Bioware *clearly* hates women and wants them to suffer

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Dec 14, 2009
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I'm female Commander Shepard, and this is my favourite thread on the escapist.


My Femshep went with Garrus (dude, it's Garrus), but only because he's awesome and not because he's a looker.

I haven't done a Femhawke playthrough in DA2 yet, but I'm dreading it, because all the male characters bar Varric, are just terrible.

Varric! Why can't I have you!
 

Smallells

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This feels more like a nerdy version of a cracked.com article than an escapist thread =P
NEVERTHELESS!
I don't think it so much hates women as it doesn't understand men. Most of the characters are shallow or have backstory's that are intrinsically similiar. Try and think about how many characters in the Mass Effect universe have daddy issues as a main focus of their life in at least one of the games (Garrus, Jacob, Wrex, Grunt to some extent, and that's just the males!). I think they've just been damn lucky enough to program some personality at all.
Where was I going with this?
Ah yes, my first point, they come up with the characters first, so a more appropriate idea would be that they hate MEN.
Thank god for teenage hormones I guess, when I first played I decided to go the lesbian approach and didn't even consider other romantic options so I avoided all this mess =D
 

Saltyk

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Sep 12, 2010
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BloatedGuppy said:
Saltyk said:
But really, I don't think there are too many good romantic leads in games. Even characters like Morrigan have flaws. I was so mad when we got really close and then she freaked out at me and there was no way to salvage the relationship. I felt cheated. Don't get me wrong, it makes some sense for her character, but I still felt cheated.
You felt cheated because Morrigan was actually had some elements of her personality that sparked a rudimentary level of interest, and she wasn't hard to look at. Yes, she was abrasive and acerbic, but some guys dig that. So when she left, you felt like you were missing out on what could have been.

If one of the male leads had ditched you, you would have thought "Oh thank GOD". I remember feeling faintly relieved when...

...Anders blew up the chantry, because I finally had an ethical excuse to kill him so I wouldn't have to listen to him any more.
One could easily argue,based on what you stated, that Morrigan was simply every man's fantasies given form. That she wasn't so much a well written character as an embodiment of what many men like. A fetish, if you like the term. So, in that way, I felt cheated because even in a fantasy fictional world that fantasy is beyond my grasp. So, Morrigan wasn't a compelling character because she was interesting. She was compelling because she was simply what people wanted her to be. A Mary Sue character if you'll forgive the slightly misused term. Beyond that male characters had a crazy woman and a man-whore. Not great choices when you look at it that way.

In Mass Effect 2, male characters had Miranda, Tali, or Jack. Or a poor man's Morrigan (and less interesting), an alien in a suit who you never see and might be a Predator type beast, and a tattooed psychotic shaved head killer. Great choices for your male characters there, too.

Better than the original KOTOR, I guess. You had Carth (for female Revan) and Bastila (for male Revan). And neither of them were all that great either.

Of course, we could nitpick all day if we wanted. They still are great games. The romance options may not be great, but at least they try. They are there to explore the world, and your characters, and even yourself, in a whole different way. Success may vary is all.
 
Dec 14, 2009
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xXxJessicaxXx said:
Daystar Clarion said:
Varric! Why can't I have you!
Varric is lush I want his dorf babies. _>
He's one of my favourite Bioware characters.

During my first playthrough, my Hawke was a sarcastic bastard, and the partnership between him and Varric in conversations was bloody hilarious.

If I could have a game where I had Garrus and Varric as team members at the same time...

Do I dare to dream?
 
Jun 11, 2008
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Male sheps get Liara the most awkward and stereotyped sexually introverted nerdy girl on the ME team. Tali who is just kinda there in ME 1 I don't know about 2 and Ashley who couldn't get more over the top patriotic and xenophobic if she tried. Ok your great great great Grandad's wart's Fifth cousin twice removed fought in the First contact war it doesn't give you a right to basically think every alien race is out to get you or shit. I have yet to see a good romance option in a Bioware game FULL STOP NO IFS AND OR BUTTS(although there is plenty of those).

While this is my opinion you are free to have yours and yes that thing about Ashley is hyperbole but she does act like that.

They don't make bad games or characters(despite being on par with JRPGs with reusing tropes and archetypes) just I really hope Bioware don't go off and start writing any romance novels, erotica or porno. Leave those to the fans.
 

EmperorSubcutaneous

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Saltyk said:
Better than the original KOTOR, I guess. You had Carth (for female Revan) and Bastila (for male Revan). And neither of them were all that great either.
FemRevan also got Juhani, who managed to be simultaneously incredibly boring and incredibly creepy.


BloatedGuppy said:
Alistair is the cream of the crop because his simpering is occasionally amusing, but he's a polarizing character who is deeply loathed by half the player base.
Alistair is polarizing? Seriously? He's always at the top of every "favorite Dragon Age companion" poll I've seen.

But yeah, he's the only decent male option. My female characters always end up romancing other female characters (except for Alistair) because the males are so dull.
 

Dastardly

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Apr 19, 2010
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BloatedGuppy said:
Surely you can't expect ALL of them to become lesbians just to avoid weeping quietly into their pillows at the compromises they have to make to get that romance achievement?
But if our female Sheps aren't at least bisexual, how can we be expected to move the romantic plot forward to its natural conclusion in Mass Effect 3(some). No one wants a threesome with two dudes, c'mon...
 

darth.pixie

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This is why I always expect my female Bioware characters to end up alcoholic at the end of their games. Not worse than the Obsidian ones (who seem to have something for tragic romances (Casavir/Elanee/Boone/Aribeth/Atton)) but close. Also why I can't role-play female characters who don't go God without mods in Baldur's Gate.

By the way, you forgot Carth Onasi and Sky.
 

CGAdam

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xXxJessicaxXx said:
Yeah becuase

1.disabled people can't have relationships? and 2. It's okay to risk killing Tali? /sarcasm.

riiight....
Tali just ends up sick. Joker would end up a bag shattered femurs (and pelvis, ribs, arms...).
 

conflictofinterests

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Dastardly said:
BloatedGuppy said:
Surely you can't expect ALL of them to become lesbians just to avoid weeping quietly into their pillows at the compromises they have to make to get that romance achievement?
But if our female Sheps aren't at least bisexual, how can we be expected to move the romantic plot forward to its natural conclusion in Mass Effect 3(some). No one wants a threesome with two dudes, c'mon...
I want a threesome with two dudes... :<
Y everyone in this thread discount my preferences?
 
Jun 11, 2008
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CGAdam said:
xXxJessicaxXx said:
Yeah becuase

1.disabled people can't have relationships? and 2. It's okay to risk killing Tali? /sarcasm.

riiight....
Tali just ends up sick. Joker would end up a bag shattered femurs (and pelvis, ribs, arms...).
Yes but if you want to go straight by lore she has no immune system and as far as I remember but I might be wrong in this a fair portion of the Migrant Fleet was wiped out one time by a cold. It doesn't make sense from a purely lore stand point that she is an option so easily.
 

BloatedGuppy

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Saltyk said:
One could easily argue,based on what you stated, that Morrigan was simply every man's fantasies given form. That she wasn't so much a well written character as an embodiment of what many men like. A fetish, if you like the term. So, in that way, I felt cheated because even in a fantasy fictional world that fantasy is beyond my grasp. So, Morrigan wasn't a compelling character because she was interesting. She was compelling because she was simply what people wanted her to be. A Mary Sue character if you'll forgive the slightly misused term. Beyond that male characters had a crazy woman and a man-whore. Not great choices when you look at it that way.

In Mass Effect 2, male characters had Miranda, Tali, or Jack. Or a poor man's Morrigan (and less interesting), an alien in a suit who you never see and might be a Predator type beast, and a tattooed psychotic shaved head killer. Great choices for your male characters there, too.

Better than the original KOTOR, I guess. You had Carth (for female Revan) and Bastila (for male Revan). And neither of them were all that great either.

Of course, we could nitpick all day if we wanted. They still are great games. The romance options may not be great, but at least they try. They are there to explore the world, and your characters, and even yourself, in a whole different way. Success may vary is all.
Oh don't get me wrong. I enjoyed the games very much. And I would never suggest that any of the female romance options were incredible three dimensional characters either. But there was some variety there, to appeal to different types. Do you like your women snarky and remote, but with a tender (if wounded) heart? You've got your Morrigan and your Jack. Do you like your women to be innocent and gentle? You've got your Tali and your Aerie. No, they don't cover every possible personality type, but there's some breadth in there.

As Gethsemani has already adroitly put it, Bioware doesn't seem to understand what a woman might want to see in a male romance option (or at least, what a guy playing a woman wants to see in a male romance option), aside from Alistair, who was indeed the "Xander option". There are no damaged, hesitant lovers here. There are no rough around the edges, surly, loner types. 80% of them spout pudding from every orifice the second you express any interest in them whatsoever, and the only ones who don't turn into hallmark cards are hideous aliens.
 

Moonlight Butterfly

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CGAdam said:
xXxJessicaxXx said:
Yeah becuase

1.disabled people can't have relationships? and 2. It's okay to risk killing Tali? /sarcasm.

riiight....
Tali just ends up sick. Joker would end up a bag shattered femurs (and pelvis, ribs, arms...).
So your saying someone with a disability can't have a relationship and that sex is the only reason you would be with someone basically?

And yes you could KILL Tali sorry but it's true. The fact that people think thats okay while a romance with Joker isn't is just totally lol.
 

drisky

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ABLb0y said:
Ashley (Mass Effect equivilant of Fred Phelps)
People keep blowing Ashley's xenophobia out of proportion. Remember the cause of human xenophobia is because the Tureins fucked up humans for touching a mass relay when we didn't even know what it was. It left a reasonably bad first impression. It basically equates people hating America for policing the world, mostly incidental then actively against them. Besides Grunt is more racist and no one complains about him.

OT: It is a matter of opinion. I happen to find Kaiden's romance a favorite of mine in all the mass effect games. I just happen to be in a minority. They just make the characters first I think, then make them available as romance options. You don't have to have a romance, people complain about them being tacked on. For my first play though of Dragon Age Origins I didn't do a romance because I felt the choices given didn't fit my characters tastes.
 

BloatedGuppy

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xXxJessicaxXx said:
And yes you could KILL Tali sorry but it's true. The fact that people think thats okay while a romance with Joker isn't is just totally lol.
Joker is already in a relationship with EDI.
 

JPArbiter

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Oct 14, 2010
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Ashley is a female Fred Phelps because she is overtly religious? where the hell did that come from?

Dragon Age 1 I really wanted to pursue a relationship with Sten, mostly cause as a character he seemed the most interesting. when I heard his reply to Morrigan "You would need armor... and a helmet... and something to bite on." that only made me more curious about the implications of a Qunari romance. Varric likewise was the most appealing male character in DA II

I hated Kaiden Alenko simply cause he is voice by Carth Onasi. not the actor who did Carth Onasi, but Carth Onasi himself. seriously did that voice actor even TRY to differentiate?

Jacob is dull, but that was because he is a creature of duty. he merely served to establish my Femshep as bisexual. Liara has been gracious about it. I am hoping I can arrainge a threesome in Mass Effect 3.