"Bad" Endings.

[AwkwardTurtle]

So I finished my first play-through of Catherine. I was genuinely intrigued in the concept of the game as the idea of exploring romantic relations within a game seemed like an interesting game. I started playing with a promise to myself, I would intentionally block out from my mind the fact that this was indeed a game and just react as naturally as I could in the situations/questions presented to me. (Aside from the nightmare block puzzles as I would probably have freaked out and died if that actually happened to me x3) So naturally I ended up being just about in the middle of the blue and red bar the entire time, since I both felt that Vincent should have a commitment to Katherine, but Catherine was still very tempting.

Anyway this is the important part, you could skip the first paragraph of reading if you really hate words. As the game ended Vincent was clearly disappointed, but the narrator tried to put a positive spin on it. I could see and understand the point the narrator makes but then I heard a familiar sound. The noise of getting an achievement. I looked to see the description of achievements and it said something like "See the bad lover ending". My reaction was "Well...apparently that was the shit ending..." Now I'm curious as to why I'm even allowed the choice of making decisions when at the end of it all the game just goes WELL DAMN YOU CLEARLY MADE THE WRONG DECISIONS AND GET A SHIT ENDING.

I had this experience as well with the game Nine Doors Nine Persons Nine Hours. I just don't see the point in allowing a freedom of choice when you only punish the person for making arbitrarily "wrong" decisions.

So really what is the point of these "Bad" endings. Is it just so the back of the box can claim multiple endings? Can anyone justify the existence of "Bad" endings?

 

[lucky_sharm]

There is no point to Bad endings, sadly. When a game boasts having multiple endings, there shouldn't be any black and white "Good and Ugly" endings.

 

[Darth_pipsqueak]

I don't actually know... I was a bit dissapointed to see that the game didn't help up, with its advertising. The choices are supposed to be neutral, taken the one you go through with..

 

[CM156_v1legacy]

So I finished my first play-through of Catherine. I was genuinely intrigued in the concept of the game as the idea of exploring romantic relations within a game seemed like an interesting game. I started playing with a promise to myself, I would intentionally block out from my mind the fact that this was indeed a game and just react as naturally as I could in the situations/questions presented to me. (Aside from the nightmare block puzzles as I would probably have freaked out and died if that actually happened to me x3) So naturally I ended up being just about in the middle of the blue and red bar the entire time, since I both felt that Vincent should have a commitment to Katherine, but Catherine was still very tempting.

Anyway this is the important part, you could skip the first paragraph of reading if you really hate words. As the game ended Vincent was clearly disappointed, but the narrator tried to put a positive spin on it. I could see and understand the point the narrator makes but then I heard a familiar sound. The noise of getting an achievement. I looked to see the description of achievements and it said something like "See the bad lover ending". My reaction was "Well...apparently that was the shit ending..." Now I'm curious as to why I'm even allowed the choice of making decisions when at the end of it all the game just goes WELL DAMN YOU CLEARLY MADE THE WRONG DECISIONS AND GET A SHIT ENDING.

I had this experience as well with the game Nine Doors Nine Persons Nine Hours. I just don't see the point in allowing a freedom of choice when you only punish the person for making arbitrarily "wrong" decisions.

So really what is the point of these "Bad" endings. Is it just so the back of the box can claim multiple endings? Can anyone justify the existence of "Bad" endings?

I can claim I enjoyed one bad ending. The ending to Mask of the Betrayer (And no, I don't mean the "bad" ending where you become the ultimate evil most RPGS would have you fight againts)

Spoiler

Long story short, you end a curse that has been plaguing Rashemen for a long time. A wrongly punished man?s soul is laid to rest, and everything is hunky doory.

Well, except the fact that in order to do this, you must bind your own soul to his, which traps you in the fugue plane for all eternity. You end up a servant to a god. Sure, everyone else escapes unscathed, but you give more than the ultimate sacrifice.

And you know what? I think it works well.

The final line in the epilogue is ?It is a tale that will continue to inspire, for as long as such tales are told?

I think it works.

 

[KarmaTheAlligator]

I see it more as the "bad" endings would be from a meta gaming perspective where you tried to get everything, but got a sub-par result instead. Or maybe it's just you've deviated from the game makers' wishes (which begs the question as to why they gave us choices then, as you pointed out)...

Of course, since different people have different values, what constitutes a bad ending is up for debate.

 

[Spector29]

I think if twats run around killing important characters or being idiots, they diserve the non-standard Game Over.

I'd make endings, but not label them 'Bad' or 'Good'. Just with different aspects of pros and Cons.

Like Silent Hill 2.

 

[DustyDrB]

I finished the game yesterday and got the "normal lover ending". Also known as the "Boring, average Joe, ho-hum, safe, don't sit in my seat because that's my seat and I always sit there" ending...

Actually, it wasn't bad. It was good. It's just that word...normal.

While we're on the subject of the game, I have to say this: Screw stage 8.


I used to do the thing where I'd do my real playthrough of a game, and then later do a pure evil one. But I found out that I just don't enjoy making evil decisions. The last time I made myself do it was Knights of the Old Republic. And when I...

Spoiler

Made Zalbaar kill Mission

I actually felt despicable. It made me hate my character and wish for him to fail.

 

[AwkwardTurtle]

I think if twats run around killing important characters or being idiots, they diserve the non-standard Game Over.

I'd make endings, but not label them 'Bad' or 'Good'. Just with different aspects of pros and Cons.

Like Silent Hill 2.

I haven't played Silent Hill 2, but I certainly wouldn't mind this view of multiple endings, it just bothers me when the end is clearly considered the "bad" ending because it either blatantly labels it so, such as in Catherine, or in the case of Nine Doors Nine Persons Nine Hours, abruptly end the game with things left unexplained.

 

[ultrachicken]

It seems that there is almost always someone involved in the development of a game who seems to think that players will have a mental breakdown if they have to face anything but a morally binary decision. Unfortunately, this person seems to invariably be very high up the executive ladder. It's kind of a plague on gaming, really.

I remember the ending to Metro 2033 pulled this bullshit.

Spoiler

From the very beginning, the Rangers (I believe that's what they were called; the guys with gas masks and guns that were on your side) were portrayed in the best light imaginable, as sentinels who kept what remained of society safe from neo-nazis, "communists," and mutants, and yet following in their footsteps somehow landed me with a bad ending. I didn't even realize it was supposed to be bad, or what I had done to have been railroaded into that ending, and it didn't make any fucking sense.

 

[AwkwardTurtle]

In all honesty I seem to find that the best way if implementing in choice with some freedom was in Dragon Age Origins (Although I still haven't found enough time to beat the bloody thing). I believe that any measurement of the effect your choice has on your personality completely destroys the purpose. The best freedom of choice system would be one that has ambiguity and Dragon Age Origins certainly wasn't lacking in ambiguity.

 

[Neverhoodian]

I don't mind "bad" endings if the result is suitably awesome. Star Wars games in particular are notable for these:


Sometimes it just feels good to embrace your inner Dark side.

 

[Spector29]

Well, in the case of KOTOR, It wasn't a bad ending. Just a Dark side one. You could BE Dark Side, so that would be a victory, not a loss.

 

[Cheesus333]

I think Silent Hill is pretty good for different endings, even if they do label them wrong (i.e. Best, Good, Bad etc.)

For example, Silent Hill 2. Spoilered for people who haven't played after all this fucking time:

Spoiler: Silent Hill 2 endings

You can either forget about Mary - James' dead wife that he 'euthanised' cause he was sick of her becoming a ***** when she had a terminal illness - and leave the town, apparently adopting Laura (a little girl that harasses you throughout the game but otherwise seems fairly nice). This is a pretty sweet one, it shows that James has finally forgiven himself and moved on.

You can settle down with Maria, James' slutty projection of his dead wife to satisfy his libido, but it's heavily implied that events are doomed to repeat themselves all over again - how many Marys have there been, exactly?

You can find some ritual items to bring back Mary, a bit like Stephen King's Pet Sematary, which is not a great one cause it shows he's not getting over his crime any time soon even after everything the town threw at him.

Or you can drive into the lake and suicide all over yourself. Both the most realistic ending and the most bittersweet: James is reunited with his wife, just like he wanted. I think it's actually canonical as well.

Then there are the two wild cards, Dog and UFO. Not worth mentioning but they're traditional and pretty damn funny.

These endings all provide a range of conclusions without any being explicitly bad or good - they all conclude the storyline, and they all resolve the initial problem. It works and I like it.

Spoiler: General spoilers, really

What does annoy me is when games are linear the whole way through then present you with one choice at the very end. It's ridiculous! Just a crappy way to force repeat playthroughs instead of actually making the game something you would want to play again. And some of the time it doesn't even make sense - can you imagine if Gordon climbed all the way to the top of the fucking Citadel and then actually did side with Breen? It would be batshit insane! Or if the Chief tore the Covenant a new one for a whole game then decided at the thrilling finale that, actually, he would like to destroy all life in the galaxy because, actually, he can!

Mass Effect 2 sort of did this, in a 'sort of' way, but it's forgiven cause there's shitloads of choices in that game and this one didn't even influence the ending that much. It just changed the colour of the thing you're flying away from.

EDIT: Fuck, this is spoilerific. I'll tag that last bit.

 

[Ando85]

Shadow Hearts From the New World comes to mind. Not going into much detail but I actually liked the "bad" ending better than the "good" ending. It was more realistic and interesting. Though not in gaming the movie Cast Away I found its not happily live ever after kind of ending a lot more effective. Sometimes a bad ending is better.

 

[chaosyoshimage]

I like how Chrono Trigger does it, allowing you to essentially "collect" endings.

 

[The Wykydtron]

I like how Persona 4 does it, getting the Bad ending depends on picking conversation options, the correct options should be quite apparent if you've been paying attention to all the awesome characterisation and general plot.

Plus the Bad ending itself wasn't a complete "lol you suck" ending, noone dies or anything (unless you want a particular two people to die) it's more of a gentle "come on you do better than this" kind of ending rather than a "ha look how shit you are"

 

[GigaHz]

I LOVE bad endings to video games. Mainly because few other entertainment mediums have Bad endings.

I enjoy having the option to screw everything up, turn the hero into a terrible person, or betray former allies. I don't enjoy when everything wraps up in a 'squeaky clean, sunshine and rainbows' fluff ending where the hero gets the girl, the world is saved, and the villain is destroyed. It is too predictable and common.

I'm more a lover of the Greyish endings where you're not 100% sure if the outcome is good or bad. Makes for a more thought provoking experience.

Also, it seems to me that Bad endings are sometimes the most entertaining compared to the Good endings. For example, I personally enjoyed the Bad endings in the Silent Hill series compared to the Best endings.

Sometimes I wish the bad endings were the true intended endings for certain games, but I know that will never happen. At least with more commercialized games.

 

[Akihiko]

To be honest, that is why I hate the true, good and bad ending system. Obviously you're going to want the true ending instead of the inferior good and bad endings, and so it actually punishes you if you don't use a guide. It annoys me even more when not getting the true ending, means missing out on a bit of the game too. Recently played Lux Pain on the DS, despite the horrific localisation job, I was kinda liking the story. Until I got to chapter 19, and it turned out I couldn't do the final two chapters because I didn't talk to a certain person all the way back in chapter 16. Didn't have a save to go back to since it was too far back.

I agree that Dragon Age Origins does endings far better. Your ending depends on your choices, and there isnt a right or wrong ending.