Ask a Christian Theologian

[KaZZaP]

What do you think about dinosaurs, according to the christian belief system the world is only somthing like three or five thousand years old. And where you you think fossil fuel comes from?

 

[teh_gunslinger]

Okay, thought I'd retry this thread now that the other one has died.

Basically, feel free to ask me anything about the Christian faith - how it works, why we believe what we believe, technicalities of faith etc. Essentially, I'll explain to you from a Christian perspective. This is an attempt at an intelligent conversation between a Christian and a non-Christian to clear up different issues.

What I am not here for is to be abused or argued with, because I am presenting my faith - take it or leave it. If you don't have the respect and courtesy to be civil then I won't reply to your question. That said, the more challenging or surprising the question, the more of a pleasure this will be. Also, I won't take kindly to baiting questions eg. "why do you believe stupid stuff/why are you an idiot/why don't Christians stone homosexuals etc"

If you ask a question, then understand that what I have given you is what I believe and the Christian perspective. You may disagree, but the point of this thread isn't to argue over the validity of my faith, but to actually find out what Christians believe.

Similarly, please don't make this another prop 8/gay marriage related thread; we have numerous running at this time.

Essentially, you respect me and I respect you!

Lastly, my background:

I have a great interest in my faith and the theology of it to a point where I received a degree in it from a respected university.
I spend most of my time between Australia and England.
I am a reformed, evangelical, conservative Christian. (aka bible based)
I became a Christian at the age of 17, having been raised in a moralistic environment.
My passions are psychology, writing, literature, fashion modeling, aesthetic, industrial design, video games, art, fitness/health and my girlfriend.

I got half way through all of this before I relised I hadn't the stomach for anymore of it.

I'm just left with one question? What good is a degree in theology if you revert to "it's the truth because the Bible says so" arguments? I would have thought that a degree from "a respected university" would enable you to be more objective? It may be that I frequent a different kind of university (also I study history) but I would be academecaly slaughtered for such weak ass arguments. Seriously, if I bring any kind of personal preference into my work it's instafail.
I realise that this thread is not an academic discussion, and that's a good thing, but from the original post I would have expected a bit more neutrality (calling catholics heretics is not neutral). You said that we could ask and "actually find out what Christians believe." No, we could find out what random doctrine you subscribe to. Not the same thing.
You discard a lot of important questions on the grounds that the old testament is not part of christian doctrine? So we can choose what parts to adhere to? You claim that it's some kind of preface to the new one? Bull crap I say! Then a lot of stupid rules should be discarded.
Just one last thing, you talk about a biography about Chuchill would include bits about Hitler. It would, but it would be quite clear what shit Hitler did and what Churchill did. And if the author was just a half assed historian references, notes and bibliography would be included as well as a preface and introduction to explain the book.
I call some kind of very sophisticated troll.

Also: Labyrinth: I think you would fetch a fair price at any smart buyer.

 

[Tranka Verrane]

The thing is, to have a concrete faith, you have to know what you believe - it isn't foolishness to hold a belief based on empirical evidence (within Biblical validity). Ie. the best understand War and Peace, I'd get Tolstoy's original manuscripts in the Russian.

The bible is barely evidence at all (the old testament, anyway). It is a thing you choose to believe. I have never chosen to believe anything in my life. I believe it, or I don't. If I catch myself making myself believe something then it obviously isn't that strong a belief.

To many people I would be considered Christian.

Do you believe Jesus was the son of God who died for the sins of the world that whoever believes in Him may have eternal life? If not, you're not. That's what the bible says.

You are being obtuse. I said many people. I didn't say you would. How many agnostics from a muslim, jewish, or hindu background could you identify?

If God doesn't exist then Christianity is pointless. No God = no heaven, no hell, no Jesus etc.

Well duh. Although again, plenty of christians dispute the existence of hell. But again this is you touting your own brand again.

And I've turned off notification from this thread now. Have fun.

 

[Dele]

The difference between murder and the God killing a sinner? Quite simply in that the sinner has committed a horrendous crime against a just God, and murder is unjustified killing. On the topic of rape, I can easily use your view of synonymity between words to say sex (consensual sex) is the same as rape.

It is God's will in conversion so yes. Is that unjust? Well for starters God chooses unconditionally. And if you still think thats unjust, ask yourself if you would like to be forgiven and go to heaven to be with God for eternity. If so, repent. If not, then there isn't a problem for you because you don't seem to want it.

People have equally used atheism to cause horrendous crimes. The ideology of atheism has driven powers such as the soviet union for example. And with this, I bid you goodnight. Got an unnaturally early start tomorrow

Well if you think there is no difference in murder by god (or by his name) and a regular murder, then I dont believe this discussion will lead anywhere. Gotta clear up your facts about mother Russia though link. [http://atheism.about.com/od/isatheismdangerous/a/AtheismKilled.htm]

 

[sneakypenguin]

Side note I don't agree with Max's Calvinistic predestination view(if people are predestined then why would I need to share the good news?) I believe that God is omnipotent and knows who will be saved but that all men have the option to accept God or reject Him. Christ died for all men not just an elect few.

I'm happy for you to disagree on that. As long as you believe the fundamentals of the Bible, I'm happy for Arminians. I will say that you might like to check out the "Tulip seminars" by John Piper. It might better explain why I'm calvinist.

Don't have the time to check out the John Piper thing(schoolwork and work regulates me to pretty much little Wiki articles)

But what about all these verses that point to salvation being available to all?

John 6:37 Him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

Romans 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the Gospel of Christ for it is the power of God unto salvation to everyone that believeth.

2Peter 3:9 .... not willing that any should perish but that all should come to repentance.

And if people are predestined(ie selected) to be saved that would also then make the call to witness (at the end of the gospel(the go ye into all the world passage) obsolete.
Pauls missionary journey would also have been pointless if people are going to be saved based on some arbitrary selection by God, then there is nothing man can do to change that.

 

[PatientGrasshopper]

I am a reformed, evangelical, conservative Christian. (aka bible based)

With this in mind, what's your opinion on the conflicting literal interpretation of the Genesis Universe starting story and scientific evidence such as Carbon Dating and the like?

Carbon Dating has been proven to be inaccurate. They took lava rock from Mt. Saint Hellen an carbon dated it and it said it was far older than it actually was.

 

[sneakypenguin]

I don't really think that the bible would need to mention dinosaurs seeing as they are 60+ million years ago from the the earliest accounts of abraham's descendents. As for the flood, I would say to you that the flood wasn't local (which is a strongly held view among many evangelical scholars. But i told myself I'd grab some much needed sleep so sleep I will.

Who do you think Jesus is Tranka?

Actually one could argue that the bible does indeed mention dinosaurs. Or one could say it's a figurative passage. Just throwing this out there
In job 40:
15 ¶ Behold now behemoth, which I made with thee; he eateth grass as an ox.
16 Lo now, his strength [is] in his loins, and his force [is] in the navel of his belly.
17 He moveth his tail like a cedar: the sinews of his stones are wrapped together.
18 His bones [are as] strong pieces of brass; his bones [are] like bars of iron.
19 He [is] the chief of the ways of God: he that made him can make his
sword to approach [unto him].
20 Surely the mountains bring him forth food, where all the beasts of the field play.
21 He lieth under the shady trees, in the covert of the reed, and fens.
22 The shady trees cover him [with] their shadow; the willows of the brook
compass him about.
23 Behold, he drinketh up a river, [and] hasteth not: he trusteth that he
can draw up Jordan into his mouth.
24 He taketh it with his eyes: [his] nose pierceth through snares

And in chapter 41 (talking to Job)
1 Canst thou draw out leviathan with an hook? or his tongue with a cord which thou lettest down?
2 Canst thou put an hook into his nose? or bore his jaw through with a thorn?
3 Will he make many supplications unto thee? will he speak soft words unto thee?
4 Will he make a covenant with thee? wilt thou take him for a servant for ever?
5 Wilt thou play with him as with a bird? or wilt thou bind him for thy maidens?
6 Shall the companions make a banquet of him? shall they part him among the merchants?
7 Canst thou fill his skin with barbed irons? or his head with fish spears?
8 Lay thine hand upon him, remember the battle, do no more.
9 Behold, the hope of him is in vain: shall not one be cast down even at the sight of him?
10 None is so fierce that dare stir him up: who then is able to stand before me?
11 Who hath prevented me, that I should repay him? whatsoever is under the whole heaven is mine.
12 I will not conceal his parts, nor his power, nor his comely proportion.
13 Who can discover the face of his garment? or who can come to him with his double bridle?
14 Who can open the doors of his face? his teeth are terrible round about.
15 His scales are his pride, shut up together as with a close seal.
16 One is so near to another, that no air can come between them.
17 They are joined one to another, they stick together, that they cannot be sundered.
(eliminated the by his neesings a light doeth shine part as most people would missread that as fire breathing)
22 In his neck remaineth strength, and sorrow is turned into joy before him.
23 The flakes of his flesh are joined together: they are firm in themselves; they cannot be moved.
24 His heart is as firm as a stone; yea, as hard as a piece of the nether millstone.
25 When he raiseth up himself, the mighty are afraid: by reason of breakings they purify themselves.
26 The sword of him that layeth at him cannot hold: the spear, the dart, nor the habergeon.
27 He esteemeth iron as straw, and brass as rotten wood.
28 The arrow cannot make him flee: slingstones are turned with him into stubble.
29 Darts are counted as stubble: he laugheth at the shaking of a spear.
30 Sharp stones are under him: he spreadeth sharp pointed things upon the mire.
31 He maketh the deep to boil like a pot: he maketh the sea like a pot of ointment.
32 He maketh a path to shine after him; one would think the deep to be hoary.
33 Upon earth there is not his like, who is made without fear.
34 He beholdeth all high things: he is a king over all the children of pride.

 

[maximilian]

Hi - thanks for an interesting thread folks. I shall try and keep my questions as non-confrontational as possible.

To go back to the point of the original post, I have a couple of subjects I'd like to understand a little better from the Christian perspective. So, to start with the biggie. . .

The Resurrection. My simplistic understanding of the Resurrection is that Jesus died in an unpleasant way in order to create a "new covenant" so that man's sins can be forgiven, and that this was almost like one final "sacrifice". I've always been a little confused as to why it was really necessary. . . I guess the death and resurrection is almost like a big show to make everyone take notice? I guess what I've never really understood though is what was so special about it. Jesus was executed by crucifiction, but it's not like they invented it just for him, it was a standard way of disposing of people. And God didn't really "sacrifice" him, as 3 days later he gets him back again. I suppose what I'm saying is, I don't quite see the big picture. He comes back to life to prove he's God? And the new covenant required spilling of blood?

Hi mate, I hope I can do your questions some justice. Essentially, the Bible states that Jesus HAD to rise from the dead in order to forgive the sins of the world (after dying for them), because it proved he was the son of God. The idea is that Jesus goes to hell for our sins and then rises again having "defeated death".

My other question is. . . Hell. . . what's it for? My understanding of punishment is that it is reforming. You tell off a naughty child to change their behaviour. You imprison a criminal to try and get them not to do it again. In some countries when people are so bad we don't know what to do with them, they are executed to dispose of them. Hell seems more like the latter - a dumping place for people beyond any measure of help. There's the concept of pergatory that I don't know so much about, which I guess is for reforming those who can be saved?

First off, purgatory and the concept of it is not actually biblical. As a reformed Christian, I'd stipulate that the idea of purgatory was augmented into Catholic tradition with the understanding that relatives could get indulgences and contribute (often financially) to the church so that their relatives would go through from purgatory to heaven. Sort of like a hostage system.

Bakc to hell:
The idea of the Bible is that it's cyclical. God makes something good, we stuff it up. During this time of rebellion, God guided his people and reformed them over and over. However, they kept screwing up. To this end he then opened up salvation to all who repent and believe. With this "last measure" in mind, the concept of Hell is the place for those people who do not repent and turn to God. The word "hell" isn't entirely biblical, but the place or existence it describes is. It's essentially a place where only God's wrath is present and it is eternal. It is the punishment for not repenting. Of course, people may see this as unfair - but to that end, all you have to do to escape it is become a Christian... So logically, it's not unavoidable at all.

But Hell itself, eternal torment? Why bother? If you want rid of those people, snap them out of existance. If you want to reform them, why is it eternal? Since we on Earth cannot see Hell, it cannot serve as an example to us - or at least no more than God pretending there's a hell and telling us that to make us behave. Is there some aspect to hell beyond the eternal torment that I don't get. . . because it looks like God just enjoys tormenting folks for eternity for the sake of it. It doesn't appear to achieve anything.

It isn't so much reforming, but being made completely new. God chose to make the earth and that's where the story begins. Unfortunately, the only answer the Bible gives us as a "why?" is that it is for His glory.
Please do not think that because Hell exists, God enjoys eternal torment. The logic is that God is an all powerful being and that His word is His word. He is Just, and for Him to be Just he has to punish the unjust. He does not enjoy it, but for Him to be Just, he must.

Regardless of how wise a being may be, if your the only one of your kind in existence, how can you create species or angels, how do you understand the idea of "more than one" if god himself, the christian god, has never encountered another of itself ever?

Essentially it goes with the territory of being "all knowing". It's a fascinating logical imposition that would definitely adhere to a human being - but if God's understanding and knowledge are infinite, then it doesn't pose a constriction. Good question.

To the OP:

As you were raised as a non-Christian what are your views on relationships with non-Christians. Do you think they can work or do you have to share your life with someone who has the exact same belief system as you? Also what effect would you think this have on your children, if you had some?

Yeah this is a really good question. My personal understanding is that it's going to be a hard marriage if you are married to a non-Christian. The Bible is super specific on how men and women should behave within the God ordained marriage relationship (I mean regarding ideas of forgiveness, respect, mutual selflessness etc.) Of course, many secular marriages contain these qualities, but the biggest issue is WHY each partner is the way they are. Similarly, if you take the logic that eternal life is the best thing ever, then it would be heartbreaking to know that the wife/husband you love and care for would not be there with you at the end of the day. I generally believe that is a relationship to be avoided.

Can one of the Christian Theologians/intellectuals explain a few things for me (my knowledge in this area lacking a little).

Firstly: What is the difference between Protestants and Catholics. (On a side note what are the other main groups in the Christian Religion over view)

http://www.victorious.org/chur40.htm this is helpful. The denominations are a whole other question which I'm afraid I can't answer.

Secondly: Do you take the Bible as total truth or what?

Yes. We have to in order to claim any sort of spiritual integrity. Otherwise, all we're basing ourselves on is our own invention. Say what you want about Biblical validity, hermeneutics etc.

Thirdly: Even though you are Christians do you believe in evolution or are you automatically considered wrong by the rest of christianity if you do believe in evolution?

If you can answer those then thanks for clearing it up.

No worries. Essentially, what proponents of atheism want you to believe is that evolution and Christianity are at war. It isn't the case. There are hundreds of theories of evolution and a huge number of them are either pro or neutral to the idea of a created evolution. However, obviously atheistic evolution, as well as certain nuances of certain evolution theories may inherently undermine a creator to an extent of an individuals understanding of Genesis 1 and 2.

Hello my fellow believer.

Do you, like I, believe that The Crusades were in truth a beautiful effort and a great face for Christianity despite what other non-believers think?

I'll reply to other Christians questions in PM to keep this fairly organised.

No. I want you to answer this here infront of everybody please.

"I think that the crusaders used their seeming association with Christianity as the reason for greedy land grabbing and committing violent, evil acts which they justified to their contemporaries (who were ignorant of what Christianity actually taught) through religious validation. Note, nowhere does the Bible tell Christians to pillage, kill etc."

 

[PatientGrasshopper]

I am a reformed, evangelical, conservative Christian. (aka bible based)

With this in mind, what's your opinion on the conflicting literal interpretation of the Genesis Universe starting story and scientific evidence such as Carbon Dating and the like?

Carbon Dating has been proven to be inaccurate. They took lava rock from Mt. Saint Hellen an carbon dated it and it said it was far older than it actually was.

How about plate tectonics?

I don't have a problem with plate tectonics, and in fact it is in harmony with the Bible where it says God formed all the land in one place.

 

[Erana]

What, exactly, does the Bible say about other religions that worship the same God, specifically on the matter of cohabitation? (IE: Judaism and Islam?)

 

[Solo508]

"I think that the crusaders used their seeming association with Christianity as the reason for greedy land grabbing and committing violent, evil acts which they justified to their contemporaries (who were ignorant of what Christianity actually taught) through religious validation. Note, nowhere does the Bible tell Christians to pillage, kill etc."

I really wasn't expecting that. I respect you for that.

 

[Anoos]

Whats with everyone being bastards in the bible(well not everyone) i.e The story in the bible, i think kings, I'm not actually religious, Abraham calls upon she bears the "rent asunder" or some shit 42 kids for calling him "baldy". No shit, whats up with that, why would God decide that's a good idea?

 

[maximilian]

http://www.thenazareneway.com/ - hey they call the Nazarene a part of the Essenes
http://www.essene.com/ - another one
http://www.essene.org/Yahowshua_or_Paul.htm
http://minuteswithmessiah.tripod.com/question/nazarene.html


i could find more google has tons of links

Yeah, and there are no actual recognized religious professors or scholars behind any of them.

actually what i believe is irrelevant here and has nothing to do with the subject at hand, also i never said that about the old testament i simply asked why you said it was the law of god and yet you don't think it's correct or truthful. as for my knowledge, why not try search google and some history books and even your own bible

Actually, what you believe is important because you obviously subscribe to a fringe essene cult/understanding of the bible that no real scholar would ever take seriously - hence noone having heard of it before and it being excluded as a followed religion. Look at the original intention of this thread. Your "questions" were merely an invitation to you to start yelling about unproven, ridiculous Essene stipulation. Also, if this is the case, it means that you're here to aggressively convert me - in what is essentially an "ask a Christian thread". What I don't think is correct of truthful is pulling out numbers and massive generalisations from the bible and parading them as fact. I don't read Winston Churchill's biography and assume he was a great prime minister because the biography ended on the 568th page. Additionally, if you're so "right", then this isn't the place to be "right" - it's a place to find out about Christianity, not Essene. Start an Essene thread and see how many people you get. But you won't, you just want to feed off this. Oh, and if anyone takes issue with me addressing Cleverlymadeup in this way, perhaps you'd like to PM him, or post in his essene thread to find the truth.
And now you're going to claim that I'm personally attacking you. I'm not, I'm just asking if you'd take your bizarre fringe belief and tiresome tone elsewhere as you clearly have no intention of contributing to the thread in line with the OP.

i'm simply asking you why you say editing the bible corrupts it and yet the version was have has been severely edited and changed over the years, including when it was decided by man

so again how can you say that adapting the bible is wrong and something that is not christianity and yet the bible has been edited MANY MANY times over the year, not withstanding the translations

look up someone by the name of q he was one of the many authors of the bible

Read Clint Eastwood's post or some Nicean council history. Nevertheless, I'm going to stop answering you because it is draining my will to live.

What is your favourite colour?
Were your parents Christian?
Would you KILL for your religion?

Red and white combo.
No. They are now.
No. Never.

Back on topic, which sect of Christianity has the burning cross as their symbol, and why is it their symbol?

I believe it's the Ku Klux Klan, from memory. And it's their symbol because they're trying to justify their racism and hatred by associating with religious iconography.

 

[PatientGrasshopper]

What, exactly, does the Bible say about other religions that worship the same God, specifically on the matter of cohabitation? (IE: Judaism and Islam?)

They don't really worship the same God even the Jews and Muslims will tell you that as well.

 

[maximilian]

What, exactly, does the Bible say about other religions that worship the same God, specifically on the matter of cohabitation? (IE: Judaism and Islam?)

This applies to really all religions. - That we are to love them as ourselves. Also, that we are to be gracious to them and tolerate their beliefs where it does not infringe upon the correct teaching of the Bible or proclaiming the gospel - ie. no teachers of other religions telling us to teach something other than christianity in a christian church etc. If they do infringe upon this, we are to non-violently and respectfully ask them to halt or move away from that. Essentially, we're to preach the good news whilst upholding to love them. Therefore, if I tell you the gospel, and you disagree, I'm not going to start yelling, berating or hitting you. I may try to explain a little bit more but I'm not going to harass you. It's a question of civility and social awareness.

NOTE: I really want to answer the rest of these, but it's 2 am and my plane leaves for Sydney (a 26 hours flight) in 7 hours. I'll enjoy replying when I'm in a state of restedness and most able.

Thanks.

 

[Isaac Dodgson]

Whether it's been asked before or not i could care, I wish to ask

As a catholic myself, my beliefs in such are there for my own personal and emotional reasons and events, those of which i do not wish to discuss. However, I know i've come to this realization and I wonder if you have as well... At the end of the day, how do you feel that all of it, everything you've ever been taught, and have come to understand to be true about this religion, or religion in general, that all of it could, not saying it is, but could be complete and utter bullshit? I don't mean this on a condescending matter, not in the slightest actually, but rather is this constant test of faith enough to keep you grounded? or do you blindly follow fully believing in all of it as fact instead of the reality where the chance that it's not all true still exists

 

[Erana]

What, exactly, does the Bible say about other religions that worship the same God, specifically on the matter of cohabitation? (IE: Judaism and Islam?)

They don't really worship the same God even the Jews and Muslims will tell you that as well.

It IS the same God. Christians are really Jews who believe that Jesus is their Savior (Among the other things in the New Testament). Islam also worships the same God. They even acknowledge Jesus, but they believe that he was a prophet, not the Son of God.

To say that they worship different Gods is to say that Baptists and Catholics worship different ones.