I think the nicest thing I can say about the game is that the co-op Human/Ghost mechanic would be really awesome in a much better game. Great idea, terrible place to see it realised.
Beyond two souls. Was it judged too harshly
- Thread starter Autumnflame
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Its a failure no matter which way you slice it. If you think of it as a movie, the plotholes and non-sensical story and story-structure break any amount of pacing and narrative because you cant enjoy the story being told, you spend far more time trying to figure out which part of Jodie's life you are experiencing and how whatever is being shown is influenced by past events or how it could affect future events and it effectively does neither at that point since past events are never brought back up, except as throwaway subtle references and no part of the game has any direct effect on anything that follows it.
And as a game it also fails, for the sheer fact that it tries to be non-linear. That killed the story aspect, that killed the experience of living her life, as disjointed it may be. If your story already failed for the reasons stated, then the gameplay has to matter and there is nothing in the gameplay that matters because nothing has any effect, you can not lose the game, you cant fail, your decisions barely mean anything when viewed in the larger picture. There are a few moments where you have a choice, but it boils down to good versus evil decision, a black or white moment. Example, when the kids are mean to jodie, you get the choice to ruin their party, or just leave. And that is all there is, some moments even lack the choice as with the almost-rape in the Bar where you are eventually forced to kill the guys, you can not avoid the almost-rape, or killing them in any way. There is no choice and ultimately no consequence to your actions, the game does not change based on how you play, which could work with the non-linear narrative very well, so again its a failure there.
Gameplay and Story fail on their own merits and neither can save the other, thats why the game is ultimately a failure because it tries to do alot of things at once, without actually doing anything other than trying too hard to be artsy.
And as a game it also fails, for the sheer fact that it tries to be non-linear. That killed the story aspect, that killed the experience of living her life, as disjointed it may be. If your story already failed for the reasons stated, then the gameplay has to matter and there is nothing in the gameplay that matters because nothing has any effect, you can not lose the game, you cant fail, your decisions barely mean anything when viewed in the larger picture. There are a few moments where you have a choice, but it boils down to good versus evil decision, a black or white moment. Example, when the kids are mean to jodie, you get the choice to ruin their party, or just leave. And that is all there is, some moments even lack the choice as with the almost-rape in the Bar where you are eventually forced to kill the guys, you can not avoid the almost-rape, or killing them in any way. There is no choice and ultimately no consequence to your actions, the game does not change based on how you play, which could work with the non-linear narrative very well, so again its a failure there.
Gameplay and Story fail on their own merits and neither can save the other, thats why the game is ultimately a failure because it tries to do alot of things at once, without actually doing anything other than trying too hard to be artsy.
No. David Cage is a foppish wannabe film director who has no discernible skill in regards to that field and so decided to go into game development where he assumes that just because he has a background in screenwriting any "game", that's game in the largest quotation marks possible, he makes will instantly have superior stories than say proven leaders in the business. Luckily for him, mainstream games journalism is so desperate to put games on the same level as film, which is actually just downright insulting for both mediums and probably why Heavy Rain got such undeservedly high scores, that he's able to skirt away with making crap that can barely be called a game with stories that make no discernible sense no matter how you look at them? and that's leaving out his attempts at making compelling characters. The worst part is that with David Cage there is no positive to any of his work for the game industry. At best he's a fop that get's away with making interactive movies with crap stories and at worst he's legitimately harmful to the industry because his method of development and success means that he's effectively making the case that story and gameplay can't be effectively mixed/combined and must be kept separate for one or the other to work? which is extremely harmful.
I relatively enjoyed my playthrough, but I don't see myself playing it ever again. Story was dumb as a bag of hammers and barely interactive. At this rate I don't even see myself buying Cage's next game for $60. This wasn't worth that much.
It wasn't judged too harshly. The flaws inherent in Quantic's games were largely overlooked with Farenheit and tolerated in Heavy Rain but for them to still exist after more than a decade of experimentation is unacceptable. If a game is going to basically be a marginally interactive movie, having it be a relatively bad movie has little excuse at this point.
If you played his last games like Omikron (which I havnt played), Farenheight (aka indigo prophecy), and Heavy rain you kind of knew what you were getting into with Beyond: Two souls. I think that was the major issue. All of those games were very niche titles. I hold Farenhieght up as the best of his games because playing as a serial killer and the detectives trying to catch him was an amazing concept. You were trying to constantly outsmart yourself which, for me, was very engaging.
Beyond two souls is less of a game and more of an interactive movie though. Its about the story of a girl, a spirit cohabitating her body, and the relationships that both of them build. Thats just not as interesting as Farenhieght or even the murder mystery of heavy rain.
Like previous david cage games people that werent familiar with his previous work came in to find uninteresting gameplay with high mystic story stuff going on and it wasnt for them. No big deal, not every game is for everyone. However the fact that there wasnt interesting gameplay that engaged players as much as previous titles also hurt the game IMO.
That said, Im not really sure if it was judged to harshly or not. However if I had to hazard a guess I would go toward yes, I think it may have been judged to harshly
Beyond two souls is less of a game and more of an interactive movie though. Its about the story of a girl, a spirit cohabitating her body, and the relationships that both of them build. Thats just not as interesting as Farenhieght or even the murder mystery of heavy rain.
Like previous david cage games people that werent familiar with his previous work came in to find uninteresting gameplay with high mystic story stuff going on and it wasnt for them. No big deal, not every game is for everyone. However the fact that there wasnt interesting gameplay that engaged players as much as previous titles also hurt the game IMO.
That said, Im not really sure if it was judged to harshly or not. However if I had to hazard a guess I would go toward yes, I think it may have been judged to harshly
Nope, David Cage deserves to be criticized to hell and back for his shlock, attempts at ripping off, and rape scene fetish.
Its such a shame because William Dafoe and Ellen Page do a such great job at carrying the atrocious attempt at a story and its format (The reason Baccano pulled it of Mr. Cage was because the story was actually coherent and ORIGINAL). Not to mention I feel the concept behind it sounds like it would be amazing for TV/Movie/an actual video game with gameplay, too bad it was given to David Cage of all people.
Oh well, we can at least thank him for the Two Best Friends Play of his "games"!
His cockiness and love for emotion filled polygons really pushed towards the many comedic moments in th-
Wait, is that the script?... Is it? I don't know...
Its such a shame because William Dafoe and Ellen Page do a such great job at carrying the atrocious attempt at a story and its format (The reason Baccano pulled it of Mr. Cage was because the story was actually coherent and ORIGINAL). Not to mention I feel the concept behind it sounds like it would be amazing for TV/Movie/an actual video game with gameplay, too bad it was given to David Cage of all people.
Oh well, we can at least thank him for the Two Best Friends Play of his "games"!
His cockiness and love for emotion filled polygons really pushed towards the many comedic moments in th-
Wait, is that the script?... Is it? I don't know...