Batman Beyond: Would Terry's Mind Games Have Worked On Any Other Version Of The Joker?

[FalloutJack]

He can't stand just being dismissed as a joke.

You mean...


...those mobsters? The ones he played like a fiddle as he walked in there, made a mockery of them, and walked out because he was wired to explode? The same mobsters who turned to him in desperation and that he then double-crossed on a whim? Those mobsters?

I dunno, man. This Joker seems way less concerned about dying to make a point. And if that's the case, what's a little ego?

 

[RebornKusabi]

That's just Dini's writing which as time has gone on, I've grown to hate. His Joker is a clown, literally, and a vain one at that who hates being laughed at or easily bullied into an action. His Joker isn't a force of nature or an unstoppable madman like Nolan's Joker who wins even when he loses. He isn't the fluid, fluctuating bipolar Joker like the comics portray him, where his attitude and personality are dictated by how he feels (and how he's being written).

Put simply, after revisiting Batman: The Animated Series and the movies, and in light of the HILARIOUS The Killing Joke adaptation with the riotous scenes of torture and the humerous implications that Joker is literally raping Batgirl (instead of that being a cute undertone), I have grown to hate Paul Dini now. And reading this topic reminded me of why- he writes Joker like a turbo-charged Cesar Romero expy and that sucks.

Mark Hamill's still the best Joker.

 

[The Rogue Wolf]

Mind games on Heath Ledger? Probably not. Hamill's Joker has a pretty potent ego, while Heath's is a man who delights in getting people out of control because he just doesn't care.

It seemed to me that Ledger's Joker wanted everyone to believe that they were just like him- that he was a mirror of humanity's base ego, immoral and self-centered and perfectly willing to sacrifice others for their own ends. What seemed to set him off more than anything was telling him that this wasn't true in some way or another- even calling him a "freak".

 

[Cicada 5]

That's just Dini's writing which as time has gone on, I've grown to hate. His Joker is a clown, literally, and a vain one at that who hates being laughed at or easily bullied into an action. His Joker isn't a force of nature or an unstoppable madman like Nolan's Joker who wins even when he loses. He isn't the fluid, fluctuating bipolar Joker like the comics portray him, where his attitude and personality are dictated by how he feels (and how he's being written).

Put simply, after revisiting Batman: The Animated Series and the movies, and in light of the HILARIOUS The Killing Joke adaptation with the riotous scenes of torture and the humerous implications that Joker is literally raping Batgirl (instead of that being a cute undertone), I have grown to hate Paul Dini now. And reading this topic reminded me of why- he writes Joker like a turbo-charged Cesar Romero expy and that sucks.

Mark Hamill's still the best Joker.

Actually, I just remembered this, but Cassandra Cain the second Batgirl used a similar tactic by simply saying "You're boring." to him.

There's also a scene in Brian Azzarello's Joker that is similar. t the climax, when the Joker asks why Batman leaves a little window on his mask, 'a glimpse' at the human face underneath. When Batman shuts him up in three words ? "to mock you"?the Joker loses his shit completely.

Hamill's Joker could easily move from entertaining to sinister. Indeed, Hamill stated the Joker in ROTJ, was when he found the character the most disturbing.

 

[Glongpre]

I dunno, man. This Joker seems way less concerned about dying to make a point. And if that's the case, what's a little ego?

I don't understand your retort.

This is what I mean:

Spoiler

Both times they dismiss him; they don't believe he is capable. You can tell both times it gets under his skin.

 

[FalloutJack]

Snip

Except that he preys upon the unexpected and makes fools of people with expectations as a matter of practice. His point is that such people end up with the short end of the stick, the end that has the pointy bit now suddenly sticking out of their chests. Basically, what you interpret as a counter-point, I think of as a point. I dunno if this is really frustration or him playing such people like patsies, but the results say he's screwing around with everybody on purpose.

 

[COMaestro]

That's just Dini's writing which as time has gone on, I've grown to hate.

Paul Dini had no involvement in the Killing Joke. That was Bruce Timm and even then, he was only a producer. Brian Azzarello wrote the screenplay and Sam Liu directed.

 

[Glongpre]

Snip

Except that he preys upon the unexpected and makes fools of people with expectations as a matter of practice. His point is that such people end up with the short end of the stick, the end that has the pointy bit now suddenly sticking out of their chests. Basically, what you interpret as a counter-point, I think of as a point. I dunno if this is really frustration or him playing such people like patsies, but the results say he's screwing around with everybody on purpose.

I don't know what this has to do with the OP. But I will take it you still believe Heath's Joker could not be frustrated like the example given in the OP.

 

[FalloutJack]

The OP

Well yes. Because, again, it isn't that he's showing off like Mark Hamill's Joker. Hamill's likes the title, the fear, the acknowledgement. Heath's is out to make other people be the joke. You get HIM mad the way it happened, by showing him that people aren't always shit. Their venues are different that way.