Bungie Explains (Internally) Controversial Halo: Reach Ending

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sh0tgunenclave

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Spartan-3's originate in the novel Ghosts of Onyx? And not enter service until the events of Halo 2? And have the shitty armor with no shields but a little camo?[/quote]

upon further review, you are correct.
Man, Reach kind of kicked the established cannon around the head, huh?
 

Sixties Spidey

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I'm glad they kept it. I cried like a child watching it. I was so close to actually finishing it till they all just ganged up on me.

I'm proud to be a fan of Halo and Bungie. Because there's no other series and no other developer that can make this work so well and so beautifully. :')
 

132635

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Delock said:
Look, if you're reading this, you more than likely have already recieved the spoiler warning from the original post (not to mention you entered a thread talking about an ending to a game) so I don't feel like I have to put this in the spoiler box, but I'll do it if people request it.

While I think it would have made more tactical sense for your character to try and escape or something, I find myself looking back on the ending and realizing that I wouldn't want to if I were Noble 6. I had just lost all my team, missed the last ship off (or so I was told) in order to allow it to escape, lost the battle for the last hope earth had, and due to the glassing, had no hope of surviving long term. I would have probably wanted to go out guns blazing just as he did. It's also an ending that stuck with me, as in that scene, right up until I was overwelmed, I was in control, keeping myself alive. Once I was removed, I could only really watch as Noble 6 fought on (he became a character at that point rather than my avatar, but he was a character based on the sum of my actions and how I interpreted the events, much like the Wanderer from SotC) helpless to stop what was happening. The entire time, I was hoping that he made it out, and just left his helmet behind, only to get an emotional blow by the end narration.

In a sense, I'd say his death scene made him my favorite character in the Halo universe, and the one I actually felt the most emotion about. It was a great way to end a series which until this game, was merely good rather than great. As such, I think the scene worked very well.

Magnalian said:
No complains here about the ending, that part was awesome, but Kat's death... c'mon, could you really not think of anything better to do with that?
I'm gonna get a lot of hate for this, but I thought it was actually appropriate. It was a scene that proved that even someone who had been on the most missions with you, and who had survived more than anyone else (look at her arm), and someone better than a lot of the cream of the crop could still be killed if they let down their guard on the battlefield. It was sudden, abrupt, and merciless in a cutscene that seemed to be just "Let's get ready for the next mission."

And I might as well hit the other deaths as well.

Jorge was a tragic one, a decision made by someone who wanted to save humanity, his home, and the woman he (probably) considered his mother. I know people have offered alternatives, but remember that they were on a timelimit for that mission, and went in with only what they had, and even that was their last resort. Then, not even a full minute passes after his death before his sacrifice was invalidated, which just added to the tragedy of the moment. Those of you who were angry with this scene, that was the point. You were supposed to ask why he had to sacrifice himself, and what it meant if it didn't do anything. Hell, that's the feeling the Battle of Reach was supposed to have.

Carter was that angered a lot of people, yet it's something the books loved. Watch the beginning of that mission again. He was going to die anyway from plasma burns, and it was a testement to his Spartan nature that he lasted that long. More than likely, he realized when the Scarab appeared that he was in his last moments and decided to make his death into something more than ANOTHER crashed pelican on Reach.

Jun's did piss me off, if only because it wasn't detailed in the game, but is almost definitely assured.

Emile's was my favorite. Here was a man pissed at the world after his entire family was killed twice (he was part of the A group that got slaughtered in the first few pages of Ghosts of Onyx, but was pulled off before it happened, if the Halo wiki is to be believed). He's pissed at Spartan II's for not training them better (hence his problems with Jorge), he's pissed with the Covenant for the war (hence why he steals from the dead), and he's just basically pissed at everything (which is why he carved a skull in his faceplate and uses close range weaponary so he can really be there when the enemy dies). And so, he dies pissed at the enemies who snuck up on him and killed him, and was so pissed, he refused to die without killing both of them (said scene involves him getting stabbed in the back, only to flip the attacker off him and stab them with a smaller knife).
I love your thinking. Emile had the best death, second only to carter, killing the scarab. but, flipping off a sword, pulling out your knife, and slamming it through an elites armored head is just ungodly
 

132635

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Bobzer77 said:
Suskie said:
Magnalian said:
No complains here about the ending, that part was awesome, but Kat's death... c'mon, could you really not think of anything better to do with that?
I disagree. Most of the Spartans went out in a blaze of glory, so it was nice to see a death that was sudden and without warning, which is probably more realistic anyway.
The only problem I had with that was shields.

Even if they had put them buzzing out and her dying from the same shot I would have accepted it but we didn't even get a shimmer.
v
she had her shield uncharged. its how she lost her arm
 

sabercrusader

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ffxfriek said:
Kalezian said:
it would of been better had a covenant ship started glassing the area instead of the waves of enemies.

the current ending is pretty bad in my opinion, sure the planets doomed, so why let us fight for an extra five minutes?
spartans never die thats why. They are always MIA. If you read the books (highly recommend their SOOOOO MUCH BETTER then the games themselves) they state that a few times.
John Funk said:
Bungie Explains (Internally) Controversial Halo: Reach Ending



The finale sequence in Halo: Reach [http://www.amazon.com/Halo-Reach-Xbox-360/dp/B002BSA20M/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=videogames&qid=1285186373&sr=8-1] is one of the most memorable parts of the game, but members of Bungie's dev team had to fight to put it in the game in the first place.

Okay, there's no easy way to say this, but - if it wasn't obvious enough from the headline and teaser - this news post will contain severe spoilers for the ending of Halo: Reach. In other words, if you read past the part marked "Spoilers," and you get spoiled, it's your own damn fault.

***SPOILER ALERT. SPOILER ALERT.***

One of the most surprisingly poignant moments (for me, anyway) in the entire Halo franchise was Noble Six's - that is, your own - last stand at the very end of Reach. After covering the launch of the Pillar of Autumn to set the events of Halo: Combat Evolved in motion, you are given a single objective: "Survive." It's ultimately impossible, as more and more Covenant swarm you on the now-desolate surface of a destroyed Reach, and Noble Six eventually goes down fighting.

When asked by UGO [http://www.ugo.com/games/halo-reach-bungie-talks-controversy-within-studio-over-games-ending] to explain the inspiration for the scene, creative director Marcus Lehto said that they ultimately saw the game as a "tragedy overall."

[blockquote]We wanted to tell the story of the Spartans sacrificing everything they had, and we thought it would be a cop-out if we didn't really bring it to a true ending with the Spartan that you create and that you fight with through the entire campaign and all the way to the very bitter end. If we didn't actually do the right thing to that character and bring them down with the planet ... After they had already succeeded in making sure that one thing that gave humanity any hope was actually saved, (we decided) they were going to go out all gung-ho and guns blazing.[/blockquote]

Still, said Lehto, it was hardly a unanimous decision within Bungie. "It was a crazy, controversial thing within our studio. We had a lot of people who were like, 'No, we shouldn't end it that way. We should allow the player to play on and, in their heads, keep living.' But we wanted to bring it to a close."

"[It] was one of the parts of the game that we wrestled with for months, and there were many different iterations with the ending," agreed executive producer Joe Tung. "There was a point where the ending didn't happen at all like it happened now. It was so important to us that the game ended well."

It was important, of course, because this wasn't just Bungie's farewell to Noble Six and the planet Reach - but to the studio's Halo franchise as a whole. It was important "from the perspective of Bungie saying goodbye to the entire universe," said Tung. "We spent so much time wrestling with how to end the game, and I think it ended up being such a great farewell, not just for the game, but for the entire involvement in the universe and a fitting farewell to Halo from Bungie."

"And there wasn't really anything we could do with the end, the demise, of Noble 6 because that leads into the events just prior to Halo 1," said Lehto. "It was a great way just to bring everything full circle for the franchise."

I certainly thought so, anyway.

(UGO [http://www.ugo.com/games/halo-reach-bungie-talks-controversy-within-studio-over-games-ending])

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Mr. Funk spartans never die!
hes right, i havent read any books except for contact harvest but i still know that, actually very few spartans actually go MIA.

OT:i liked the ending to reach and the cutscene at the end just showed how badass noble six could be, taking on exactly 7(heh heh i get the joke)zealot elites in a fight and killing 4 is nothing to take lightly.
 

sabercrusader

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sh0tgunenclave said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Spartan-3's originate in the novel Ghosts of Onyx? And not enter service until the events of Halo 2? And have the shitty armor with no shields but a little camo?
upon further review, you are correct.
Man, Reach kind of kicked the established cannon around the head, huh?[/quote]

not really since bungie is creator of Halo, that would make the games story seem canon to me but thats my opinion.
 

The Rookie Gamer

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sh0tgunenclave said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Spartan-3's originate in the novel Ghosts of Onyx? And not enter service until the events of Halo 2? And have the shitty armor with no shields but a little camo?
upon further review, you are correct.
Man, Reach kind of kicked the established cannon around the head, huh?[/quote]

Spartan 3s were around since 2531, 21 years before Halo CE.
 

internetzealot1

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On a conceptual level, the ending is great. But the execution is a little touchy. Most of the time in the level is just waiting for the enemies to actually start attacking you.

Also, there was no epic driving sequence at the end. WTF, Bungie?
 

Calvar Draveir

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Kalezian said:
it would of been better had a covenant ship started glassing the area instead of the waves of enemies.

the current ending is pretty bad in my opinion, sure the planets doomed, so why let us fight for an extra five minutes?
On legendary or heroic, more like 20-80 seconds. ; ) Anyway, the covenant can't glass the planet THAT fast, they have to fly around the entire world with their fleet. So I thought it was fitting.
 

Calvar Draveir

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sabercrusader said:
sh0tgunenclave said:
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't the Spartan-3's originate in the novel Ghosts of Onyx? And not enter service until the events of Halo 2? And have the shitty armor with no shields but a little camo?
upon further review, you are correct.
Man, Reach kind of kicked the established cannon around the head, huh?
not really since bungie is creator of Halo, that would make the games story seem canon to me but thats my opinion.[/quote]

Not OFFICIALLY enter service till then. Oni are sneaky little tramps. Also, Noble was given energy sheilds before any other spartans. They're a top secret strike force kinda deal. If you read halseys journal with the limited edition, you find that she never knew about the S 3 program when she met noble, and had no idea where they'd come from (excluding jorge).
 

SushiJaguar

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Magnalian said:
No complains here about the ending, that part was awesome, but Kat's death... c'mon, could you really not think of anything better to do with that?
This. I mean, come on. One single bullet, that I still think was suspiciously like a HUMAN sniper round.
 

SushiJaguar

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ChupathingyX said:
I might've actually cared about him dying if it weren't for the fact that the Spartans are one of the most bland and annoying group of characters in modern gaming.
One question about this sentence...why? Okay, they're not revolutionary awesomely told super-characters like say, Guybrush Threepwood or some such, but they aren't really bland.

They certainly have the potential not to be bland by any stretch of the word.
 

ultrachicken

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ChupathingyX said:
I might've actually cared about him dying if it weren't for the fact that the Spartans are one of the most bland and annoying group of characters in modern gaming. Seriously when they die for me its a good feeling cause that way you don't have to hear them anymore. Also Noble Six sacrificing himself meant Master Chief survives, making me hate him even more because he;s the reason we have to listen him.

OT: I thought the ending was pretty good. Really put me in Noble 6's shoes.
 

FBPH

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Eclectic Dreck said:
FBPH said:
Eclectic Dreck said:
Kat was, apparently, too damn stupid to turn on her freakin' shield as a single shot to the head from a needle rifle is no where near sufficient to punch through even on the hardest difficulty.
I seem to remember that right before she was shot, they were hit by a bit of the radiation blast the covenant fired at the city. Remember they were saying the covenant were all retreating en masse and the radiation burst was close? Wouldn't it be safe to say that the radiation jammed their shields? Or that the whole purpose of the radiation blast was a massive emp? I mean its documented fact that strong radiation has adverse effects on electrical equipment.

Well that was my theory. I would be pissed if it was all Kat's dumb fault she died. I'd like to give her the benefit of the doubt on this one.
The reason cited for her death was that Kat misjudged the gravity of the situation due to her lack of situational awareness and simply failed to activate her shielding system. Her lack of situational awareness is cited as the reason she lost her arm in the battle for some planet as seen in the "Deliver Hope" trailer.

The radiation blast itself was simply a sign that the covenant were glassing the area, thus why they were attempting to retreat to the safety of a bunker and why, as they leave said bunker, the city is in utter ruin.
Damn it!
 

ike42

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I liked the ending, but it felt too much like Red Dead Redemption, although not done as well.
 

De Ronneman

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I would've been angry if they left you alive. Story is: everyone, EVERYONE dies.(common, you remember original halo: everything is dead)

they, for some stupid reason decided to let you live, they would've broken the story.

Also, it is one of the most powerfull and immersive moments I've ever played...
(and it's in HALO of all games!)
 

Trivun

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Kalezian said:
it would of been better had a covenant ship started glassing the area instead of the waves of enemies.

the current ending is pretty bad in my opinion, sure the planets doomed, so why let us fight for an extra five minutes?
Well, as seen in the books (a major plot point in both First Strike and Ghosts Of Onyx), not all of Reach was glassed. There were Forerunner artefacts underneath Menachite Mountain, where CASTLE Base is located, and so while most of the planet was glassed a small area of several square kilometres was left untouched, though with plenty of ground troops (mainly Sangheili, Unggoy and Kig-Yar - that is, Elites, Grunts and Jackals) to clear up any survivors. So given where Noble Six is at the end of the game, and that it is (in canon) somewhat close to CASTLE Base and the mountain, having waves of enemies trying to kill him makes plenty of sense.

ANd as far as mood and atmosphere go, it really makes the overall sacrifice hit home, more than just watching the Covenant glass the place would do. Are you seriously telling me that you didn't like the fact that the game makes you experience first-hand the final moments of your character, and that you didn't feel for Noble Six as he goes down fighting?

Truly, such triumphs of storytelling are wasted on people like you. And we all wonder why people complain that Halo has no story (despite actually having one of the best stories in modern gaming at the moment)...
 

bojac6

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Rusty Bucket said:
Especially the level after the credits. That was absolutely masterful. you're alone for the first time in the game, surrounded by Covenant and just given the objective; 'Survive'. At first I was excited, preparing to make the fuckers pay, and pay hard. But after a few minutes I just lost the will for it. The team is dead, the planet is broken, I'm possibly the last remaining piece of resistance on the planet. The environment is covered in thick fog, and you can see countless Covenant moving within it, as well as dropships circling overhead. The cracks started appearing in my visor and I just thought 'what's the point?' It's not going to achieve anything, we've lost. So I just charged at the nearest Elite, took him down with a left hook and then gave in. It was absolutely fantastic, and yet so simple.
This. I kept going till I realized there was no reward, there was no escape and there was no point. For a game to actually create that feeling of hopelessness and despair, it was a powerful moment.
 

Alon Shechter

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The ending was utterly fantastic, the helmet effects were magnificent, a perfect ending for a tragic game with an ending WE ALL KNEW ALREADY.
 

bojac6

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ike42 said:
I liked the ending, but it felt too much like Red Dead Redemption, although not done as well.
Dude, spoiler tag that. People can reasonably be expecting Reach spoilers, but that's a completely different game. Just ruining a powerful ending like that is really mean.