Ben 10: Why?!

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DeltaEdge

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May 21, 2010
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I must be one of the few that actually liked Alien Force, moreso than the original even. I just found Ben to be way to bratty and annoying in the first series to really enjoy it. When he got older and learned to not be so annoying, I found myself much more interested. Gwens whole energy magic deal was a bit boring, but I still vastly prefered Alien Force to the original. I did however, get a bit annoyed when he got super cocky after saving the world, but it still wasn't as bad as the original Ben. That being said, I kind of stopped watching anyways and only just recently caught up on it seeing it in the morning on weekdays before I went off to school.
 

anthony87

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Aug 13, 2009
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Moderated said:
According to a main series episode taking place in the future, alien force isn't canon.
Nah, Alien Force onwards is canon. There was an episode in Ultimate Alien that basically explained how the future they went to in Ben 10 was a parallel future. So technically both of them are canon.

So why exactly are AF/UA bad shows? They expand the universe introduced in the original series and try to add some characterisation beyond "Ben needs a slap" and "Gwen is too uptight".

As for those Ben 10: Omniverse screenshots up above? They can fuck right off.
 

McMarbles

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May 7, 2009
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I'm just annoyed that this dead horse is still being beaten, but I can't get a second season of Sym-Bionic Titan.
 

Not G. Ivingname

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Nov 18, 2009
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The reason they kept changing it is because of Voice acting Guild Rules.

Any series with more than 65 episodes has to pay the VOs a portion of the profit from the series. Disney was REALLY found of ending series before that happened.

Cartoon Networks solution is to keep coming up with a new Ben 10 show every 65 episodes.
 

Lizardon

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Mar 22, 2010
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Retsam19 said:
I guess, I wouldn't have minded where AF ended up if it had worked its way there more gradually, rather than taking the time-skip approach to character development. Character development is one of my favorite parts of these shows, and it's one thing the original did well.
I'd disagree with that. AF and UA had character development throughout. Ben started of more serious and thoughtful, but after he saved the Universe (twice) he starting become more cocky and arrogant again. Through out both series Ben and Gwen's relationship with Kevin evolve from working together for mutual benefit, to trusting each other and eventually friendship.

On the other hand nothing ever changed in the original series. Seriously, Ben must of learnt the lesson of "You don't have to do everything by yourself/ Let others help you" three of four times, but it never sank in.

Kevin being a character who is consistently on the wrong side, but still has sympathetic motives? Too dark, let's just skip past all that slow character growth and jump to him being on their team (we'll just give a flashback episode to explain the change eventually)
Kevin has plenty of dark moments in the shows though. He basically kills the man (well alien) who murders his father, as well as going on a psychopathic rampage which would have ended with more deaths if Ben and Gwen hadn't intervened.

Anyway I just realised the only argument anyone needs to make to prove that Alien Force is a good show.

Paradox is not in Ben 10. Paradox is in Alien Force. Therefore Alien Force is the superior show.

See? I even showed my working =P
 

kortin

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Mar 18, 2011
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Lizardon said:
And while we are talking Ben 10, has anyone seen the leaked first episode of the new series? It's a direct sequel again, with the voice actors returning, but I really don't like the new art style.


What happened to his eyes!
Reminds me of what Disney did to American Dragon back before they started making horrible sitcoms that are the exact same thing as each other with different actors.



(there are two in the second one because I couldn't find a good pic with Jake in both forms) Evidently, all those smooth lines were too hard for them. I swear, the only good thing about that show in season 2 was Dante Basco. And he was one of the perks of season one.

Anyways, on-topic: I loved the first Ben 10 series. The second one was okay. This third one is just abominable though. It looks just looks SO very bad.
 

Kolby Jack

Come at me scrublord, I'm ripped
Apr 29, 2011
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THE ESCAPIST said:
Tony said:
THE ESCAPIST said:
Jack the Potato said:
Alien force and anything after is really just cartoon networks doing to sell toys and are written by other people.
If you really wanna see the spiritual successor of the show watch generator rex also made by man of action studios(makes of ben 10)
I have to say, very clever name.

OT: Ben 10 was never particularly good for me. I miss the old Cartoon Network D:
Well I cant say I miss the old cartoon network as Ive watched it all my life(20) and wouldnt know which year is the best from I am weasel to dexter/ppgirls to toonami to now but I really like some of the shows now and wouldnt trade adventure time for anything.
Ragsnstitches said:
Ask any fan of the original TMNT, HE-MAN or Thundercats what they think of the new incarnations and they will say they suck more often then not.
I think fans actually liked the 2003 version of tmnt and people really liked the thundercats 2011 version, I am unaware of any new he-man cartoon.
From what I saw of the new Thundercats, it's pretty solid. Not sure about the new He-man though. I know there was a revamped He-man cartoon when I was a kid and I don't recall it being that bad either. Not sure if that's the "new" He-man though since it's been around for quite a few years now.
 

DudeistBelieve

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Sep 9, 2010
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What? How can you hate a show that brought us Doctor Paradox!

He was lost in time for over a millennial! He went insane! Then he got bored of it, and went SANE AGAIN!

"Here, have a gum ball! It'll soothe your nerves!"
 

GeneralFungi

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Jul 1, 2010
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One of the things I really liked about the original show was that the Omnitrix was somewhat limited in what it could do. Ben would often decide upon what alien he would want to choose in a certain situation, but get something completely different and would have to be creative in how he took each alien's set of abilities in order to take on his challenges. Each Alien had a set of skills that differentiated them from the pack, and they all also had their set of weaknesses.

In Alien Force... Ben has mastered the Omnitrix. He can transform to any alien at will, and his collection of aliens he can transform into has expanded into aliens which mostly consists of two aliens from the original series spliced together. There are some new ones in there, but each alien has become so generalized that they all bleed together and start behaving the exact same. Instead of each alien being distinct, they have mostly boiled down to "Lazer shooty alien" and "Punchy kicky alien" with very little notable exceptions.

Not to mention, now that Ben has mastered the Omnitrix that battles aren't nearly as exciting or surprising for me anymore. I'll be honest and say that while I do enjoy character progression, Ben 10 wasn't exactly the best series for it in my humble opinion, so maybe I'm not the best judge of whether Alien Force was an improvement.
 

Gottesstrafe

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Oct 23, 2010
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Jack the Potato said:
And from the look of this new series they're doing... Oh god, it's like they hate fans of the original series!
They probably did, given the copious amounts of porn made about the series. Why do you think they tried to radically change Gwen's look so much? Didn't really help, mind you, but there was visible effort put into it. But hey, the creators of Avatar: The Last Airbender hated their fans too...

SaneAmongInsane said:
What? How can you hate a show that brought us Doctor Paradox!

He was lost in time for over a millennial! He went insane! Then he got bored of it, and went SANE AGAIN!

"Here, have a gum ball! It'll soothe your nerves!"
Obvious Doctor Who reference, but still an enjoyable character nonetheless.
 

Kolby Jack

Come at me scrublord, I'm ripped
Apr 29, 2011
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Gottesstrafe said:
Jack the Potato said:
And from the look of this new series they're doing... Oh god, it's like they hate fans of the original series!
They probably did, given the copious amounts of porn made about the series. Why do you think they tried to radically change Gwen's look so much? Didn't really help, mind you, but there was visible effort put into it. But hey, the creators of Avatar: The Last Airbender hated their fans too...
I'm pretty sure the A:TLA creators more treat those kinds of fans as that smelly relative you try your hardest to avoid at family reunions. "Oh hey, it's Uncle Mortimer... I think it's time for cake!" *walks away briskly*

Besides, I think everyone knows rule 34 isn't a joke by now. I'm sure Lauren Faust is at least AWARE of all the pony porn out there *shudders*. Best just to not acknowledge it and move on.

SaneAmongInsane said:
What? How can you hate a show that brought us Doctor Paradox!

He was lost in time for over a millennial! He went insane! Then he got bored of it, and went SANE AGAIN!

"Here, have a gum ball! It'll soothe your nerves!"
Okay fair enough, I do like Dr. Paradox, even if he is a mary sue whenever he's around.
 

Gottesstrafe

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Oct 23, 2010
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Jack the Potato said:
I'm pretty sure the A:TLA creators more treat those kinds of fans as that smelly relative you try your hardest to avoid at family reunions. "Oh hey, it's Uncle Mortimer... I think it's time for cake!" *walks away briskly*

Besides, I think everyone knows rule 34 isn't a joke by now. I'm sure Lauren Faust is at least AWARE of all the pony porn out there *shudders*. Best just to not acknowledge it and move on.
Avatar was a different story, its creators hated the horde of shippers that kept flooding them with demands to make "Zutara" (among other things) canon. Of course, once their cocaine pile became dangerously low they had to change their tune in the new series. Think it's just a coincidence that the only two members of the old series confirmed to be still alive are Zuko and Katara? (Although TBH Katara does have at least a semblance of a reason outside of shipping bait)
 

Rule Britannia

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Apr 20, 2011
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I think "don't quote me on this" but there was a series before Ben 10: Alien Force...I think. It had all the modern drawings and released a couple of years ago but I thought that was alright. Putting up images of the series you're talking about would help.

Never really got into Ben 10. I'd watch it if it was on though :)
 

bluesession

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Sep 8, 2008
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I loved the first Ben10. I LOVED IT!
Truth is I haven't seen an episode in a while, so I couldn't really tell how much would I love it now.

I did watch the first season of Alien Force. At first I was disapointed that the time traveling episodes in the first series turn out to be non-canon. That sense of continuity, that ben turned out to be the earth greatest hero, that was pretty cool, so it was a shame that it didn't turn out to be really true.

The truth is I didn't like the new series, it didn't made my face melt, but it wasn't the original.

On a side note: Doctor Animo. BEST villain EVER.

Captcha: Live in the now. Guess you are right. But i still don't like today's CN
 

Battleaxx90

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Jul 8, 2011
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Apparently, the guy who voices Ben is also the guy who voices Simon from Gurren Lagann and Haseo from .hack//GU.

Yeah, I have trouble believing that too.