Audio Logs are terrible.

[Treblaine]

I know I shouldn't complain about something like this. After all, it's one of those things that we should appreciate about a game with depth greater than another Halo or COD game, but they are still awful in how they are usually executed. And there is nothing wrong with a straight action shooter, but there have been a lot less bioshocks than some might prefer.

I mean in Bioshock I found an audio recording of the villain gloating to nobody but their audio diary how dastardly clever their plan was... I mean this person recorded their own confession! Most of the time these logs are interminably tedious and boring to get through, they are just so unnatural trying to get characters to just monologue in any kind of natural and compelling way.

Logs clearly don't work trying to transfer what one person knows into what the player knows. People don't simply record down what they know and think for plot convenience.

I know games are not films, but this is one lesson games could do with learning from films, that good exposition comes from DIALOGUE. People asking questions and getting replies. Yes, Shakespeare mastered the soliloquy, but he definitely broke the 4th wall and had to be quite poetic to do that... plus he was Shakespeare.

Really, if the character isn't talking to the player, they need to be talking to someone else. This is the only natural way that information can really get out.

I mean there are such better alternatives:

-Conspirators would have their phones bugged, find those recordings and learn about their plans.
-Evil organisations would have evil meetings, they'd probably be recorded for evil minute keeping.
-Intercepted radio communications from between a duo of adventurers, where you can discover their characters long before meeting them.
-An informant might wear a wire and searching a body for loot you might find their recording device, along with their last few conversations... the one's leading to their death.

One sided conversations can, I think, work for VERY brief snippets, like a message left on a phone, something like "If things get any worse, meet me by Dock 18 tonight... I may have a way out of here!". Messages left for the playable character must be above all else balanced for brevity.

I never want to listen through another stilted audio-log waiting for them to reveal the code for a door, usually as soon as they

It would be okay if it was hilariously bad, like Resident Evil 1


But it isn't, most of the audio logs in such games are simply passably dull.


PS: what do you think about this? Good? bad? What's the solution or improvement?

 

[Dryk]

Logs clearly don't work trying to transfer what one person knows into what the player knows. People don't simply record down what they know and think for plot convenience.

They've been doing it in diaries in TV and movies for years

You make a good point, I've never really thought about it before

 

[Treblaine]

Logs clearly don't work trying to transfer what one person knows into what the player knows. People don't simply record down what they know and think for plot convenience.

They've been doing it in diaries in TV and movies for years

You make a good point, I've never really thought about it before

Yeah... but they make up such a tiny part of any movie and it's generally frowned upon to have any large part of exposition or characterisation as any sort of direct monologue.

I remember reading a review of the recut of Blade Runner which removed the narration they said it was much better and talked about how the narration dub was against both the will of the director and the lead actor, it was purely at he behest of the studio. That it was much better without FOrd narrating to explain what's going on.

It seems the only narrator that is appreciated is the unreliable narrator, where what the narrator says jars with what is demonstrated in the story. In other words, the exposition is never left JUST down to the monologuing.

I'm really peeved off about this as I've gone back to Metal Gear Solid and loved the dialogue in cutscenes and codec calls (though sometimes a bit hammy, always engaging) yet going back to Bioshock I can't bear the tedium of listening to not a single sentence of those audio diaries. Even the radio in my ear is un-engaging as I'm only ever being talked at, I'm not pining for the end of silent protagonists, just how it doesn't work with the one sided communication.

Metal Gear Solid was subtle in giving player interactive power. Say you selected a weapon and actively called your weapons expert contact, she'd tell you an engaging tale about that weapon. I remember I was looking around the snowfield in MGS1 after the helicopter fight and found a parachute, I called my commander and there was a conversation about the possibility that my opponent had survived.

That was interesting, there was a game in that, to look around the environment to find things and on my own initiative start a dialogue about that. This can still be done with a silent protagonist, just hold an item or look at something and call your contacts list, they'll may take the cue to say something to say about it... And importantly they are they are saying it to you, someone who is likely an outsider or just doesn't know what they know.

 

[Treblaine]

Audio logs are just a storytelling gimmick. They work pretty well for backstory, but as most gaming trends, they tend to get overused to the point of hatred.

So do you think it's something that can or should be done in moderation?

Me personally here? I wouldn't consider even a single example of it to be bad and each incident only tolerable by how you could ignore it.

I'd hate it for a character's back story to be revealed by the contrivance that they literally tell their back story into an audio diary, for no reason. Especially back stories they don't want everyone to find about about which might happen if someone takes their audio diary. The way I see back stories being revealed is when they are relevant, companion reveals why they are afraid to go on, or when challenged on why they are here in the first place.

One thing about "back story" is it's VERY DIFFERENT from "Life Story" we don't need to know about every irrelevant detail about their lives, even if it adds to their character. Only what pertains to their current situation, their current story they are in. That almost necessitates the context of dialogue to ask about them.

And I think this could be far more effectively done with flashbacks. People may rag on Lost for how many flashbacks there are, but consider the alternatives, if huge parts of the story were the actors just sitting there explaining what happened. That may work for a book as either way you are reading, but a film is a visual medium. In the book "Interview with a Vampire" most of the book is dialogue, the titular vampire speaking to the writer... but in the film adaptation it became flashback with occasional narration.

But that's film, games could do with something else. Like you actually playing through a flashback of another character though shifting perspective from first person to third person.

I do agree that overall audio-logs are gimmicks in games, it's something that seems good but isn't valuable in practice. As in "Our game's so great! It's got over 100 hours of audio logs!" but you wouldn't want to listen to most of it.

 

[Fappy]

Finally! Someone else feels the same way about this!

Before I first tried Bioshock I kept hearing how the audio logs really help support it's dark and unique atmosphere. When I actually played the game... I hated them. It's not just audio logs either. I just apparently hate when most of the story in a game is told through monologue. One of the worst stories I have ever experienced in a game was Modern Warfare 2, not only because it showcased writing on the level of a Steven Seagal movie, but because most of the story is either given to you in loading screen briefs or by people yelling in your face/over radios. It was impossible to tell what the fuck was going on for half the time.

 

[Baron Tanks]

Let me throw this in there, while I agree with the overuse/bad execution points, I really enjoyed them in the Arkham games... So whether that's rule or exception, I'm leaving up to everybody else.

 

[SonicWaffle]

I mean in Bioshock I found an audio recording of the villain gloating to nobody but their audio diary how dastardly clever their plan was... I mean this person recorded their own confession!

In all fairness to Bioshock, everyone who was leaving these messages was pretty much bugfuck insane anyway. Talking to a tape recorded isn't that much different from talking to yourself, which might well be what they were doing without realising they were being recorded. See also;

Let me throw this in there, while I agree with the overuse/bad execution points, I really enjoyed them in the Arkham games... So whether that's rule or exception, I'm leaving up to everybody else.

The audio logs in Batman games are also almost universally recorded by utter raving lunatics who'd be wearing pants on their head if they actually had the mental capacity to understand the concept. I'm more willing to accept an audio log from such a character, because for all you know they do believe themselves to be characters in a video game leaving messages for a player. They're completely snooker loopy.

PS: what do you think about this? Good? bad? What's the solution or improvement?

On the whole, I'm with you. Despite my prior argument that sometimes I'm OK with them, I find them irritating as a narrative concept, particularly in Bioshock. I'd have rather found text files I could store and read at my leisure, because when I'm alone and paranoid in a city full of dangerous nutters who want to murder my tits, the last thing I want is audio narration. How am I supposed to pay attention when I'm busy backing into a corner and sweeping the barrel of a shotgun at every shadow?

Solution...I don't know. In a game that emphasises solitude, I think text is the only way to go. Dishnoured has a really weird way of doing this, where you can find entirely plausible diaries or documents lying around, but then you'll also occasionally stumble upon a brief audio diary someone had left lying around. In games where there are more characters, more dialogue is probably the answer, because at least then they can tell you they learned the information from someone else.

 

[Treblaine]

Finally! Someone else feels the same way about this!

Before I first tried Bioshock I kept hearing how the audio logs really help support it's dark and unique atmosphere. When I actually played the game... I hated them. It's not just audio logs either. I just apparently hate when most of the story in a game is told through monologue. One of the worst stories I have ever experienced in a game was Modern Warfare 2, not only because it showcased writing on the level of a Steven Seagal movie, but because most of the story is either given to you in loading screen briefs or by people yelling in your face/over radios. It was impossible to tell what the fuck was going on for half the time.

[HEADING=2]RAMIREZ![/HEADING]

[HEADING=2]Would you kindly...[/HEADING]

*Spoilers within, but seriously to anyone reading this, you've had over half a decade to play Bioshock. Darth Vader is Luke's father, Rosebud was his Sled, etc, etc*

I don't think Bioshock can get away with such an element with "ironic" use or orders barked over radio, especially the way they introduced it, just suddenly the idea that in this universe people can have their minds controlled with code-words. And that just doesn't make sense, if I would do anything he said under mind control then why make up the bullshit about his family in peril? Which was a terrible reason anyway, that I should kill my way through so many people just to save two people I've never met, but if he's a con-man manipulator, why the direct mind control element?

It's a gimmick, and it goes against the entire theme of the game of the problem with free will in a society all about unfettered freedoms when people are deceived, but Jack wasn't deceived, he had his free will removed by utter contrivance.

Bioshock I really like in concept, but in practice... eeeeerr. I'm disliking it more and more every time I reconsider it. I seemed to be much more hopeful for it's potential than it's actual execution.

 

[TheSapphireKnight]

Its funny you mention Halo because those games tend to have some of the best audio logs/story expanding goodies. ODST in particular had a bunch of audio logs that had a self-contained story that added additional context to the main story in a very natural way.

It made sense why there would be audio logs around and why you might try and find them, it even changes how the story and gameplay play out a bit.

I don't tend to care for the audio logs like you mention where they have characters just leaving important information strewn about. Dishonored had this problem where you would be listening to these personal audio logs of these characters while they were in the same room and there were few that were a little awkward to listen to...

 

[Fappy]

-Snip-

I just appreciate it for it's atmosphere. They nailed the look, sound and feel of Rapture. Unfortunately most of the rest of the game is somewhat uninspired in my mind. I actually let a friend finish the game for me (I watched) after getting halfway through since I just got... bored. The ONLY time I have ever done that with any game.

 

[Smertnik]

I think audio logs can work (as mentioned above, they did kinda make sense in Arkham games, for instance) but yeah, usually they suck. To look at a recent example, the logs in Tomb Raider are extremely silly. You have diaries lying all over the island, sometimes in places the authors never had access to, and sometimes addressed to people who have no way of receiving the messages. And why would you scatter small pieces of your diary where ever you go? Who even writes diaries these days?


If you have to include logs you should at least do it in a logical way. In Human Revolution, for instance (or original Deus Ex, for that matter), you can find out all kinds of information from reading other people's mail. And the way it's presented makes sense - it's people writing to each other about their stuff. And in addition to that you have data discs/newspapers lying around living/working quarters that provide background information about the world and technology. That's how it should be done. I should not be finding tapes from the villain all over some sewers explaining his life story bit by bit.

 

[aguspal]

I dunno...


Some of the audio logs in Borderlands where pretty damn hilarious and interesting. Also Bioshock, in somewhat the same vien, pretty interesting and hilarious.


Come to think about it, I completly disagree. I like them.

 

[Fappy]

I think audio logs can work (as mentioned above, they did kinda make sense in Arkham games, for instance) but yeah, usually they suck. To look at a recent example, the logs in Tomb Raider are extremely silly. You have diaries lying all over the island, sometimes in places the authors never had access to, and sometimes addressed to people who have no way of receiving the messages. And why would you scatter small pieces of your diary where ever you go? Who even writes diaries these days?


If you have to include logs you should at least do it in a logical way. In Human Revolution, for instance (or original Deus Ex, for that matter), you can find out all kinds of information from reading other people's mail. And the way it's presented makes sense - it's people writing to each other about their stuff. And in addition to that you have data discs lying around living/working quarters that provide background information about the world and technology. That's how it should be done. I should not be finding tapes from the villain all over some sewers explaining his life story bit by bit.

Good examples. Others include the Mass Effect and TES franchises. In Elder Scrolls games you generally just find notes, actual diaries and books scattered around. In Mass Effect (though it got worse as the franchise went on) they were generally just surveillance videos or emails. They also generally didn't tell the whole story to you, they just added details to support it.

 

[fezgod]

The Ulysses audio logs from Fallout: New Vegas are pretty good examples of audio logs that make sense, since its implied that he is deliberately leaving them for you to find, allowing him to send you a message.

 

[Treblaine]

I mean in Bioshock I found an audio recording of the villain gloating to nobody but their audio diary how dastardly clever their plan was... I mean this person recorded their own confession!

In all fairness to Bioshock, everyone who was leaving these messages was pretty much bugfuck insane anyway. Talking to a tape recorded isn't that much different from talking to yourself, which might well be what they were doing without realising they were being recorded. See also;

Oh come on, that's as bad as the Bond villain excuse of "I'll tell you my plan as it's too late to stop it and you'll be dead soon anyway, muuuaah ha ha ha!"

And the Villain Bioshcok wasn't so careless anywhere else, he didn't brake character not for a second in all the other times he spoke to you. I mean in the actual recording someone walks in on him spelling out exactly what he did.


"ooh, Mrs McKlintock! What'r you doing here?"

PS: what do you think about this? Good? bad? What's the solution or improvement?

On the whole, I'm with you. Despite my prior argument that sometimes I'm OK with them, I find them irritating as a narrative concept, particularly in Bioshock. I'd have rather found text files I could store and read at my leisure, because when I'm alone and paranoid in a city full of dangerous nutters who want to murder my tits, the last thing I want is audio narration. How am I supposed to pay attention when I'm busy backing into a corner and sweeping the barrel of a shotgun at every shadow?

Solution...I don't know. In a game that emphasises solitude, I think text is the only way to go. Dishnoured has a really weird way of doing this, where you can find entirely plausible diaries or documents lying around, but then you'll also occasionally stumble upon a brief audio diary someone had left lying around. In games where there are more characters, more dialogue is probably the answer, because at least then they can tell you they learned the information from someone else.

I think the idea with audio logs is they can just play on in the background as you go on with other things like searching around for supplies.

I still think there is room for audio recordings, just not such blatant exposition "I'm going to make this recording" kind of recordings.

Bugged phones, Minutes of a meeting, Informant's "wire", Intercepted radio-transmissions, things like that. That's how you get things from people from before.

Writing would be good but very few people keep a diary.

How am I supposed to pay attention when I'm busy backing into a corner and sweeping the barrel of a shotgun at every shadow?

If only there were many of those moments in bioshock. It should have been a game where you were genuinely afraid of such things, but as it is you just plough through them and usually a single sweep of an area and only the occasional straggler with wander upon you and they aren't a problem to deal with.

 

[Genocidicles]

I think Dishonored was bad about this, what with the 'spy master' villain keeping incriminating evidence that would get himself executed just lying around.

 

[Treblaine]

Its funny you mention Halo because those games tend to have some of the best audio logs/story expanding goodies. ODST in particular had a bunch of audio logs that had a self-contained story that added additional context to the main story in a very natural way.

It made sense why there would be audio logs around and why you might try and find them, it even changes how the story and gameplay play out a bit.

I don't tend to care for the audio logs like you mention where they have characters just leaving important information strewn about. Dishonored had this problem where you would be listening to these personal audio logs of these characters while they were in the same room and there were few that were a little awkward to listen to...

Of course ODST! I shall have to Edit the OP.

But I liked ODST for many of the reasons that I hear hardcore Halo fans hated it, it's very storytelling structure. I guess it goes to show how it's not inherent to the developers, it's in their approach.

Those audio logs showed exactly how to do it, problem with that was the audio-logs were just a bit TOO well hidden! If only I hadn't lost my copy, I shall have to play through the game again to find all the audio-logs. But one expectation I had was that they tied in with the actual story a bit more rather than simply being a parallel and (as far as I can tell from not getting all the logs) and unconnected story.

Though it certainly gave the impression that New Mombassa was a living city. It wasn't helped by how the actual game was as far as I can tell COMPLETELY de-populated, I only saw Soldiers and Covenant.

I'm starting to think audio logs are put in because they are easy... but at the same time I don't think developers really think about WHY they are putting them in.

I'd put them in for how they reveal snippets of the story and environment, to make it seem more alive after you may arrive there only when all hell has broken loose and everyone is either dead or evacuated and only combatants are left.

 

[Elijin]

There are games that do it well, and games that dont do it well. Just like most things in gaming. Pretty unfair to just smack a 'These dont work' label on them, only provide examples where they didnt work, then contented walk away like you achieved something.

Zero research, audio logs that work (entirely from memory):
Borderlands Games.
Dead Space Games.
Arkham Batman Games.
HALO ODST.
Portal 2.

Thats instantly 9 games which did it well, only going off my personal experience and dodgy memory!

So yeah, they can be done poorly, or great. I will acknowledge you have covered a good list of "How not to" for audio logs, but I wont agree they're universally bad.

Edit, added portal 2, because those are hilarious even though some of them breach your rules.

 

[Casual Shinji]

Finally! Someone else feels the same way about this!

Before I first tried Bioshock I kept hearing how the audio logs really help support it's dark and unique atmosphere. When I actually played the game... I hated them. It's not just audio logs either. I just apparently hate when most of the story in a game is told through monologue. One of the worst stories I have ever experienced in a game was Modern Warfare 2, not only because it showcased writing on the level of a Steven Seagal movie, but because most of the story is either given to you in loading screen briefs or by people yelling in your face/over radios. It was impossible to tell what the fuck was going on for half the time.

I always saw them as a poor excuse for not showing any characters in the game. Which is probably because the developers couldn't render decent human faces, or because they didn't have the time.

Even that woman scientist/doctor you see only as a silhouette from the other end of the glass in a smokey room.

Thankfully Bioshock Infinite is going to have actual faces in the game.