Bad reaction to 'bad' people.

[GothmogII]

More of a question really but...I've just been noticing in relation to gaming, and online gaming in particular, that people who cheat, hack, gank, and generally just make games unfun to play for others, seem to be getting the kind of hate you'd give a babykiller. Words like 'disgusting', 'horrific', 'monstrous' (well, I've only seen that one once I guess ^^') get thrown about.
So, why is that?

While I agree, the people who do these type of things should be banned/kicked/told to get lost, I just find the magnitude of such hate a little extreme hehe. And, not a little overblown at times.
Then again, this -is- the internet, maybe I'm mis-reading alot of this supposed hate, emotions don't cross the electronic divide that well after all.

I suppose this could be extended to anything you can talk about too, I mean, one can understand arguing one's point, but, it seems to go a little overboard when you start being textually aggressive towards someone.

 

[zacaron]

I think it is just that different people react to hackers in different ways

also it seams like a lot of hate but usually its only 1 or 2 pieces of hate per person.

 

[Logan Westbrook]

I get a bad reaction to improperly capitalised titles, but that's just me.

Slightly more on-topic, there are some people who take their video games very seriously. I have a friend who can't seem to keep a civil tongue in his head when playing on-line and I must admit that at times, I get heated about it, and I'm normally quite calm.

 

[Drugar]

I don't know any babykillers, none of my babies have been killed and nobody I know has had their baby killed. I hate babykillers on the notion that killing babies is bad.

I've found cheaters in multiplayer games, I've heard the whining of an 11 year old out of my speakers, I've had a guildleader in WoW yell at me because I missed one enchant on my gear. Those are things people did to *me*. Purposefully trying to undermine my fun at one of the few times per day I have the time and opportunity to do what I like to do best: relax with a game. I hate them because they've personally ruined an important moment for me.

Hate is a strong word for this maybe, but 'severe aggrevation' doesn't really cut it either. But it's more personal and thus it's stronger. Considering most teenage gamers don't have anyone to personally hate but the people that fuck them over at gaming, it reaches the top of the 'bad' list and as such, it evokes a strong reaction.

 

[Stammer]

I don't think words like "disgusting" or "horrific" are really necessary. I'd call them more "retarded" and "stupid". I mean, cheating is plain idiotic to do in a balanced server of gameplay. If you want, you can easily make your own server or join another one where they allow cheats. I think everyone should get a fair shot at winning. Anyone using cheats is just making the game "un fun". Feed cheaters to dragons [GM]Dave style.

 

[GothmogII]

I get a bad reaction to improperly capitalised titles, but that's just me.

Noted



Okay then, that's one thing then, taking things too seriously, which I supppose you would take something you were deeply interested in. Guess things get heated when you take something someone says or does as...well, I would think as a personal slight. Or to the effect off: Halo sucks!! Which, regardless of whether it does or does not, seems to cause people to go into angry convulsions.

Now, back to rest:

Cheaters: Are not fun. But, due to the online setting, allowing myself to get in a fit about it, is pointless, it makes -me- feel bad, and does nothing to stop the cheater. Thus, I've a few options, I can simply quit, or join another game. Go off and play something else. Or, if such things are facilitated, I can report them to a moderator or GM etc.

Hackers: I've rarely seen anyone actually 'hacking' anything in the way that it is understood to affect a game's code. More often people accused of being so, are those who are manipulating the game environment in such away that it shouldn't be used. This kind of overlaps with the cheaters, although I've read a few stories of actual hackers who say they do it for fun, and not to impact the gameplay in any way. I suppose Bots and their ilk would fall under this too.

Griefers: People who purposefully (or through their own...social ineptitude), generally make the game not fun to play. i.e. Spamming the mic, being verbally or textually abusive to others, teamkilling, ganking (in MMOS ofc) etc. etc. These, I guess you can deal with the same way as the cheaters.

But, as much as all that may piss you off, it doesn't seem to do any good in going off the handle yourself, maybe, take a deep breath as they say.

 

[Arkitext]

Some of the griefing stuff can be hilarious. Especially when people take video games so seriously. If that happens to be the case, you need a wake up call. Griefing just happens to be the least efficient means of doing so. It primarily seems to promote anger BUT, for someone like me, Griefing was a positive happening, because it meant that I stopped playing EVE, which sucked my life out of me into a world that you can easily lose your mind to.

But Griefers can't be held 100% to blame, they're one corner of a prism. You also have to blame the Victims and the Developers

For starters, if the Victim finds him or herself in a griefing situation, then they should seek ways to circumvent the griefing. Such as putting the game down for a day or a week. If we use the EVE example, then you need to realise that a game like that is fundamentally built around griefing as being a way of life. So if you don't want to get griefed at all, you're not going to enjoy it.

Secondly, the Developers are to blame for things like not properly educating their players about potential griefing, be it with warnings or guides. Not setting up efficient anti-griefing infra-structure, or just building a game which does actually allow griefing. Again, to use my example of EVE Online, that game is based on the idea of an open universe that mimics the risks and politics of real life. Which means that if you fly down a dark corridor in a dodgey system, you're running the risk of getting ganked by scurvy ne'er-do-wells. On the flipside there is a flaw the developers fail to meet regarding High-Security space Ore Theft. The Devs are simply - be it for their personal prejudice against carebears, or the inability to find an effective solution - unable to stop Ore Theft from open containers. I get the feeling they simply see macro mining as an abhorration on the game, but nevertheless, if someone comes along and exploits that weakness in the game mechanics, then it's partially the Devs fault, AND in this example the Macro Miners for trying to circumnavigate a particular system by using huge loot drop containers instead of password protected ones like they should.

So, there's an equal blame to be placed on the 3 parties, but to answer your original question Original Poster, I see it as simply being that Griefers are a minority in most games, and devs take the stance of being against griefers, so ultimately this furious firestorm frenzy of Geek Rages builds up until some naughty gamers get wailed on like they go around stomping on newborn kittens. It's not uncalled for but it's sometimes entirely over blown and completely ignorant of the full picture. Which is to be expected when dealing with humans.

 

[Arkitext]

Hate is a strong word for this maybe, but 'severe aggrevation' doesn't really cut it either. But it's more personal and thus it's stronger. Considering most teenage gamers don't have anyone to personally hate but the people that fuck them over at gaming, it reaches the top of the 'bad' list and as such, it evokes a strong reaction.

Perhaps it's a good thing then that the Geek Horde take their anger out on each other. As opposed to directing it into more useful routes like voting down bad government and starting revolutions.

I mean, cheating is plain idiotic to do in a balanced server of gameplay.

It's not a balanced server if you can cheat in it.

Life is unbalanced though. Doesn't make it right to cheat, but you can't escape reality completely with an online game. The Chaos Factor (as I like to call it) is always other People and always will be until they start forcing us to attend "Re-Conditioning Seminars" and take "Contentment Pills". Anyway, like I said above, if you're on a server with a griefer, gtfo and find another server. If you're in a game with too many griefers for your liking, find another game! Simple as that!

Maybe if enough people pulled their Geek Rages out of griefers faces and directed it at the Devs and their budgets, they could get something more effective done than getting red at a sniggering moron, who's frankly finding all this hilarious.

 

[L.B. Jeffries]

Gaming online, for me, was a lot like joining the local kickball league to meet fun people who like to have a good time.

There were a couple of cool guys to have a pitcher with, a few girls who were fun to hang out with, and then three or four people who took it seriously. 3 or 4 people who HAD to win. At kickball, the act of playing baseball except stupidly easy. And sure enough, just when we were having a good laugh or starting to loosen up, the one's obsessed with winning ruined the fun. One team would cheat, or more probably do somethings nuts to shake things up for a laugh, and then the 3 or 4 would flip out. Scream at the ref, scream at the team. Call each other names.

80% of us were there to have fun, and 20% had to ruin it. Not because of the cheating or because they lost...but just because they took something most of us were doing to relax and making it stressful.

Being chewed out by someone younger than me because I don't care about winning the intra-mural kickball tournament was...enlightening. I only play video games with people I know now.

 

[Drbog]

If we give this hatered to people who litter in real life we would have a cleaner world.

 

[Arkitext]

Being chewed out by someone younger than me because I don't care about winning the intra-mural kickball tournament was...enlightening.

It is enlightening to be griefed. You can get your priorities in order and come to understand some crucial facts of life... So long as you don't just go off the handle about it all it can be a positive experience, which is the best way to handle anything intrinsically negative.

 

[Anton P. Nym]

It is enlightening to be griefed. You can get your priorities in order and come to understand some crucial facts of life... So long as you don't just go off the handle about it all it can be a positive experience, which is the best way to handle anything intrinsically negative.

I suppose if you have the patience of Job and the serenity of Buddha (or the masochism of a flagellant) being griefed can be a positive experience. In my experience, however, griefing is far from positive and I can not condone it; please, folks, if you run into a griefer be sure to use whatever reporting/feedback system the game developers have included in the game to alert them to the problem.

The urge to bully expands to fit the space allowed it. Maybe we can't remove it entirely, but we can prune it back enough so that it doesn't choke out everything else.

-- Steve

 

[TheIceface]

The problem usually is the lack of a mod or admin on the server. If there is nobody that can kick the griefer, the only thing people can think of is get angry and try to convince him to leave via insults. I have never seen this work, threatening to "call the FBI" rarely works, but I once convinced some 'tard with a bunch of downloaded "hax" that I had hacked into his computer, saw all of his illegally downloaded music, and was reporting him to the RIAA.

The best part was he had no sound, so I could explain and get laughs from everyone else on the server, but this guy was freaking out.

 

[kinch]

I think L.B.Jeffries hit the nail on the head... some people take whatever they're doing seriously - maybe too seriously (but who are we to judge?). I can fully appreciate in some games where you can spend days, sometimes weeks building up your character, that if some jerkoff thinks it's fun or cool to kill you (usually in a way that you have no way of getting back at them,) or cheat, then you can get very frustrated at the time that was just wasted because everything you worked for is gone. Welcome to human nature - people can treat things that might be considered 'mundane' to some as the most important things in the world. But what choice is there but to simply accept it in others?

 

[telephonline92]

If you've ever gotten home from school, stressed about a family issue going on, loaded up Team Fortress 2, got on to your favorite server, and joined the Blue Team on Dustbowl, only to find that the entire Red team has managed to build several level three sentries along with having nearly all Heavies (with the exception of the engineers) right outside your spawn door, you'd know players like these have pretty much earned the reputation of "baby-killer" from victims.

Yes, a vast majority of the time, hate, as you described it, is completely unnecessary and uncalled for, but if your game experience is completely trashed, tarnished, and the people responsible for doing so are now spamming up your inbox with friend requests with the hope of finding you on another server and pulling the same stunt again, there's a bit of a right to be spiteful.

This post sounds a little immature now that I look over it, but most video games are meant to trigger simple states of mind such as relaxation, pleasure, and for the strong headed who brag about their enormous Xbox Live scores, pride.
Unfortunately, there's a backlash to this as hate and spite easily flow into the experience as well.
This should be expected in the reactions of online players and though not much can be done about it, outside of some guides to not overreacting to being "pwned" as mentioned in some comments, it's a bit of an advantage.
If a player whines excessively about spawn camping, you've learned something about who you're playing with and in the future, you can either avoid this person or make it a goal to kill him in the future for that high you get for pissing off another player when you join the opposing team.

 

[Talux]

It's enlightening to be griefed? I don't know about that. There's a reason why most people like to play games which have rules and a sense of fair play. I personally don't get any value out of cheating or griefing my way through a game. Legitimately getting to the ending of a game, making it to a certain level in an MMO or getting those kills online does create a fulfilling emotion for me. I don't buy a game to get disillusioned with it and stop playing because of some idiot.

I always thought of griefing as purely a waste of the griefer's and everyone else's time - ruining the fun of a game for the sake of it. I can't find a reason why someone would do that other than out of a kind of sadistic urge (however mild), as a way of seeking attention, or because they're just bored. There's no higher purpose behind it. Sure, it's funny sometimes to see a person acting stupid for the lulz, but I'm not sure if that's really griefing or not...

Anyway, I guess people do exaggerate their hatred of griefing... but there's still absolutely nothing redeeming about it.

 

[WhiteFangofWhoa]

When I play any game, I do it in order to enjoy myself. It means I am using my increasingly more limited stash of leisure time to unwind from the frusturations of work and school.

1. Swearing and cussing at me nonstop diminishes my enjoyment.
2. Altering the rules unfairly in your favor dimishes my enjoyment.
3. Deliberatley ruining an online game diminishes my enjoyment, and the enjoyment of others.

This is our free time. It is supposed to be relatively free from aggravation. We earn this time. And we're supposed to not be upset when some snickering imbecile gets his hard-on by ruining the game for other people, making us more stressed out than we were when we started? Guess which kind of game I don't play often...

A common analogy that occurs to me on many subjects pertaining to online games is the comparison to Sports. For most people, it's a leisure activity and only the best of the best actually get paid to do it, just like Gaming. What's the equivalent of these acts in, say, a friendly game of soccer or baseball?

1- Pretty much the same thing. But I don't imagine too many people will invite that person back to play again unless they regularly do the same.
2- Suddenly the ball reverses direction and zooms towards the other goal- someone has hacked reality again. Repeat until everyone goes home fuming. In the professional scene, this is called cheating. Or steroids.
3- Player X kicks the ball into his own team's goal repeatedly on purpose. He answers all criticism with the one-finger salute. Team A would tell him to scram, but Players Y and Z both had to leave 5 minutes in because they felt like it.

I fail to comprehend how committing any of these could be even slightly enjoyable for the perpetrator. Perhaps if I did, I'd be one of them too *shudder*.

 

[Lazzi]

Its simple really. Dispite the fact that what people are playing is a GAME they cling ot its more liek an addiction. While i admit that when peopel start screwign aroudn with my free time im a bit prone to agression (ok nto agression but general nagtive emotion)i belive that what some call the hackers and cheater is a bit over blown.

These people are not
a)Monsters
b)horriffic
c)horrible

or even

d)assholes


What they really are is sad. There People that must resort to start messign with a vertual enviroment inorder to have soem form of dominance or control.

People that take shit are the same thing, sad. This is a game shut up and let your skill talk.

Aslso the peopel that calim what these sad peopel do it "horibble" are pretty sad them selves. I mean comem on yoru playign a game if your really having a bad tiem jsut report the fuck, or tell to stick an x-box controler up there ass. After that jsut log of and enjoy ther real world.

 

[Gooble]

I don't 'hate' hackers etc. in the pure sense, I just wish they'd fuck off and leave me alone. I have no idea what the hell they get out of doing something which is clearly going to make them win, and leave the others with no chance whatsoever.

It might be fun to do it like once, or now and again, but definitely not repeatedly.

 

[MRMIdAS2k]

If someone hacked into your house, and stole your computer, you'd be pretty fucked off.

If someone hacks into my game, and steals my fun, I'm equally as fucked off.

And that is why hackers should burn.