, I must say, I am a little concerned and for only one real reason. The wussification of Men is not the reason, though that may be an issue later down the road, I can't say.

I will say that this breaking down the gender roles may be hurting traditional marriage, family, and so on. Hell, it doesn't have to be traditional either. Divorce rates continue to rise and I think this may be the main source of that problem. If both are trying to be career people, who's going to keep the homestead in order? (and vice versa). This becomes more problematic when children come along.

And don't start saying how "that's what babysitters and daycares are for". Do you know how many times I've been on these forums and when something goes wrong like a school shooting, kids buying mature games and putting games (in large) at risk in supreme court, and all the other issues revolving around kids and everyone here blames the parents and their lack of parenting? (long question). I'm thinking that, at least in the early years, there should be a parent in the relationship who is willing to be more of the parenting figure and make sure their kids are raised by someone responsible rather than hoping they'll grow-up fine through daycares and babysitters.


EDIT:

Also, I'm finding it funny people are calling the OP out on the whole "protecting Women" thing. I say this because whenever I'm around people and a girlfriend of mine is getting mocked or something, I've tended to stay out of it because the people she's dealing with are idiots and me getting involved will only add fuel to the fire. Yet, I still get chastised for not stepping in and doing something (ie protecting her from the idiots). I'll just say it, women are indecisive and annoying at times and this is a good example of that.