Building a badass Venusaur

[Mutie]

How's it going escapists? I'm starting this thread for a bit of poke-advice / general poke discussion as I have recently restarted my all time favorite (albeit shamefully incomplete) Leaf Green. The issue at hand is the fact that I can't build a good Venusaur due, once again, to the bloody HMs. I play pokemon hardcore, in that I refuse to every have in my party a pokemon that isn't going to stay there for the entire duration of the game, the current lineup being:

Ivysaur
Pidgeotto
Pikachu

With Cubone, Ghastly and Poliwhirl yet to come. Unfortunately, the only one of these pokemon that can learn Cut is Bulba, which SUUUUUUUUUUCKS. I was hoping to have Solar Beam, Sleep Powder, Razor Leaf and Leech Seed as my move set for my main, but Cut is taking up a precious space. So I was wondering, so I ditch Razor Leaf for Solar Beam? Or just keep Razor Leaf?

 

[Terminate421]

Solar Beam, while Sunny Day is a factor that allows immediate use of Solar Beam, Razor Leaf is an immediate attack which is far more useful for PvE.

Competitive Venusaur is pretty freakin' healthy if I say so myself.

 

[Mutie]

Snip

Well... after extensive research, I've come to the conclusion that there is no pokemon that I particularly want to use that can learn cut other than venusaur, which sucks (this happens to me literally every time I play pokemon and IT'S ALWAYS CUT THAT CAUSES THE GODDAMN PROBLEM).

How about this for a set up:
Venusaur: Cut, Leech Seed, Razor Leaf, Solar Beam
Partnered with a Pidgeot taught Sunny Day and a Haunter with Hypnosis (over Venusaur's sleep powder). This does, of course, make taking down my Rival's Charizard using only my Venusaur (there is no option here) a Hell of a lot more difficult, given that sleep powder is almost essential... But it is pretty much the only solution I can come up with that doesn't involve rebuilding my entire team.

 

[Souplex]

Step 1. Start a new game.
Step 2. Pick Squirtle as your starter.
If you don't follow these steps you're obviously doing it wrong.

 

[Link_to_Future]

I hate HMs. Most of them suck and aren't worth your time. Being required...blah...

The solution is sort of simple though. Just carry an HM slave who can do the majority of your ***** work (cut, flash, etc.) and then switch them for one of your actual team as soon as they are no longer needed for that situation.

It sucks but at least you aren't burdening your team.

 

[Mutie]

Step 1. Start a new game.
Step 2. Pick Squirtle as your starter.
If you don't follow these steps you're obviously doing it wrong.

I hate to be the Charmander unto thine Bulbasaur but no. I eat Squirtles. I cut them up with really sharp leaves and I eat them. I'm a huge Ninja Turtles fan, too.

Just carry an HM slave who can do the majority of your ***** work

Unfortunately this popular tactic goes against my in-game philosophy Though I recognize it's advantages, I can't bear to have a pokemon in my party that isn't A. permanent and B. In some way canonically useful. Thus, I choose to have the HMs spread out accross the party, thus making them feel more like a super team. I NEVER fight anyone other than the game (cause everyone else in the whole world ever just uses legendaries and Charizard because hipsters), so I'm no so bothered about most of em being crap, it's just the fact that Cut is the most awkward move ever. Why is it that neither Pidgeot, Raichu or Marowak can learn Cut!? AND ALMOST EVERY POKEMON CAN LEARN SUNNY DAY!?!?

 

[JustOrdinary]

Get yourself a bellsprout, teach it cut and flash. It can still carry the sleep-powder for helping out with capturing pokes, or possibly stun-spore if you prefer.

Alternatively, you could make it carry sunny day and solar beam (sunny day doubles its speed, so it'll almost always go first unless you're horrifically under-leveled).

I know, I know... two grass types, but hey, it does fix the HM slave problem somewhat.

 

[Link_to_Future]

Unfortunately this popular tactic goes against my in-game philosophy

And I'm assuming this philosophy is also why you must find a way for Venusaur to take out Charizard, yeah? I like your commitment to role-playing even if it isn't the most tactically sound thing to do.

How committed are you to your final lineup? I only ask because I notice a distinct lack of fire and that cut might be something a Vulpix or Growlithe could use.

Or maybe Scyther. I love Scyther.

 

[Shinsei-J]

If we're promoting the use of sunny day here I'd also highly suggest synthesis over leach seed for PvE.
So the move set I'd go with would be;

Spoiler: Bad Ass Venusaur

Cut
Giga Drain
Solar Beam
Synthesis

Now you'll never die, like ever, and you'll hit like a truck.

Spoiler: Bonus Pidgeot move set!

Sunny Day
Fly
Steel Wing
*Rain Dance/Mirror Move

Always first out then set up before swapping,
*Depends weather (bad pun is wonderful) you want a perfect accuracy Thunder for Pikachu/Raichu.

 

[Hero of Lime]

I really wish that Pokemon had a fifth HM slot. A slot that can't be used in battle, unless you want the attack, and that way you can teach a Pokemon cut even without concern. Until that amazing day comes, I would suggest getting a designated HM slave, I know you already have your dream team set up, and believe me I hate the dumb HM system for the same reason you do.

Sorry for the crazy tangent, I would say if you choose to keep your team the way you outlined, I would get rid of sleep powder and replace it with cut. If I recall, sleep powder has an unreliable accuracy rate, and having an immediate attack like razor leaf is important considering you also want to use solarbeam.

Hope my advice helps!

 

[rasputin0009]

Kingler, Nidoking/Nidoqueen, and Dragonite are your best HM slaves for Gen 1 Pokemon. And Pidgeot, while bad-ass looking,is really, really weak. Pikachu/Raichu is bested by Magneton and Jolteon for SP ATK, but it's got good ATK. I'm not sure on your Poliwhirl choice, though. There's so many better water Pokemon in Gen 1 with more lenient movesets.

My team right now in Fire Red is Raichu, Exeggcutor, Arcanine, Blastoise, Nidoking, and Dragonite. Just passed through Victory Road and am about to tackle the Elite Four. I had my Pidgey/Pidgeotto/Pidgeot, Pikachu/Raichu, Mankey/Primate, and Squirtle/Wartortle/Blastoise with me all the way from Viridian Forest until the Safari Zone. And that's when I dropped two of them like logs and replaced them with a Nidorino and a Dratini. I forget who I had with me that Exeggcute replaced, but I'm sure they weren't that special.

I also caught Moltres with like 5 Ultra Balls. Took forever since I kept reseting the game whenever I ran out of the 6 Ultra Balls in my bag. And I kinda want to try beating the Elite Four with the Pokemon I caught in Victory Road (Onix, Marowak, Arbok, and Machoke) just for shits and giggles. It's a really terrible team, though.

 

[Mutie]

Unfortunately this popular tactic goes against my in-game philosophy

And I'm assuming this philosophy is also why you must find a way for Venusaur to take out Charizard, yeah? I like your commitment to role-playing even if it isn't the most tactically sound thing to do.

How committed are you to your final lineup? I only ask because I notice a distinct lack of fire and that cut might be something a Vulpix or Growlithe could use.

Or maybe Scyther. I love Scyther.

Yeah, I'm a bit hardcore when it comes to Pokemon... Back when I was a kid I never lost a single match! These days however I avoid PvP battles. I find it usually just rock-paper-scissors for the first bout, then whoever is on top of the switching ration wins without fail. We busted out Stadium not so long back and man... I don't think a game has ever aged so badly. And trying to rebuild your team on that game using hired mons is very frustrating. That and the fact that everyone else instantly goes ARCTICUNOZAPDOSMOLTRESDRAGONITECHARIZARDSNORLAXIWINBYDEFAULT!!! It gets tiring. Unfortunately, I entertained the thought of a Vulpix / Flareon (even going as fare as to evolve the damn thing) but no... They cannot learn it. I never use fire anyway, 'tis the enemy's choice.

I know, I know... two grass types, but hey

Oddly enough, having two grass types is my favorite tactic in all the other gens, I just don't like any of the grass types from gen 1 other than Bulba (still the best ever) and Oddish etc.

If we're promoting the use of sunny day here I'd also highly suggest synthesis over leach seed for PvE.
So the move set I'd go with would be;

Spoiler: Bad Ass Venusaur

Cut
Giga Drain
Solar Beam
Synthesis

Now you'll never die, like ever, and you'll hit like a truck.

Spoiler: Bonus Pidgeot move set!

Sunny Day
Fly
Steel Wing
*Rain Dance/Mirror Move

Always first out then set up before swapping,
*Depends weather (bad pun is wonderful) you want a perfect accuracy Thunder for Pikachu/Raichu.

I'll likely keep that Pidgeot moveset as it seems pretty boss, albeit probably switching out the Rain Dance for something more offensive. I'm not a massive Pidgeot fan... But it seems like the only flying type you'd feasibly be able to fly around on. As for the Venusaur move set, I like to use leech seed to assist other team members also, usually dropping old Bud in to just fuck em up a little. I reckon I'm gonna keept cut all the way up to indigo plateau, then fly of to Fuschia and replace it with Solar Beam there, thus going in with Solar Beam, Sleep Powder, Razor Leaf and Leech Seed.